Option of Tinning Copper Wire or Using Silver Solder

[Verdinut]

There is obviously an advantage in tinning copper wires to prevent the metal from being tarnished. Copper oxide is a poor electric conductor.

IMO, we should always either tin the bare ends of wires to be connected for both low signal level and speaker connections, or use silver solder as another option.


However, silver is definitely a better conductor than tin. Although it oxidizes more easily than tin, silver oxide is as conductive as non oxidized silver.


I have no connection whatsoever with the company, but of note is the fact that Neutrik, the manufacturer of excellent connectors, uses silver for the contacts on all of its XLR and SpeakON connectors, except for the ones with gold contacts.


Here is an interesting article on tinned copper and skin effect of a signal:

http://www.belden.com/blog/broadcastav/in-defense-of-tinned-copper.cfm

 

[mtrycrafts]

Its informative but why should we worry about this in most applications in audio?

 

[Verdinut]

Its informative but why should we worry about this in most applications in audio?

A lot of audiophiles connect their speaker cables to banana plugs or direct to the loudspeaker terminals without applying solder to their ends. Copper oxidizes easily and, as you know, copper oxide is not a good conductor and eventually, IMO, could impair the quality and the definition of the sound being reproduced.

Another advantage of soldering the wire ends is that it can prevent stray strands to cause short circuits between the speaker terminals and damage an amplifier.

 

[Irvrobinson]

A lot of audiophiles connect their speaker cables to banana plugs or direct to the loudspeaker terminals without applying solder to their ends. Copper oxidizes easily and, as you know, copper oxide is not a good conductor and eventually, IMO, will impair the quality and the definition of the sound being reproduced.

Nonsense. The contact points between the terminations and the wire are air-tight. So long as you start with clean copper - and all that takes is snipping off the last 1/4" of the wire to get a clean end - and strip the insulation, you're almost certainly starting with clean-enough copper. This whole copper oxide story is BS.

 

[MrBoat]

I might would tin my wire if I lived near the ocean with windows open a lot. The stranded wire we use for marine electronics is tinned throughout. I recently replaced old speaker wire I had that was tarnished completely, regardless of how far it was stripped back. Tarnished stranded can lose some of it's effectiveness as a collective, single conductor due to corrosion.

ETA: My old speaker wires were over 30 yrs old. Other than that, I was told never to tin wire for threaded connections. Not sure why.

 

[Alex2507]

I was told never to tin wire for threaded connections. Not sure why.

Something to do with solder 'flowing' under the pressure of a set screw, thereby the connection loosens over time ... IIRC.

 

[Speedskater]

One should NOT solder-tin stranded wire ends that will be used with screw connections/terminals. Why? because with time and temperature changes the solder will cold-flow and allow the connector to loosen.

I first saw an example of this back in 1965 when I started working at the broadcast radio station. The new FM transmitter and failure at a power supply screw terminal connector.

Also if the wire is subject to vibration or flex, it can fail at the ard spot at the end of the solder-tin.

* * * * * * * * * * * * * *
I see the Alex wrote the same reply.

 

[Verdinut]

What about just checking the screw terminals once in a while and that should avoid any problems.

 

[Irvrobinson]

What about just checking the screw terminals once in a while and that should avoid any problems.

That would probably work, whatever once-in-a-while means. The problem is that copper is so soft that it deforms with the pressure of the termination, producing a more complete and air-tight contact surface. Solder is much harder and doesn't easily deform. Bare copper is what you want, or a spade or banana plug termination.

 

[Speedskater]

There is a work around.
Solder-tin a short length of the wire end. Then strip the insulation back so that bare wire is under the screw.

 

[MrBoat]

If you notice an issue, or have nothing better to do, just check the connections. People should be more concerned with the battery terminals in their cars, which is possibly the most neglected, corrosive connection in the world. I wonder why people don't buy $100/ft wire for those. People claim to be able to hear an audible difference with their speakers and such, yet can't hear that their turn signals are clicking a little slower than they should be.

 

[highfigh]

ONLY trim the ends of speaker wire when cymbals sound like maracas.

 

[mtrycrafts]

......yet can't hear that their turn signals are clicking a little slower than they should be.

Is that a battery connection issue or something else. Why wouldn't the alternator take care of full voltage to the turn signal circuit?
I would buy a slower starter turnover more than turn signal speed.

 

[MuchoReverbo]

IMO, we should always either tin the bare ends of wires to be connected for both low signal level and speaker connections, or use silver solder as another option.

Silver is a slightly-better conductor than copper but whether that equates to any type of audible improvement in sound quality is debatable depending on who you talk to.

You have to remember though that when someone says they are "tinning" a wire they are using the term as a verb or adverb rather than a noun or pronoun. You can "tin" a wire with silver solder. The term "tinning" when used as you are using it simply means coating the wire with solder. Any kind of solder.

The most-commonly used solder in electronics is 60/40 (aka SN60) which is 60% tin and 40% lead so when you "tin" a wire with SN60 you are actually coating it with a tin/lead alloy.

When clamping bare copper wire for speaker cables I usually do not "tin" them but rather clamp right onto the bare copper cable. The same goes when crimping a connector onto copper wire. However, I do like to flow solder over the crimped connection afterwards to increase the mechanical strength and at the same time seal the connection from corrosion (provided you clean off all the flux afterwards).

 

[Verdinut]

Cold flow of soldered connection is impossible at normal home temperature. Period!

 

[MrBoat]

Is that a battery connection issue or something else. Why wouldn't the alternator take care of full voltage to the turn signal circuit?
I would buy a slower starter turnover more than turn signal speed.

If the battery is showing a low voltage/current condition, what is the voltage regulator going to try to do and how long is it going to take to top off the battery? These days, with everything matched to such exacting values, squeezing every ounce of mileage out of engines with regard to the loads placed upon them, I doubt there is much extra. I notice my turn signals clicking faster along with the starter every time I put a new battery and terminals. Especially if AC is on and everything else.

 

[Speedskater]

Cold flow of soldered connection is impossible at normal home temperature. Period!

Cold flow is not about high temperature, it can happen in below freezing temperatures. It's about contact pressure. However temperature changes can cause expansion and contraction of the metal connector parts which causes changes in contact pressure.

 

[Speedskater]

The industrial solution for finely stranded wire is ferrules.

http://www.ferrulesdirect.com/electrical/WIRE_FERRULES.htm

 

[Verdinut]

Cold flow is not about high temperature, it can happen in below freezing temperatures. It's about contact pressure. However temperature changes can cause expansion and contraction of the metal connector parts which causes changes in contact pressure.

The situation would appear to be similar whether the wire end is tinned or not. So, what is all that fuss about cold flow of solder joint then?

 

[j_garcia]

I have never found any benefit to tinning wire ends beyond keeping the wire strands together. There is zero audio benefit. Unless you are in a moist environment, oxidation isn't a huge concern either and if it is, tinning won't fully prevent it on speaker wire IMO. With the exception of a few PVC jacketed cables (chemicals in the PVC itself can cause tarnishing), I've never had speaker wire tarnish unless it was outside.