Alternatives to cable

[john flurkey]

I have been living in this condo community for the past 9 years and the cable is included in the HOA dues with basically no Sat dishes allowed. I despise the cable company but it seems I have no choice except to lobby the HOA for something else. The DSL alternative, U-Verse is not really much better with no coverage in my area. I am considering this Antenna Direct DB8 but would have to mount it in my attic and with a ceramic tile roof I doubt it would be worth it. It is nasty what "Comcrap" has done to destroy a perfectly good picture by requiring the use of descramblers which basically compress and mangle an otherwise beautiful image display on my HD flat panel TV. I suppose there is Netflix which would address the lousy image and some of the basically bad programming coming from Comcrap but not sure if the Internet band width is sufficient. Also I like to watch sports when in season so it just seems like I am piling on one expense after another.

Any ideas?

 

[slipperybidness]

I recently cut my cable.

HBO NOW as a standalone service was one of the major reasons I decided that I could get by without cable. Good original programming, good movies, and good quality.

Also, XBOX One let's me stream comedy central and stuff like that.

 

[TLS Guy]

I have been living in this condo community for the past 9 years and the cable is included in the HOA dues with basically no Sat dishes allowed. I despise the cable company but it seems I have no choice except to lobby the HOA for something else. The DSL alternative, U-Verse is not really much better with no coverage in my area. I am considering this Antenna Direct DB8 but would have to mount it in my attic and with a ceramic tile roof I doubt it would be worth it. It is nasty what "Comcrap" has done to destroy a perfectly good picture by requiring the use of descramblers which basically compress and mangle an otherwise beautiful image display on my HD flat panel TV. I suppose there is Netflix which would address the lousy image and some of the basically bad programming coming from Comcrap but not sure if the Internet band width is sufficient. Also I like to watch sports when in season so it just seems like I am piling on one expense after another.

Any ideas?

A number of issues here.

First of all the condo assoc. can not stop you putting up a satellite dish.

If you challenge them you will win.

The next issue is that the Comcast picture is comparable to that on Direct TV now. I know, I have Direct TV at one residence and Comcast at another.

There is no descrambler anymore, just an authentication card is the Comcast receiving device.

I would bet that the association is downgrading your Comcast to SD. High quality HD requires high bandwidth, as does good Internet service.

This means the signal form Comcast can be split no more than twice from where it enters your residence and you devices. It also requires new high bandwidth splitters

Now many condos, just like our Eagan town home condo were built long before the need for high bandwidth. Ours was built about 20 years ago. So what you have are daisy chained splitters throughout the complex. This makes HD digital reception and high bandwidth Internet service impossible.

So you have two options.

Insist that the HOA rewire the buildings to modern standards for HD TV reception and high bandwidth Internet connections.

Failing that, tell them that you will instal a dish for Direct TV.

The latter will solve your TV problem, but not your Internet problem.

My solution was a rewire and the picture and Internet bandwidth are fine.

 

[TheWarrior]

A number of issues here.

First of all the condo assoc. can not stop you putting up a satellite dish.

If you challenge them you will win.

The Doctor is in!

While that is true, and I LOVE messing with HOA's... I also cut the cable over a decade ago, and haven't looked back!

 

[Adam]

I'm a huge fan of over-the-air TV and have been using antennas for several years. If you can get the stations that you want OTA, that will be probably the best picture available.

Regarding satellite dishes, I had one in an apartment complex years ago that (if memory serves) didn't allow them. It's all about visibility, and you might be able to do it if you want to. Most people seem to not understand the real sight line to the satellites, so they put their dishes up on their roofs or side of the house. The satellites are actually at a very steep angle above you, especially down in Florida. I've always kept mine down low and out of sight. At my house, when I first moved in and still had DirecTV, I put my dish on the ground about three feet below the top of my block wall - worked great.

 

[ski2xblack]

Verizon offers competitive internet/TV packages, if you happen to be in their fiber optic coverage area.

 

[TLS Guy]

The Doctor is in!

While that is true, and I LOVE messing with HOA's... I also cut the cable over a decade ago, and haven't looked back!

That is fine to cut the cable, but unless you can use an over the air antenna, then you need good Internet bandwidth.

I would bet the OP has terrible internet bandwidth, due to the infrastructure in his condo.

So the issue is how his condo is arranged? His best bet is to see if he can get good service and have the connection directly to his residence and not part of the condo.

That was my solution, and they still made a fuss about the cable going to the house. You can imagine I told them where to go.

I think getting the best Internet service is crucial in this day and age. I think the days of terrestrial broadcast both radio and TV are really numbered, especially FM radio.

MPR now have an Internet stream at least as good or better than FM. I have used FM nearly all my life but things change.

The LED light bulb will pretty much end FM. These new bulbs produce RF right across the FM band and make FM listening a challenge as you have to limit the number on to listen to FM.

Since I changed, if there are quite a few lights on, even the car radio makes a racket as you draw up to the house.

The other issue is the power draw and maintenance of broadcast towers. Each one consumes around 100,000 KW. So the additive power draw is enormous.

I think the need and justification for terrestrial transmitters is fading fast.

 

[psbfan9]

Depending on what equipment you have, you could connect a computer to your tv. You'll have options like HULU/Netflix/Prime and many others like sling tv, which offers live sports with an ESPN package you would be covered. The Antenna Direct antennas are very good.

https://www.sling.com/

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

The Doctor is in!

While that is true, and I LOVE messing with HOA's... I also cut the cable over a decade ago, and haven't looked back!

As TLS said - for high quality streaming one needs high quality internet.
That said with some preparation and patience even crappy internet one could get lots of content to be available offline. I'm not going to discussing in length here, but few options exists like vpn or premium usenet.

 

[TheWarrior]

As TLS said - for high quality streaming one needs high quality internet.
That said with some preparation and patience even crappy internet one could get lots of content to be available offline. I'm not going to discussing in length here, but few options exists like vpn or premium usenet.

Don't want to thread jack, but is DSL no longer high enough band width? Its been a while since I've used it, and as we do not have a land line, I took a chance on cable internet and have been pleased.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

regular adsl (3mbs) is barely sufficient for SD netflix streaming. for HD stream you need at-least 10-ish mbis down (which is bonded vdsl territory)

 

[zieglj01]

Amazon prime and HuluPlus, I can survive with - if I have a good
internet connection. Then watch sports with over the air TV.

 

[TLS Guy]

regular adsl (3mbs) is barely sufficient for SD netflix streaming. for HD stream you need at-least 10-ish mbis down (which is bonded vdsl territory)

Streaming is moving on a pace at the moment.

The streaming protocols now tailor the packets to your Internet speed at any given moment and when packets are sent, and know the size of the packets your buffer can cope with. In addition codecs like AAC plus constantly change streaming rate dependent on moment to moment changes in the audio program and the H.264 does the same for video.

So you may now think that your quality is dependent only on the source. This is no longer true and highly dependent on your connection and random memory buffer. The better your connection and the bigger your buffer the better the quality and the less likely you are to have streaming interrupted and quality downgraded moment to moment.

I have been fascinated looking at my Internet bit rate monitor.

The BPO and Medici TV use, my full 25 MB Internet capacity. Packets are sent every five seconds or so. The BBC from England which says it is a 320 AAC + stream, actually only send packets to my computer at roughly 18 sec intervals.

I have been watching the game and rules change rapidly. It is fascinating and will try and put something more in depth together later.

It seems to me that a really good Internet connection is mandatory and a very large RAM.

I think it is now more important the ever for best quality to use a really good HTPC, and not rely on BD players and things like ROKU.

I certainly can not duplicate the picture and sound I can stream here on Benedict Lake with fiber and my PCs at our Eagan residence that uses more conventional gear.

Our provider are going to instal a Giganet in rural Itasca county this summer, and hope to have available to all within two years. They want to be first, like they were to have all customers on fiber.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

With all due respect Marc, What you're saying here is not fully accurate.
Streaming from UK must rely on larger buffer due to much higher latency from US to UK.

Large memory buffer is helpful but can't fix all issues.

Yes, Good streaming systems can adjust on the fly to network limitations to a degree, but degradation can and likely will be noticeable.

Quality of internet is not just raw performance benchmarked or promised.

It's whole bunch of factors - like total latency and peer quality of your local isp.
For example just like you might see whole gig speed on your local pc port, your ISP modem port is only a 100mbis, and provider might be limiting your to package you paid of - lets say 15mbis down.
This is not whole story, just a beginning. Your local ISP might weak peering to outside world, the peer they let degrade because over-subscription rate and can't or don't want to expand this connectivity.

To understand this better - see Netflix vs comcast issues from last year.

My idea above does not take in account quality or speed of internet, just time and possibly Comcrap download caps (hopefully not applicable)

 

[TLS Guy]

With all due respect Marc, What you're saying here is not fully accurate.
Streaming from UK must rely on larger buffer due to much higher latency from US to UK.

Large memory buffer is helpful but can't fix all issues.

Yes, Good streaming systems can adjust on the fly to network limitations to a degree, but degradation can and likely will be noticeable.

Quality of internet is not just raw performance benchmarked or promised.

It's whole bunch of factors - like total latency and peer quality of your local isp.
For example just like you might see whole gig speed on your local pc port, your ISP modem port is only a 100mbis, and provider might be limiting your to package you paid of - lets say 15mbis down.
This is not whole story, just a beginning. Your local ISP might weak peering to outside world, the peer they let degrade because over-subscription rate and can't or don't want to expand this connectivity.

To understand this better - see Netflix vs comcast issues from last year.

My idea above does not take in account quality or speed of internet, just time and possibly Comcrap download caps (hopefully not applicable)

I realize I glossed over some issues, however things seem to be getting more complicated with not much info from the streaming sites.

I do know that from very advanced streaming sites like the BPO, your receiving equipment does now seem to matter. The picture quality and audio quality on that site and Medici TV are now just amazing on my rig.

I think we are moving into territory where what the receiving equipment is and its spec is starting to matter, and I expect this to continue. Unlike Comcast, Paul Buyan give me 25 MB up and down every time and all the time. The only time their passive PON went down here that I remember was when a contractor cut a major cable.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

I think we are moving into territory where what the receiving equipment is and its spec is starting to matter, and I expect this to continue

agreed. Simple example: I had a Optimum Boost (100mbs/35) for a while.
My gateway (or router) which cable modem was connected to was Cisco ASA 5505 - one of last gens with full 100mbs VPN performance capability. An exceptional device, BUT it was only limited to 100mbs ports.
After I swapped it for a gig router (asus RT56) - I was able to get upto 18mbs extra - aka upto 118mbs down.
Not huge difference , but that router doesn't have monthly cost

Not that long ago I remember one of regular members here complained about slow internet.
I looked up his router model (old netgear I think) and found it's benchmarks. It turns out - the limit in slow speed was the router. It was designed in times of adsl - I guess marketing folks - said - No one ever going to need more than 5mbis download speed....

 

[Scaleguy]

OTA antenna and tablo tv

 

[Scaleguy]

Back in April I mentioned Tablo. Since then I have changed home phone, internet, and TV over and I'm saving over $100 every month. Quick summary is I switched to TiVo, Ooma, and EarthLink. I write more in detail about the changes here on my blog. I've been watching either satellite or cable since the mid 80's so it was tough at first, but in my opinion the OTA dvr from TiVo made the transition much easier.

 

[MR.MAGOO]

AT&T U-Verse sucks. Convoluted customer service. Sloppy installation. Now Direct TV is part of this mess. My other choice may be Time-Warner. Who knows if it's any better? Has anyone ever had success in getting a human at a cable company to talk to? Sorry about the whining but lately ISP is driving me insane.

 

[highfigh]

AT&T U-Verse sucks. Convoluted customer service. Sloppy installation. Now Direct TV is part of this mess. My other choice may be Time-Warner. Who knows if it's any better? Has anyone ever had success in getting a human at a cable company to talk to? Sorry about the whining but lately ISP is driving me insane.

I think the install/experience depends on where you are- obviously, installation is hard to completely standardize because humans are involved but I have found their customer/tech support to be completely random. I have been in contact with CS people who seemed to give a rat's butt and some who clearly didn't. Monday, I called to discuss my bill and that one just didn't want to take "No!" for an answer when she repeatedly tried to get me to add TV to my internet service. I let her go for far too long and next time that happens, I'll ask for their supervisor, which is what I normally do.

I called (many times over the years) when I had WiFi problems and the Tech Support "specialist" insisted that someone needed to come out to inspect the cable from the pole to my house after I had repeatedly told him that I had no problem when the computer was connected via ethernet cable. For WiFi. I asked "What warped version of logic made you say that?". The symptom- I would be online and occasionally, I would hear a click from the router which coincided with the WiFi icon in the task bar showing no connection. It would come back after I heard another click- the router had power-cycled. One time, they agreed to replace the router and I asked if it might have been caused by a bad power supply and was told that wasn't possible. If they had said it was unlikely, I might have left it alone, but when someone tells me it's impossible, well..... New router showed up while the old one was virtually unusable and when I replaced only the power supply, it worked fine.

I have had good/bad CS/Tech Support and video performance experiences with Time Warner, ATT, Charter, Dish, DirecTV- overall, I think DirecTV was the best and was better on a regular basis.