Trouble with Yamaha TSR-7850

[Trebdp83]

You aren’t trying to actually bi wire here, just check if second set of amps work. Do not hook up to both sets of speaker terminals.

 

[Trebdp83]

I got nothin’ else if that didn’t work. Again, configuration should be 5.1 bi-amp. Since no sub is involved and None is selected, fronts will be locked at Large. Forgot that point and is why size selection was greyed out. Surround should be set at None and Height and Surround Back should be greyed out while in bi-amp mode.

Once configured, speakers wires on the receiver’s front terminals should be moved to EXTRA SP2 terminals. The other ends can be connected to either set of terminals on the speakers as long as jumpers are connected. The receiver will send an identical signal out of both sets of terminals so there should be sound from front speakers if EXTRA SP 2 amps and terminals are functioning properly.

I’d leave the speakers connected as is and reconfigure amps for 7.1(no sub) and see if a sound is output from speakers when set up as surround back speakers. Seems strange to have those two sets of amps go out while the rest seem fine.

 

[croseiv]

Could be bad/cracked solder joints inside the amp. Also, maybe a bad speaker wire connection may have finally shorted.

 

[Juice88]

I got nothin’ else if that didn’t work. Again, configuration should be 5.1 bi-amp. Since no sub is involved and None is selected, fronts will be locked at Large. Forgot that point and is why size selection was greyed out. Surround should be set at None and Height and Surround Back should be greyed out while in bi-amp mode.

Once configured, speakers wires on the receiver’s front terminals should be moved to EXTRA SP2 terminals. The other ends can be connected to either set of terminals on the speakers as long as jumpers are connected. The receiver will send an identical signal out of both sets of terminals so there should be sound from front speakers if EXTRA SP 2 amps and terminals are functioning properly.

I’d leave the speakers connected as is and reconfigure amps for 7.1(no sub) and see if a sound is output from speakers when set up as surround back speakers. Seems strange to have those two sets of amps go out while the rest seem fine.

I left the speakers as is, and selected 7.1. However, you'll see in the photos attached that Surround Back is greyed out to configure, but is automatically selected with the 7.1 assignment. When I run test tones, it only cycles through Surround L, Front L, Center, Front R, Surround R. Surround Back isn't shown... But Center is the only one with feedback, yet again.

 

[Trebdp83]

Those pics don’t look right. Pic #1 shows Zone 2 as Select Automatically, not Surround Back. Pic #2 shows Large Surround speakers up front. Check the Surround Layout setting. It should be set to Rear, not Front. If set to Front, Surround speakers are supposed to be placed up front and Surround Back will not be selectable at all. You want a configuration pic that looks like the one below, sans Sub and Presence speakers.

Remember, you are not concerned with the configuration matching your current setup. You just want to see if a signal is output from the Surround Back terminals when connected to your front speakers and configured to 7.1 since you claim no sound was output when configured to 5.1 bi-amp. Make sure Zone 2 is OFF. If it is ON, you will not get sound from the Surround Back terminals. Once configured correctly, play something using 7ch Stereo and see if the Front speakers produce any sound.

 

[Juice88]

Those pics don’t look right. Pic #1 shows Zone 2 as Select Automatically, not Surround Back. Pic #2 shows Large Surround speakers up front. Check the Surround Layout setting. It should be set to Rear, not Front. If set to Front, Surround speakers are supposed to be placed up front and Surround Back will not be selectable at all. You want a configuration pic that looks like the one below, sans Sub and Presence speakers.

View attachment 63338

Remember, you are not concerned with the configuration matching your current setup. You just want to see if a signal is output from the Surround Back terminals when connected to your front speakers and configured to 7.1 since you claim no sound was output when configured to 5.1 bi-amp. Make sure Zone 2 is OFF. If it is ON, you will not get sound from the Surround Back terminals. Once configured correctly, play something using 7ch Stereo and see if the Front speakers produce any sound.

OK! We are getting somewhere. My mistake on the first try with 7.1 config....I had Surround set to none, and therefore it greyed out Surround Back. I just went ahead and turned Surround to large/rear, which then illuminated Surround Back, and I chose large. The config wound up looking exactly like you proposed above. I ran test tones, and got feedback from Center, SBR and SBL.

 

[Trebdp83]

Ok, now switch back to 5.1 bi-amp and run test tones to see if you get anything. Don't change anything but the Power Amp Assign to 5.1 bi-amp.

 

[Juice88]

Ok, now switch back to 5.1 bi-amp and run test tones to see if you get anything. Don't change anything but the Power Amp Assign to 5.1 bi-amp.

No dice with 5.1 bi-amp. It cycles through FL, Center, FR, SR, SL and only Center produces sound. All I changed was the power amp assign.

 

[Trebdp83]

Well, that's no good. Don't change any amp settings and move the speaker wires to the surround terminals from the EXTRA SP 2 terminals and run tones. Anything from surround channels?

 

[Juice88]

Well, that's no good. Don't change any amp settings and move the speaker wires to the surround terminals from the EXTRA SP 2 terminals and run tones. Anything from surround channels?

Yes- SR, SL both have sound (along with center).

 

[Trebdp83]

Ok, so FL and FR signals are not making their way to the amps. We know the surround and surround back amps work and that they get signals. The Front Speaker amps are fixed to the Front Channels and cannot be reassigned so there is know way to know if those amps have failed or if no signal is actually being output to them. Since the EXTRA SP 2 terminals are functional but produce no sound when using bi-amp, I don't believe it is an amp issue but a signal processing issue isolated to the FL and FR channels. Using bi-amp just sends the same FL and FR signals to the Front terminals and the EXTRA SP 2 terminals when bi-amp is selected. As a last effort, try changing amp assign to Basic and switch the speaker wires from the surround terminals to the front terminals. Set the Front as Large, Center Small and Surrounds to None. Any tones to the front channels?

 

[Juice88]

Ok, so FL and FR signals are not making their way to the amps. We know the surround and surround back amps work and that they get signals. The Front Speaker amps are fixed to the Front Channels and cannot be reassigned so there is know way to know if those amps have failed or if no signal is actually being output to them. Since the EXTRA SP 2 terminals are functional but produce no sound when using bi-amp, I don't believe it is an amp issue but a signal processing issue isolated to the FL and FR channels. Using bi-amp just sends the same FL and FR signals to the Front terminals and the EXTRA SP 2 terminals when bi-amp is selected. As a last effort, try changing amp assign to Basic and switch the speaker wires from the surround terminals to the front terminals. Set the Front as Large, Center Small and Surrounds to None. Any tones to the front channels?

So basically back to the original config that I had when everything was working ~4 weeks prior. No good. In fact, Front is greyed out, which is interesting (shown below). It still places the Front speakers in the diagram, yet I cannot click into it to change the setting.



Another thing to note - when this AVR started acting up maybe 1 month ago, it was having difficulty powering on. Every once in a while it would turn on, but sometimes when shut off I could not get it to power back on, even into protection mode. So I'd wait 48 hrs unplugged, before trying again, at which point IF it worked, it would go into protection mode, and then I'd get back into it that way before resuming. However since FR and FL stopped working entirely, I seemingly can now power the AVR on/off every time without fail.

 

[Trebdp83]

When subwoofer is set to None, the Front will always be greyed out and locked at Large. Set subwoofer to Use and the Front Speakers should be adjustable from Large to Small. You might try setting subwoofer to Use and switch Fronts to Small just to see if anything clicks. But, based on the described past behavior, it seems the Fronts are now just gone.

Without the Front terminals working and bi-amp mode a bust as well, 7ch Stereo will be the only mode that sends the same sound to all of the speakers in this particular setup as long as the front speakers are connected to the surround or surround back terminals when configured for a Basic setup.

 

[Juice88]

When subwoofer is set to None, the Front will always be greyed out and locked at Large. Set subwoofer to Use and the Front Speakers should be adjustable from Large to Small. You might try setting subwoofer to Use and switch Fronts to Small just to see if anything clicks. But, based on the described past behavior, it seems the Fronts are now just gone.

Without the Front terminals working and bi-amp mode a bust as well, 7ch Stereo will be the only mode that sends the same sound to all of the speakers in this particular setup as long as the front speakers are connected to the surround or surround back terminals when configured for a Basic setup.

Ah, correct. I see it now, but it didn't change anything.

Thanks for all your help, this was exactly what I was hoping to find across my many forums/channels of posting. At least now I know the AVR is faulty and I can give up running in circles. I'll look to eventually replace it when I'm in a better situation, and use the 7 ch in the meantime. I did enjoy the MusicCast app for music, so maybe i'll try to stick with Yamaha. And no more refurbs for me!

 

[lovinthehd]

Makes me wonder if multiple factory/microprocessor resets in a row might be something to try, it is sometimes suggested short of factory service....

ps even if beyond warranty, might be something to contact Yamaha about, too....

 

[Juice88]

Makes me wonder if multiple factory/microprocessor resets in a row might be something to try, it is sometimes suggested short of factory service....

ps even if beyond warranty, might be something to contact Yamaha about, too....

Interesting...i've only factory reset it once, maybe twice now total. Would I just do that repeatedly?

Part of me thinks the first issue of turning the unit on, and it would go, or even fail to go into protection mode is what led to the Front channels blowing. I had to consistently try to press the combo of buttons to access protection mode, often times with no success for a day or two at a time until it then decided to click on. I'm sure its related somehow, but that's beyond me.

 

[lovinthehd]

Interesting...i've only factory reset it once, maybe twice now total. Would I just do that repeatedly?

Part of me thinks the first issue of turning the unit on, and it would go, or even fail to go into protection mode is what led to the Front channels blowing. I had to consistently try to press the combo of buttons to access protection mode, often times with no success for a day or two at a time until it then decided to click on. I'm sure its related somehow, but that's beyond me.

Yes, sometimes recommended to do at least 3 in a row with no other setup....how effective I don't know but believe an actual D&M reco at some point.

 

[croseiv]

Yes, sometimes recommended to do at least 3 in a row with no other setup....how effective I don't know but believe an actual D&M reco at some point.

Love those over-packed AVRs Who wants to do resets all night?

 

[lovinthehd]

Love those over-packed AVRs Who wants to do resets all night?

If you don't want to do them, just stay in the lower realms like simple analog.

 

[Juice88]

Yes, sometimes recommended to do at least 3 in a row with no other setup....how effective I don't know but believe an actual D&M reco at some point.

I reset 3 times back to back to back, but that did nothing (as expected)