Infinity reference series?

[urtoast84]

Saw someone mention this deal:
https://www.harmanaudio.com/loudspeakers/REFERENCE+RC263.html?cgid=loudspeakers&dwvar_REFERENCE RC263_color=Black-USA-Current#start=1
and said it was an amazing center, i almost Solely watch movies in my HT so i have been looking for a new center, only problem is i can not find anything ANYWHERE about this speaker. So i am turning to you gents again for advice

 

[shadyJ]

My guess is that you will not find a better center speaker at that price. I tested the older, lower end Infinity Primus 3-way center, and it still remains one of the better center speakers I have dealt with. This thing would only be better.

 

[urtoast84]

My guess is that you will not find a better center speaker at that price. I tested the older, lower end Infinity Primus 3-way center, and it still remains one of the better center speakers I have dealt with. This thing would only be better.

Thank you so much that’s i really needed to know, i hope it’ll fit in well with my onkoyo stuff lol

 

[zieglj01]

Thank you so much that’s i really needed to know, i hope it’ll fit in well with my onkoyo stuff lol

That center should make/cause you to upgrade your front L/R speakers

 

[Pogre]

That center should make/cause you to upgrade your front L/R speakers

And the Infinity Reference series is not a bad way to go at all either!

 

[urtoast84]

That center should make/cause you to upgrade your front L/R speakers

I have been looking at the SVS Ultras or the primes i havent quite decided. do you think im better off just waiting and getting the three matching SVS, or do you think this center would fit nicely with those as well? I'm looking to stay atmos and I know SVS has them, so i didnt really want to go for a different L/R speaker company.

 

[zieglj01]

I have been looking at the SVS Ultras or the primes i havent quite decided. do you think im better off just waiting and getting the three matching SVS, or do you think this center would fit nicely with those as well? I'm looking to stay atmos and I know SVS has them, so i didnt really want to go for a different L/R speaker company.

I would do the center and the R162 bookshelf, and if for some reason you do not like the bookshelf, then ship the bookshelf back for free -- you can still do Prime Elevation speakers with the Infinity Reference speakers ... your call

 

[Pogre]

I've not heard the Infinity Reference speakers, but am familiar with the brand and have been impressed with other offerings. The Ultras are hard to beat for sq at the $798/pr price point buying from their outlet. The deciding factor here is going to be price, because you definitely are paying for next step up with the Ultras.

 

[urtoast84]

I've not heard the Infinity Reference speakers, but am familiar with the brand and have been impressed with other offerings. The Ultras are hard to beat for sq at the $798/pr price point buying from their outlet. The deciding factor here is going to be price, because you definitely are paying for next step up with the Ultras.

interesting okay, maybe the infinity would be a better choice then, it would probably be a little while until i could afford the 800-$1000 for the ultras, i was hoping to get them from the outlet though. This center is just such a good Deal and i feel like and mine is mediocre at best, however i dont want to be stuck with underwhelming L/R after getting the center....decisions decisions.....

 

[zieglj01]

interesting okay, maybe the infinity would be a better choice then, it would probably be a little while until i could afford the 800-$1000 for the ultras, i was hoping to get them from the outlet though. This center is just such a good Deal and i feel like and mine is mediocre at best, however i dont want to be stuck with underwhelming L/R after getting the center....decisions decisions.....

Underwhelming would be the Onkyo L/R speakers

 

[Pogre]

interesting okay, maybe the infinity would be a better choice then, it would probably be a little while until i could afford the 800-$1000 for the ultras, i was hoping to get them from the outlet though. This center is just such a good Deal and i feel like and mine is mediocre at best, however i dont want to be stuck with underwhelming L/R after getting the center....decisions decisions.....

I really like the Infinity speakers I've heard (and have) so I don't think you'd be disappointed with the R162s at all. I believe the Ultras will have more bass, refinement and transparency but they'd better for the difference in price, lol. That's why I'm saying it's ultimately a price point choice. The Ultras are a sizeable chunk more, but you can hear and see where it goes. They're very nice. Nice enough for me to go all out and get the towers too.

I know @KEW loves his R162s and he's heard the Ultras too. He'd be a good one to weigh in on this actually...

 

[Pogre]

Underwhelming would be the Onkyo L/R speakers

That's a good point.

I wouldn't get just a center channel unless it matched my fronts or I was planning on getting the matching fronts, good deal or not. If that's your deciding factor I'd pass or get the 162s and not be mismatched.

 

[KEW]

I know @KEW loves his R162s and he's heard the Ultras too. He'd be a good one to weigh in on this actually...

The Ultra's are a better speaker than the Infinity R162, but we are talking $1000/pr (or $800/pr for B-stock) for the Ultras vs $162/pr for the R162 (when on sale). From a value standpoint, the R162 have an easy lead over the Ultras because they are still very good speakers. Let's just say there is a huge gap between your Onkyo's and the R162's and a smaller gap between the R162's and the SVS Ultras. However those relations are not reflected in their prices.
The problem with SVS is "it sucks to be selling a speaker at list price right now because there are so many good values for discounted speakers"!
If you are considering spending the money for the Ultras, I would say don't! I cannot recommend them at this point because of what Canton has done with trickle-down to certain models of their Chrono SL Series!
I would put this particular model of Bookshelf and Center up as better than the SVS Ultra series:
Bookshelf for $520/pr.

Accessories4less: High End Audio at Low End Prices!

www.accessories4less.com

Center for $400:

Accessories4less: High End Audio at Low End Prices!

www.accessories4less.com

So for $920, you are getting the mains plus center for about what the Ultra mains alone would cost and they are better speakers. However, Accessories4Less is reporting low inventory, so they could run out, but they also are likely to get the next year of stock in soon (it appears that A4L orders a couple of shipping containers of Canton speakers every year).
But let's recap:
1) Infinity R162 Mains plus RC263 for $324

Loudspeakers | Harman Audio

All the speakers you need for your home theater, under one roof. Floorstanding speakers, bookshelf speakers, in-wall, outdoor speakers, subwoofers, & more.

www.harmanaudio.com

2) Canton Chrono SL-536.2 mains plus SL-556.2 for $940
3) SVS Ultras for $1700 (or, if it fits, I would go for three bookshelf speakers and B-stock for your RCL, which would reduce the price to $1200)

4) Because you said this system is for HT only, I've got to mention the JBL Studio 5 Series which is also heavily discounted to $440 for the 530 mains and 520 center:

Sites-HA-US-Site

www.harmanaudio.com

These are a compression horn design that I find very engaging for HT (and Rock) because of an effect that seems to make sounds more immediate - it is a little more exciting when you are on the edge of your chair watching an action movie.

Since this is for HT only, I would save some money and go for the Infinity or the JBL Studio 5's! Either of these do a very fine job with voices and sound effects! It is when you are trying to get the sound of a trombone or a symphonic chime just right that the Ultra/Canton will show up as better speakers.
I find the Infinity has a slight edge for speech intelligibility and the JBL for excitement, but either will blow away your Onkyo speakers in every aspect of sound quality!
Please don't misinterpret my comment about the Infinity having slightly better speech intelligibility! The JBL are very good speakers and are not at all poor producers of speech! We are talking fine differences!

 

[urtoast84]

The Ultra's are a better speaker than the Infinity R162, but we are talking $1000/pr (or $800/pr for B-stock) for the Ultras vs $162/pr for the R162 (when on sale). From a value standpoint, the R162 have an easy lead over the Ultras because they are still very good speakers. Let's just say there is a huge gap between your Onkyo's and the R162's and a smaller gap between the R162's and the SVS Ultras. However those relations are not reflected in their prices.
The problem with SVS is "it sucks to be selling a speaker at list price right now because there are so many good values for discounted speakers"!
If you are considering spending the money for the Ultras, I would say don't! I cannot recommend them at this point because of what Canton has done with trickle-down to certain models of their Chrono SL Series!
I would put this particular model of Bookshelf and Center up as better than the SVS Ultra series:
Bookshelf for $520/pr.

Accessories4less: High End Audio at Low End Prices!

www.accessories4less.com

Center for $400:

Accessories4less: High End Audio at Low End Prices!

www.accessories4less.com

So for $920, you are getting the mains plus center for about what the Ultra mains alone would cost and they are better speakers. However, Accessories4Less is reporting low inventory, so they could run out, but they also are likely to get the next year of stock in soon (it appears that A4L orders a couple of shipping containers of Canton speakers every year).
But let's recap:
1) Infinity R162 Mains plus RC263 for $324

Loudspeakers | Harman Audio

All the speakers you need for your home theater, under one roof. Floorstanding speakers, bookshelf speakers, in-wall, outdoor speakers, subwoofers, & more.

www.harmanaudio.com

2) Canton Chrono SL-536.2 mains plus SL-556.2 for $940
3) SVS Ultras for $1700 (or, if it fits, I would go for three bookshelf speakers and B-stock for your RCL, which would reduce the price to $1200)

4) Because you said this system is for HT only, I've got to mention the JBL Studio 5 Series which is also heavily discounted to $440 for the 530 mains and 520 center:

Sites-HA-US-Site

www.harmanaudio.com

These are a compression horn design that I find very engaging for HT (and Rock) because of an effect that seems to make sounds more immediate - it is a little more exciting when you are on the edge of your chair watching an action movie.

Since this is for HT only, I would save some money and go for the Infinity or the JBL Studio 5's! Either of these do a very fine job with voices and sound effects! It is when you are trying to get the sound of a trombone or a symphonic chime just right that the Ultra/Canton will show up as better speakers.
I find the Infinity has a slight edge for speech intelligibility and the JBL for excitement, but either will blow away your Onkyo speakers in every aspect of sound quality!
Please don't misinterpret my comment about the Infinity having slightly better speech intelligibility! The JBL are very good speakers and are not at all poor producers of speech! We are talking fine differences!

Wow man i cannot thank you enough for your input, you answered every question I could’ve had, and some I didn’t even think of. I think i am definitely going to go the infinity route, then. Speech/HT is certainly most important to me as i rarely listen to music over this system anyway. The SVS was purely because they came so highly recommended plus they have the prime elevation speakers and i wanted to stay atmos and to stick with one brand where possible, but i believe it was @Pogre that said it wouldn’t be an issue to go with them anyway even if i got the infinity‘s for everything else. The SVS’s are a little out of my price range right now anyway, I would’ve had to wait a while with having a much better center. So it looks like the infinity is what I’m going to do, thank you so much again for all your help everyone!

So this is how I’m hoping to have it end up as of now:
AVR: Denon X3500H
L/R: Infinity R162s
Center: Infinity RC263
Surround: Infinity R162s
Sub: RSL Speedwoofer 10S
Height speakers: SVS Prime Elevations

 

[KEW]

So this is how I’m hoping to have it end up as of now:
AVR: Denon X3500H
L/R: Infinity R162s
Center: Infinity RC263
Surround: Infinity R162s
Sub: RSL Speedwoofer 10S
Height speakers: SVS Prime Elevations

That looks like a very nice system.
I assume you are choosing the Speedwoofer 10 because you are looking for a comparatively compact sub?
For HT, I tend to look for a sub that can rattle the windows. I think of the Speedwoofer as a great music choice, but not having the depth for HT. If you are in an apartment, the Speedwoofer may be the better choice, however, the Denon has a "Audysseey LFC (Low Frequency Containment)" adjustment specifically to adjust the amount of bass that might disturb a neighbor (or sleeping kid) during late viewing. The Speedwoofer seems to be a very good sub, but it is 10" and it would take an extremely expensive 10" driver to keep up with a good 12" driver. It really depends on what you are expecting to feel from the depth charges and dinosaur stomps!
If you are looking for a compact sub, the Speedwoofer is a great choice.

Don't get me wrong, it will do HT very well compared to many options, but right now I would spend the extra $100 to get the Outlaw Ultra X12 ($500 each):
https://www.outlawaudio.com/mofcart/cmny2019.html (you have to buy it via this link to see/get the discount)

I will also put a bug in your ear about the Infinity R12 sub. This is not a great sub! It is not in league with the Outlaw X12 or Speedwoofer. However, it is $144 and I think you could get $100 out of it on Craigslist in a year. At MSRP of $500, the Speedwoofer is a much better deal, but if you need to wait to save up for a good sub (they are expensive), this is one that is easy to live with (it is not a fart-box like some $150 subs), and will give you some sub HT capability while your wallet recuperates (or if you are waiting for the next Outlaw sale to come - Outlaw seems to be the only company with serious good subs that get serious discounts)!

Infinity REFERENCE SUB R12 | 12" 300 Watt Powered Subwoofer

Powerful Infinity REFERENCE SUB R12 300 watt powered subwoofer offers heart pounding deep bass, stylish robust design that goes well for any home theater setup.

www.harmanaudio.com

The Dayton Audio SUB1200 also qualifies for everything I said about the R12 sub. I have not heard them back to back, so cannot say which is better; but they both do a very fine job at ~$150 (the SUB1200 retails for that - it is just a great deal!). However, I think the $500 MSRP for the R12 would help resale value!

 

[Pogre]

Wow man i cannot thank you enough for your input, you answered every question I could’ve had, and some I didn’t even think of. I think i am definitely going to go the infinity route, then. Speech/HT is certainly most important to me as i rarely listen to music over this system anyway. The SVS was purely because they came so highly recommended plus they have the prime elevation speakers and i wanted to stay atmos and to stick with one brand where possible, but i believe it was @Pogre that said it wouldn’t be an issue to go with them anyway even if i got the infinity‘s for everything else. The SVS’s are a little out of my price range right now anyway, I would’ve had to wait a while with having a much better center. So it looks like the infinity is what I’m going to do, thank you so much again for all your help everyone!

So this is how I’m hoping to have it end up as of now:
AVR: Denon X3500H
L/R: Infinity R162s
Center: Infinity RC263
Surround: Infinity R162s
Sub: RSL Speedwoofer 10S
Height speakers: SVS Prime Elevations

That's why I pinged him. Kurt's awesome at breakdowns and listing different pros and cons.

I forgot all about the Cantons. They make me wish I were still putting a system together, lol.

 

[urtoast84]

That looks like a very nice system.
I assume you are choosing the Speedwoofer 10 because you are looking for a comparatively compact sub?
For HT, I tend to look for a sub that can rattle the windows. I think of the Speedwoofer as a great music choice, but not having the depth for HT. If you are in an apartment, the Speedwoofer may be the better choice, however, the Denon has a "Audysseey LFC (Low Frequency Containment)" adjustment specifically to adjust the amount of bass that might disturb a neighbor (or sleeping kid) during late viewing. The Speedwoofer seems to be a very good sub, but it is 10" and it would take an extremely expensive 10" driver to keep up with a good 12" driver. It really depends on what you are expecting to feel from the depth charges and dinosaur stomps!
If you are looking for a compact sub, the Speedwoofer is a great choice.

Don't get me wrong, it will do HT very well compared to many options, but right now I would spend the extra $100 to get the Outlaw Ultra X12 ($500 each):
https://www.outlawaudio.com/mofcart/cmny2019.html (you have to buy it via this link to see/get the discount)

I will also put a bug in your ear about the Infinity R12 sub. This is not a great sub! It is not in league with the Outlaw X12 or Speedwoofer. However, it is $144 and I think you could get $100 out of it on Craigslist in a year. At MSRP of $500, the Speedwoofer is a much better deal, but if you need to wait to save up for a good sub (they are expensive), this is one that is easy to live with (it is not a fart-box like some $150 subs), and will give you some sub HT capability while your wallet recuperates (or if you are waiting for the next Outlaw sale to come - Outlaw seems to be the only company with serious good subs that get serious discounts)!

Infinity REFERENCE SUB R12 | 12" 300 Watt Powered Subwoofer

Powerful Infinity REFERENCE SUB R12 300 watt powered subwoofer offers heart pounding deep bass, stylish robust design that goes well for any home theater setup.

www.harmanaudio.com

The Dayton Audio SUB1200 also qualifies for everything I said about the R12 sub. I have not heard them back to back, so cannot say which is better; but they both do a very fine job at ~$150 (the SUB1200 retails for that - it is just a great deal!). However, I think the $500 MSRP for the R12 would help resale value!

Wow man thank you again! I saw the speedwoofer review on here actually and it just seemed impressive, but if you think I’d be better served in the HT department by something else than I’m happy to take your word for it, I haven’t much experience listening to or using different kinds of subs, what did you mean by the drivers needing to be expensive? Sorry it’s been a while! Busy with work!

 

[urtoast84]

That's why I pinged him. Kurt's awesome at breakdowns and listing different pros and cons.

I forgot all about the Cantons. They make me wish I were still putting a system together, lol.

Haha it’s certainly got its pros and cons, I can imagine myself getting restless quickly as well!

 

[KEW]

what did you mean by the drivers needing to be expensive? Sorry it’s been a while! Busy with work!

For a 10" driver to perform like a 12", it has to travel roughly 25% farther to displace the same amount of air as the 12" in the same time. It is expensive to make a motor structure that supports extreme displacement! So what I was getting at is your are generally going to save money buying a 12" sub rather than a 10" sub that can actually match it.
I thought about saying that a 10" simply can't keep up with a 12", ... that is technically incorrect, but it has to be one heck of a 10" driver!
Generally 12" is the minimum size that people here would recommend for a sub.

 

[urtoast84]

For a 10" driver to perform like a 12", it has to travel roughly 25% farther to displace the same amount of air as the 12" in the same time. It is expensive to make a motor structure that supports extreme displacement! So what I was getting at is your are generally going to save money buying a 12" sub rather than a 10" sub that can actually match it.
I thought about saying that a 10" simply can't keep up with a 12", ... that is technically incorrect, but it has to be one heck of a 10" driver!
Generally 12" is the minimum size that people here would recommend for a sub.

Ahh okay I see what your saying now, I was was misunderstanding what you meant by driver. So realistically, the bigger the sub driver the easier air is to displace so then easier on the sub? I’m assuming there would quickly be diminishing returns though? That’s very interesting! I have minimal experience with hearing multiple setups using multiple brands, and my local big box store doesn’t have Much in the way of demo speakers that aren’t Bose or klipsch, or some kind of sound bar so thank you so much for the help with figuring out what’s best for me!

The x-12 looks great, I will probably end up going that route!