Zenith P42W46X 42" Plasma EDTV... impressive

[nick_danger]

I was at Best Buy last night (like usual) and this one really stood out from all the other plasmas they had on display. The richness of the color, the brightness and contrast, and the fluidity of the image really caught me off-guard. What blew me away was that it was the cheapest plasma they had! It was $2199! I was going to pick up this sexy 34" Sony CRT for about $1900, but for a third of the weight, DCDi, thin profile, a better picture, all the inputs I want, and 8" more screen space for only a couple hundo more?

Anyone know why I shouldn't get this? The only thing I can think of is that it isn't native 720p, but I'm beyond caring about that now...

 

[BMXTRIX]

Nick - go and try to find a plasma that IS native 1280x720 (or 1920x1080)... I haven't ever seen one.

Here is an interesting fact: Find a 1365x768 plasma that looks really good. Let's say that at 6 feet away, that plasma looks absolutely perfect to you.

An EDTV plasma that also has the same stunning image, but lower resolution (852x480) will look IDENTICAL to that 1365x768 display from a distance of just about 9 feet. This is because of the inverse square law - when you double the distance from something, it appears one quarter the size. So, as you back away from a plasma, the pixels don't have to actually be as small as they need to be as you get closer. In this example, the difference of 3 feet makes two plasmas, with a difference in price of several thousand dollars (typically) look the same.

Always has seemed silly to me: Go get your plasma and don't think that 'native' 720p means more than a lot of hype for you.

I do suggest the 3 year warranty though... double check, but Best Buy has a pretty darn good warranty program.

 

[nick_danger]

Nick - go and try to find a plasma that IS native 1280x720 (or 1920x1080)... I haven't ever seen one.

The 1365x768 resolution is what I meant - it's just slightly higher than native 720. Either way, I will tell you that it does indeed make a difference when my PC is hooked up to it. In order to have sharp text, the output res from the videocard has to match the native pixel count onscreen. The downside of an 852x480 screen is that everything is massive and leaves little room for useability of the PC.

We can use those cute little equations all we like, it doesn't change the fact that a 720 image being fed to a native 720 display is easily much sharper looking than one being fed to a 480 display. I've seen the difference side-by-side, so let's not kid ourselves. Is that to say that 720 downsampled to 480 looks bad? Of course not.

I probably am going to snag this Zenith, but I'm not sure about the warranty, aren't these babies supposed to have 30,000 hours of life? Dang it... I guess I should anyway...

 

[Mr.T]

Nick, I certainly agree with you, that an higher resolution on a Plasma TV is more usable than a lower resolution when you attach a computer laptop to it, but also agree with BMX that watching a TV program on an HD plasma against an ED, the difference is very negligable.

Many times these large electronic stores use a technic called "Make one TV look much better than the others", reason? a higher markup on that Tv in comparison to the other models and brands. They make a lot more money on that particular TV set, so they have the others look, soso.

Mr.T

 

[BMXTRIX]

The other thing Nick, is that the scalers in the lesser expensive models are usually MUCH lower quality than the ones in the 1366x768 resolution range.

You do get that when you hook a PC up that is really should match the native resolution of the display, so 852x480 will look great on a EDTV while 1365x768 looks great on the HDTV (if that is our comparison). But, 720P must be scaled to show on either display, which comes down to the quality of the scalers and the distance from the screen combined with the actual quality of the display.

Native 720 or 1080 REALLY matters. Switch your PC to something other than 1365x768 on a plasma (or if you have an LCD try different resolutions). It is scary how casual people treat fixed pixel displays and how 'anything' above 720P is so much better than EDTV.

You may not like the math: But, there is NOT a 720P plasma so you are viewing processed video, not native. Native 720P on a 1280x720 plasma will kick the crap out of any plasma currently on the market because it won't need to be scaled. But, we have to scale things - so the math, and the computations, matter a lot.

What matters most though is how it looks to your eyes when you stand there and view it from the actual distance you will be in the room you are in. That really, really, really is important.

I would get it though if it is on your short list. I love my Sampo plasma. Price was right, image is beautiful.

 

[nick_danger]

Many times these large electronic stores use a technic called "Make one TV look much better than the others", reason? a higher markup on that Tv in comparison to the other models and brands. They make a lot more money on that particular TV set, so they have the others look, soso.

It's insane! I hate it! It's evil! That's why I turn to you guys before I buy! You can't trust anyone except random, anonymous internet posters anymore!

 

[BMXTRIX]

Ain't that the truth!

If it helps nick - while I am not a long time A/V person, I have been involved strictly in $100,000.00+ installations for the past 6 years. So, when plasmas were first coming out, I was programming them (not installing, programming control systems). I now work in the commercial side where everyone cares about displaying PC images on their plasma & LCD screens. The broad scope of plasma resolution and image quality is what I deal with every day as a programmer and design engineer.

I LOVE higher resolution displays - but it has to be appropriate for the client and the viewing situation. It isn't that more resolution isn't better... it's that it may simply not be worth $3,000 or more to get it.

Likewise - I have compared my $2,000.00 Panasonic projector to a $15,000 Runco projector. The Panasonic was brighter, was MUCH quieter, had worse contrast, a worse processor... But to other employees the verdict was that the Runco was maybe worth an extra $2,000.00 - not $13,000.00 for what it was producing.

 

[nick_danger]

Well, I've been using the Zenith since Friday when I picked it up. I've got to say that I'm thoroughly impressed with the picture quality. The DCDi upconversion of regular cable programming isn't as impressive as advertised, but it looks MUCH better than both the Samsung DLPs I tried. Only now do I realize how terrible the picture was on those Samsungs. Artifacts, what? Seriously, this is the cleanest picture I've seen on a non-CRT HDTV... er, EDTV...

There's still some mild ghosting (very mild), but the picture is rock-solid no matter what I'm viewing. The low pixel count (852x480) makes it rather difficult to use my PC with it and although I can go to much higher resolutions, there are issues with clipping on the sides and illegible text... I'm still working on finding the perfect mode for my PC.

I'm using the Samsung upconvert DVD player, that little silver thing, so it's using up my DVI port... I guess I'd rather not sacrifice my DVI port if I can get away with an equal picture by using component. I'll have to test that out tonight.

All-in-all, this TV has changed my mind about EDTV plasmas. For only $2,200 after tax, it blows the mofo doors off any DLP or LCD I've laid eyes on in the sub-$4,000 range (but I haven't seen them all).

 

[JGB10011]

Zenith P42W46X vs Samsung P4231 or P 4251

Nick, were you comparing the Zeninth image quality of your Zenith to the EDTV models of Samsung, or older models? The Samsung P4231 and P4251 are compariable in price, but it appears (in the store) the P4251's DNIe image enhancing feature did make the colors appear deeper and richer. As the monitors were not side by side, it was difficult to determine which had the fewer jagged edges or other distortions. Would be intersted if anyone else has done the comparisons.