Please help. I want to enjoy music again.

[scottter140]

Well, Ive finally realized that music sucks.... I mean the way I've been listening to it does. I'm 30 years old and years ago I threw out my CD collection because it was a mess of scratched and poorly burned CDs and everything is either on my itunes or online anyway right? But now I realize that streaming music sucks and a lot of my itunes library is from copies of copies of CDs I burned at poor quality back when I didn't know any better.

It used to be so simple. I used to carry around a CD player and headphones and that was the best way to listen to music... I didn't have any fancy headphones. Now, anything I listen to on my phone or laptop or even ipod sounds like crap... Its such a sad state of affairs.

Also, I've notice that everything has a lower volume than it used to. I remember people in high school used carry around a Discman with the headphones around their neck and put it on full blast when they wanted to shows their friends a song and it was LOUD... Not saying that's the wisest thing to do but just noticing that nothing seems to produce volume like it used to and that bugs me.

So what am I getting at here...? I guess I'm just looking for some advise. Where to go from here? Is it true that if I buy an album on itunes it will never be the same quality as if I bought a legit CD? Do I need to start rebuying all the albums I want to listen to on amazon and used CD stores? Headphones... Whenever I try to start looking for headphones I just get exhausted and want to cry and take a nap. I don't want to spend 100's of dollars on headphones. I really don't think I should have to... I don't want anything wireless, with a microphone, bluetooth, ect. just something that plays music properly... I think something weird happened with headphones, like maybe there was a law passed that they couldn't go past a certain db? Therefore, I consider trying to get a deal on some vintage headphones. Good idea?

 

[shadyJ]

Since people switched to ear buds, and since more headphones went to closed off designs, you have probably just been hearing less sound emitted from people's head gear. People certainly haven't started listening to music at safe loudness levels, that is for sure.

You don't need to spend a fortune to get a reasonably good sound. I would be looking at some Sennheiser or maybe JBL headphones in whatever budget range you can swing. I would be looking to spend at least $100 though. You might look at the Sennheiser HD380 Pros for a solid headphone. There are lots of good brands though.

You can buy very high resolution sound files at itunes. I don't think they would even sell low bitrate MP3s anymore. I don't buy from itunes, but my guess is everything they sell at itunes now is near CD quality or high bitrate MP3s. The sound quality will be very good.

 

[Mark of Cenla]

To get the best bang for the buck with headphones, go to a musical instrument store and check out headphones for home studios. Most of those are not overpriced. I really like Audio Technica headphones. I bought a pair for my 23 year old son last October for his birthday, and he really likes them too. Peace and goodwill.

 

[lovinthehd]

The analog section of my phone is definitely limited, and even warns you when you try to go above 70% (their term). I prefer to stream from it. I stored most music on my phone mostly in 256 kbps or 320 kbps MP3 format depending on when and how I created those from my main computer drives, but have bits and pieces of AAC stuff from when I used Apple, both 128 kbps and 256 kbps. For reasons of storage and the quality acceptable when mobile (at home I use my phone to stream the FLAC files to my receivers).

I think iTunes still uses 256 kbps AAC for music download, for a long while before that was 128 kbps. There's better out there, I stopped using iTunes long ago but I don't use Apple devices of any sort either.

Amazon offers 320 kbps MP3 downloads. You can get cd quality (1411 kbps) or even some hi-res files at a few places like hdtracks.com.

Most of my music is from my cd collection stored on my hard drives as FLAC files and becomes both an archive/backup copy after I store it as a FLAC file as well as a source of streaming on my wi-fi network at home (OP-FLAC is a free lossless compression routine that's pretty widely used, CD quality but in a smaller file; apple's equivalent was ALAC which I found very limiting in terms of use; a WAV or AIFF file is the uncompressed lossless file).

One place that you might check for headphone deals is massdrop.com, they usually have something going on in the way of headphones. Sennheiser, AKG, HiFiMan are some brands I see good comments on for headphones (I very rarely use my own older pair of Denon AH-D210s).

You might find this article interesting when looking for a good match between a player and the headphones. http://nwavguy.blogspot.com/2011/02/headphone-impedance-explained.html

 

[Bucknekked]

So what am I getting at here...? I guess I'm just looking for some advise. Where to go from here? Is it true that if I buy an album on itunes it will never be the same quality as if I bought a legit CD? Do I need to start rebuying all the albums I want to listen to on amazon and used CD stores?

Advice, something humans are remarkably impervious to. Here goes anyway. As far as the headphones go, I think the other replies make excellent recommendations. Sennheiser is consistently good and they have a lot of choices to meet personal preferences. Start there and see what you find. I have several pair. Headphones today can be excellent. Not just good, but excellent if you choose well. Vintage = old.

Do you need to rebuy your music? That depends entirely on your personal listening habits. If you think streaming services suck (many do) perhaps you need to just switch services. Tidal has top quality tracks and allows you to keep listening as you do now, just with better quality tracks. If you still wish to make purchases, I would then do hi bitrate downloads in your favorite format. Itunes gets a lot of grief, but they offer 256k and 320k downloads now. Amazon does the same. Places like HDtracks offer the highest bit rates you can buy.

If I were to offer advice on building or rebuilding a music library, I would not recommend buying downloads however. Long discussion there, but if you're going to buy and invest, I would recommend CD's / rips.

Still not satisfied? Make a couple of trips to a used CD store and stock up on your favorite music on CDs.
Invest a little time and skill in learning tools like XLD, Exact Audio Copy, and others and rip your music in to lossless and uncompressed files like lovinthehd recommended. Used CD's where I live cost about $2.99 each. Some are in big bins for $1 each. You can build a library of files that's as good as any source out there for just the price of used CD's and some of your time. Used CD's at my local store have been 100% flawless in ripping. Not one CD out of over 50 have had an error the ripper couldn't recover from.

There you have it. Free advice. I have actually done all the stuff I talked about here myself so I can vouch for the fact it works, and sounds great.

 

[MrBoat]

I think it is essential to have a robust, open air, in home system as well as headphones. Why? Because you can get your fix better with great speakers and nothing clamped on your head. This helps to scratch part of that itch, first and foremost. That way, headphones and such are only filling the in between times. I can't imagine having to musically live solely on headphones alone.

 

[shadyJ]

I think it is essential to have a robust, open air, in home system as well as headphones. Why? Because you can get your fix better with great speakers and nothing clamped on your head. This helps to scratch part of that itch, first and foremost. That way, headphones and such are only filling the in between times. I can't imagine having to musically live solely on headphones alone.

It doesn't sound like he has the budget for a serious speaker setup. Headphones are a great way to get a good sound for cheap, although I do prefer a real speaker system.

 

[MrBoat]

It doesn't sound like he has the budget for a serious speaker setup. Headphones are a great way to get a good sound for cheap, although I do prefer a real speaker system.

Perhaps. Although, I put together a pretty righteous in home system for 75 bucks initially. Used stuff yes, but really good used stuff.

I just gifted my son my rack system from the 80's because he was listening to one of those crappy Bluetooth speakers. I had just rebuilt the drivers in the old system too. Something had to be done to get him to aim higher. And while many of the new age audiophiles may scoff at that old equipment, it's 100:1 better than anything he would have ever budgeted towards, obviously. I bet that nails-on-chalkboard speaker loses some of it's appeal now, and I won't be subjected to it anymore.

 

[Bucknekked]

I just gifted my son my rack system from the 80's because he was listening to one of those crappy Bluetooth speakers. I had just rebuilt the drivers in the old system too. Something had to be done to get him to aim higher. And while many of the new age audiophiles may scoff at that old equipment, it's 100:1 better than anything he would have ever budgeted towards, obviously. I bet that nails-on-chalkboard speaker loses some of it's appeal now, and I won't be subjected to it anymore.

MrBoat
Somebody asked me if they could buy my Klipsch speakers after I install my new Salk Songtowers. I said probably not because I have a large family (5 adult kids, 21 grandkids) and anything I put on the shelf after an upgrade always finds its way in to one of their homes as a upgrade to what they're running. Its one way to keep the hobby alive: bestow your old equipment on that rising generation that thinks tin can bluetooth speakers are a great source for audio. I agree wholeheartedly : upgrade your kids stuff

 

[-Jim-]

Scotter,

I agree with most of the above, but especially what Bucknekked said about going back to CDs and getting used ones to help with the Budget. However, I suggest you rip them all to FLAC files. It's a lossless public domain file format that 100% reproduces what's on the CD. Ripping to multiple formats makes no sense, so at least pick one lossless type, and move forward with it. (Just don't throw out your CDs after ripping. Keep them for insurance against file loss.)

In regards to headphones, first determine how much you want to spend, and then what type. In the Ear, One the Ear, or Over the Ear. Some folks can't handle in the ear Bud type unless they are customer fitted (expensive), while other think the latter to are too heavy, and can make their ears sore if worn for long periods. (Some even say near their ears sweat with these types as well.) I've had (have) various types of all 3 over time, and like most audio equipment, proportionately the more you spend gives ever smaller increases in performance.

We haven't talked about how to get the sound from the File to the Headphones. Are you looking for portability or stationary at home?

As far as loudness, I'm concerned that you could be one of those folks who loved to listen at Arena Rock Levels 24/7 in your youth (AC/DC anyone?), and possibly damaged your hearing? I hope not, but maybe it's worth checking out before you spend anything and get frustrated with the results.

I hope this is helpful.

 

[highfigh]

Well, Ive finally realized that music sucks.... I mean the way I've been listening to it does. I'm 30 years old and years ago I threw out my CD collection because it was a mess of scratched and poorly burned CDs and everything is either on my itunes or online anyway right? But now I realize that streaming music sucks and a lot of my itunes library is from copies of copies of CDs I burned at poor quality back when I didn't know any better.

It used to be so simple. I used to carry around a CD player and headphones and that was the best way to listen to music... I didn't have any fancy headphones. Now, anything I listen to on my phone or laptop or even ipod sounds like crap... Its such a sad state of affairs.

Also, I've notice that everything has a lower volume than it used to. I remember people in high school used carry around a Discman with the headphones around their neck and put it on full blast when they wanted to shows their friends a song and it was LOUD... Not saying that's the wisest thing to do but just noticing that nothing seems to produce volume like it used to and that bugs me.

So what am I getting at here...? I guess I'm just looking for some advise. Where to go from here? Is it true that if I buy an album on itunes it will never be the same quality as if I bought a legit CD? Do I need to start rebuying all the albums I want to listen to on amazon and used CD stores? Headphones... Whenever I try to start looking for headphones I just get exhausted and want to cry and take a nap. I don't want to spend 100's of dollars on headphones. I really don't think I should have to... I don't want anything wireless, with a microphone, bluetooth, ect. just something that plays music properly... I think something weird happened with headphones, like maybe there was a law passed that they couldn't go past a certain db? Therefore, I consider trying to get a deal on some vintage headphones. Good idea?

One thing to remember about burned CDs, downloaded files and streaming- just like other data, and this IS data, crap in=crap out. If it's a third generation copy of a CD that's badly scratched at low resolution, it's likely that the error correction was working overtime and if the 2nd copy is also low res and was made while the error correction was working overtime, the 3rd gen copy, made at low res doesn't bear much resemblance to the original.

This would be easier if price hadn't trumped brick & mortar stores- you would be able to listen and compare equipment locally, rather than needing to go online and ask.

Start small- buy a few used CDs and compare them to one of the remaining discs from your collection- if it sounds better, it might be a good idea to replace the burned/worst sounding ones with the real thing.

Not all streaming is equal- are you trying to have the best portable sound or when you're at some destination? While a portable system can work at home, headphones or ear buds are a bit anti-social when others are around, IMO.

WRT volume level- anything that isolates your ears from the outside and produces a loud sound WILL damage your hearing. The Koss Corp used to ship their headphones with a piece of paper that detailed this and stated the time limit for exposure to sounds that exceed 95dB. I would recommend looking for something that sounds good at lower levels if you want to hear people talking in 30 years. If you hear buzzing when you're in a quiet place, have your hearing checked- it has already been damaged and at this point, it's not recoverable. I have seen headlines for cures, but I'm skeptical.

 

[XEagleDriver]

. . . People certainly haven't started listening to music at safe loudness levels, that is for sure . . .

Did you say "people fart music at Safeway stores" . . . what was that . . . please repeat . . . huh . . . say again.

 

[shadyJ]

Did you say "people fart music at Safeway stores" . . . what was that . . . please repeat . . . huh . . . say again.

Isn't it a little early in the day to start drinking?

 

[lovinthehd]

Forgot to add that I supplement my CD collection with use of streaming services.

Pandora may be relatively low bit rate but the price is right (I use the free version), load up enough radio stations with what you know you like and it's pretty good at introducing you to new music to enjoy.

I added Spotify so I could play specific albums and artists at will (from ideas from Pandora or other sources) and find for $10 a month it's probably going to save me from buying CDs I might have taken a chance on based on one or two numbers which doesn't always work out Bit rate on Spotify is pretty good depending on app/settings (up to 320 IIRC).

 

[highfigh]

Isn't it a little early in the day to start drinking?

Not if he didn't stop the night before.

 

[highfigh]

Forgot to add that I supplement my CD collection with use of streaming services.

Pandora may be relatively low bit rate but the price is right (I use the free version), load up enough radio stations with what you know you like and it's pretty good at introducing you to new music to enjoy.

I added Spotify so I could play specific albums and artists at will (from ideas from Pandora or other sources) and find for $10 a month it's probably going to save me from buying CDs I might have taken a chance on based on one or two numbers which doesn't always work out Bit rate on Spotify is pretty good depending on app/settings (up to 320 IIRC).

I don't use headphones often and the only times I use ear buds is if I'm cutting the grass, using my snowblower or listening for a problem in an audio system, so the ultimate sound quality isn't as important, but I have always found that the sound from Pandora is tolerable enough. I did start paying for Pandora One last year and it does sound better, but I have several ways to listen to music, anyway.

I'm not going to pay for redundant music, so one service works, for me but I did the Tidal trial period and it was good, but expensive- it adds up very quickly.

What headphones/ear buds/speakers do you use and what is the storage device?

What software was used for recording the music? The level can be set/changed in the software and in iTunes, it has the ability to match levels, which causes most music to have the same limits and level without you needing to monitor this for every disc or file. Then, there's the ability to limit dynamic range. One thing about digital audio- exceeding 0VU CAN'T be allowed because it sounds like absolute crap and they didn't write any code for the level reaching that range. The amplifier in a handheld device isn't always good and the level/dynamics can be affected in that, too.

Are you looking for louder, or better?

 

[scottter140]

Wow so many responses! Thanks!


So today I went out a bought some CD's at a used CD store and listened to a couple in the car and it was by far the best listening experience I've had in a long time. Then I went to target and bought THE Discman that they had and when I got it home and tried it with my AKG K52 headphones it really didn't sound so great. Tried my earbuds that came with my S7 and , as expected, not very good either.

What headphones/ear buds/speakers do you use and what is the storage device?

What software was used for recording the music?

Are you looking for louder, or better?

I have a the headphones I mentioned above and then a makeshift 6 or 7 (I have the center speaker turned off) speaker setup in the unfinished basement where I have my guitars and random stuff. It consists of 5 panasonic speakers I got for free from someone who had a DVD home theater in a box system that the DVD player broke and two 1970s panasonic speakers; These:

.They all are connected to a newer Sony receiver that my roommate wasn't using. Its pretty wacky and doesn't sound very good. Maybe if I had a subwoofer and used either the old speaker or the other speaker set it would be better. Or maybe its all just junk.

In another room we (they really belong to my roommate) have a Sonos system. Two play:3s and the sub. They are kind of new to the house and sort of what propted me to start investigating my this subject.

Another room has the home theater setup. it's a 5.1 Definitive set of bookshelf speakers.

And in my bedroom I have a crappy Vizio sound bar subwoofer combo. Its not bad for TV and stuff but totally lousy for music listening.

The next thing I'm going to do is get some good headphones. I think theres enough speakers in this house, haha. I'd rather the headphone because then I can move around the house and go outside and stuff and I don't have to worry about bothering my 2 roommates.

After that, I'll tackle my itunes. I should clarify that I know now that you can rip CDs at high quality, but when I added most of what's on there I didn't know any better. I'm turning 30 this week and a lot of it comes from when I was a teen or early 20s. Probably some Napster and Limewire content on there too. I used to always be making CDs and then I would loose or scratch then and the whole thing was a mess.

I use pandora, spotify(paid), I watch a lot of youtube. Part of it is I miss putting on a CD and actually listening to a whole album.

There, I think I addressed everyones questions, did I not?

 

[VMAT4]

I'd like to offer some advice/guidance on headphones. Sounds to me like you are not in the market for anything that requires a headphone amp either portable or desktop. But, you want "really good".
Here are three options, each under $200:
1) the Shure SE 215 in ear monitors
2) the Audio-Technica ATH M50x closed back over ear headphones
& 3) the Audio-Technica ATH AD900x open back over ear headphones .

I own a pair of the Shure SE 215. The ATH M50x is well regarded in "headphile" circles for bang for the buck. It's on the Innerfidelity.com Wall of Fame. The ATH AD900x sell for about $135 on Amazon and get good reviews on Head-Fi.org.

I use NAD VISO HP50 headphones for closed back 'phones. But these will set you back about $250.
For open back headphones I use Sennheiser HD 700 or Monoprice Monolith A1060 headphones. As I write this I'm listening to ZMF Eikon headphones (semi open/semi closed). I just assumed these were above your budget. As you said you didn't want to spend hundreds.

If you like the AKG "house sound" the K553 would be in the ball park with the NAD VISO HP50.

I wouldn't give up on streaming. I bet if you tried Tidal or Spotify at the subscription level 320bps through a smart phone with the Shure SE 215 iems, you'd be a convert. I notice no difference between 320 bps MP3 and red book CD. And I'm not sure at 54 years old I should hear a difference.

 

[lovinthehd]

FWIW @BoredSysAdmin posted about this sale and recommends them...

 

[William Lemmerhirt]

I can second the shure se215. They do everything pretty well. I use them as my drum monitors since I normally use my system to listen but they're really good. eBay. Less than 100.