Yamaha Separates? The CX-A5000 AV Preamp and MX-A5000 11CH Amplifier is here!

cpp

cpp

Audioholic Ninja
Even though I am a current Yamaha owner (AVR 3010)and fan of their equipment, there are two issues about these new products that bother me. Assuming the MSRP you quoted is accurate, the pre-amp alone is considerably more expensive than their top-of-the line AVR which from what I can see is that all this is, pretty much just the same AVR without the amps and, of course, the standard pre-pro addition of balanced outputs. They also could have offered as an option the original very "audiophile looking" champagne color that was available with many of their separates back in the nineties the last of which was available on their excellent RXV1 AVR around 2000-2001 that I still own sitting on a rack and being used in one of my stereo systems.

Unfortunately, it is still pretty much like everything else, any color you want as long as it is black.

Nice to see Yamaha coming out with some new amps. I had the chance a long time ago to purchase the MX-10000 but let it slip through my fingers as only 250 were ever made. I just don't see Yamaha ever equaling that amp.. What a amp, Yamaha MX-10000 on thevintageknob.org
yamaha-mx-10000.jpg
 
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DONUTFORME

Audiophyte
Yamaha gone wild

I also own a 3010, very nice unit. I also have a Denon AVR 5805ci that I use for music and occasional movie The new Yamaha's look as though they are trying to fill in the price point left behind when Denon stopped production of the 5805. Which by the way, weighs a hefty 97 pounds. The new Yamaha gear as nice as it looks, does not match the power of the 5805, let alone some of the separates it will compete against. Unfortunately, I will not get a chance to see them around here as the only Yamaha dealer is Best Buy. The 3010, as nice as it is, is not a match for the 5805 when it comes to sound. If i ever have to go to one setup, i will keep the 5805 until it dies. Then I may have to look around for this new setup from Yamaha on the used market.
 
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bwillcox

Audioholic Intern
Thx, I know Yamaha has some, probably, really good 2 channel offerings.... I say probably because I don't know for myself first hand :p
But the thing is, if you wanna buy 11 speakers, quality of what you can buy is MUCH LOWER than if you settle for 2, or 5.... for that matter!

I would much rather have 2 really really good speakers than a whole bunch of mediocre ones....
Not necessarily, not if you can and are willing to spend the additional money. The fact is, In my 11.2 channel system I have the same brand and model of speakers in the front two channels that I would have used if I only wanted to do two channel. I did two channel stereo for many years prior to the mid-seventies when 'quad' channel became popular. I've used various forms of surround sound in most of my systems every since.

I believe that whether you want/prefer two channel (which I do still enjoy) or multi-channel surround is a very subjective thing. I'm convinced that we don't all here the same thing or alike.

BTW, I'm planning to replace my almost six year old RX-Z11 with a CX-A5000 (already ordered one). I currently don't use any of the amplifier channels in the Z11 now so moving to the CX-A5000 is a natural progression for me. (I've been waiting for Yamaha to offer a muli-channel preamp for years.) :)
 
surveyor

surveyor

Audioholic Chief
The Yamaha Multichannel Amp and AVP look awesome- but I'll have to stick with my Denon AVR-4520! Even if it lacks the middle leg and costs less than half the price of the afore mentioned combo!:)
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
The Yamaha Multichannel Amp and AVP look awesome- but I'll have to stick with my Denon AVR-4520! Even if it lacks the middle leg and costs less than half the price of the afore mentioned combo!:)
The Yamaha won't get my vote w/o Pure Direct 2.1. ;)

It won't win over any fans of Audyssey XT32 either.

I also prefer the DENON aesthetic. :D

The Yamaha attracts Yamaha fans/ loyalists.

But at least the Yamaha gets some points for being A LOT cheaper than the DENON AVP-A1HDCI and POA.
 
surveyor

surveyor

Audioholic Chief
When will the The CX-A5000 AV Preamp and MX-A5000 11CH Amplifier be available? I want to see these!:)
 
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bwillcox

Audioholic Intern
When will the The CX-A5000 AV Preamp and MX-A5000 11CH Amplifier be available? I want to see these!:)
The Yamaha website says August for availability. I pre-ordered a CX-A5000 from a local dealer (A&B TV) and they said to expect it sometime around the end of July.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
The Yamaha website says August for availability. I pre-ordered a CX-A5000 from a local dealer (A&B TV) and they said to expect it sometime around the end of July.
They charge MSRP or the street price a little bit lower?

I have had good experience with A&B and they typically will give you good pricing, but maybe not on a just-released item?
 
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bwillcox

Audioholic Intern
They charge MSRP or the street price a little bit lower?

I have had good experience with A&B and they typically will give you good pricing, but maybe not on a just-released item?
I received a pretty good price (below MSRP). I've been dealing with them for a long while.
 
slipperybidness

slipperybidness

Audioholic Warlord
I received a pretty good price (below MSRP). I've been dealing with them for a long while.
Nice. Yeah, it's one of those places that says "rip-off" from the outside, but once you go in and start talking to them, you find that the prices are actually very good (from what I've seen anyway).

My only complaint is that I wish they had more gear to audition. At least get a pair of flagship speakers in there.
 
D

discreplayboss

Audiophyte
The Bathroom in the Vatican...

:p I just caught that one!!!
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
I'm more on music, thinking.... simplicity is key
Read: I'm a 2 channel guy
Why on earth do we need 11.2

It seems like Yamaha put more technology in here than Boeing did in their 787 Dreamliner :p

Isn't quality better than quantity?
I don't plan on defending the idea of that many channels, but if you have normal human hearing, you can hear the difference between a sound coming from in front of you and one coming from behind you, so going with a 5.1 channel system is quite appropriate for humans. And so, presumably, you can understand why that might be desired in movies.


I have several SACDs that are multichannel classical recordings, that when I put them on, I do not consciously hear the rear channels from my normal listening position. But I can certainly hear the difference with them shut off.

In a real auditorium, you hear most of the sound from the front, but you also hear reflected sound from the wall behind you. (You may not notice it in the auditorium, but you would notice it if it could be switched off; it would then sound quite different.) A good multichannel recording can simulate that better than any two channel recording can. However, one must take great care in setting things up properly, or otherwise it will not have the right effect at all.


One can save money on the main speakers by getting high quality bookshelf speakers instead of more full range ones due to the fact that one will be using a subwoofer (or more than one) to deal with the deep bass. (This is, of course, assuming that one is competent to set it up properly; otherwise, one would be better off with a simpler system.) In my case, I am using bookshelf speakers that retail for $1500; the tower speakers that are voice matched to them (with the same tweeter and midbass driver) cost about twice as much, and do not go as deep as my subwoofers, so I am better off this way than I would be with just the pair of tower speakers, even if I am only listening to a 2 channel source.

[In fact, I would want to use a subwoofer or two instead of going with the tower speakers even if I were not using a surround system, as the bass can be better for less money that way, though it does require more care in setting things up, and if one is not up for doing that, then it will not work well for one. But that is a defect in one's ability, not in the concept.]

Now, I do agree that it is not a good idea to go with a cheap surround system instead of a decent 2 channel system. Though I recognize that different people have different standards on this, I would not bother with a surround system on a budget less than $1000, and likely not on one less than $2000. But, of course, one can do a surround system by going a bit cheaper on the rear speakers, as they matter less than the front, but that is less than ideal, and I hope to never have to do that again.
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Spartan
I don't plan on defending the idea of that many channels, but if you have normal human hearing, you can hear the difference between a sound coming from in front of you and one coming from behind you, so going with a 5.1 channel system is quite appropriate for humans. And so, presumably, you can understand why that might be desired in movies.


I have several SACDs that are multichannel classical recordings, that when I put them on, I do not consciously hear the rear channels from my normal listening position. But I can certainly hear the difference with them shut off.

In a real auditorium, you hear most of the sound from the front, but you also hear reflected sound from the wall behind you. (You may not notice it in the auditorium, but you would notice it if it could be switched off; it would then sound quite different.) A good multichannel recording can simulate that better than any two channel recording can. However, one must take great care in setting things up properly, or otherwise it will not have the right effect at all.


One can save money on the main speakers by getting high quality bookshelf speakers instead of more full range ones due to the fact that one will be using a subwoofer (or more than one) to deal with the deep bass. (This is, of course, assuming that one is competent to set it up properly; otherwise, one would be better off with a simpler system.) In my case, I am using bookshelf speakers that retail for $1500; the tower speakers that are voice matched to them (with the same tweeter and midbass driver) cost about twice as much, and do not go as deep as my subwoofers, so I am better off this way than I would be with just the pair of tower speakers, even if I am only listening to a 2 channel source.

[In fact, I would want to use a subwoofer or two instead of going with the tower speakers even if I were not using a surround system, as the bass can be better for less money that way, though it does require more care in setting things up, and if one is not up for doing that, then it will not work well for one. But that is a defect in one's ability, not in the concept.]

Now, I do agree that it is not a good idea to go with a cheap surround system instead of a decent 2 channel system. Though I recognize that different people have different standards on this, I would not bother with a surround system on a budget less than $1000, and likely not on one less than $2000. But, of course, one can do a surround system by going a bit cheaper on the rear speakers, as they matter less than the front, but that is less than ideal, and I hope to never have to do that again.
I really can't claim for how the 5.1 music mixes work as I really only ever had two channel systems, and I would much more like to spend the money on two as good channels as possible, rather than 5, although I fully respect people who have differing views and different ways of looking at these things.

I was in Musikverein last May, it's where they do the famous new year concerts, it's a shocking experience and highly recommended....
The obvious thing there is the absolute lack of ability to pinpoint locations of any instruments, whether we can really reproduce such an event in a two channel, 5 channel or 10 channel system I really don't know, probably not possible to reproduce the sheer smack and the dynamic..... well, you just have to experience this guys :p
 
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bwillcox

Audioholic Intern
I really can't claim for how the 5.1 music mixes work as I really only ever had two channel systems, and I would much more like to spend the money on two as good channels as possible, rather than 5, although I fully respect people who have differing views and different ways of looking at these things.

I was in Musikverein last May, it's where they do the famous new year concerts, it's a shocking experience and highly recommended....
The obvious thing there is the absolute lack of ability to pinpoint locations of any instruments, whether we can really reproduce such an event in a two channel, 5 channel or 10 channel system I really don't know, probably not possible to reproduce the sheer smack and the dynamic..... well, you just have to experience this guys :p
Well I'm something of a multi-channel junky...been hooked on it since the early 70s when Quad Sound was the buzz. I agree that cheap multi-channel systems don't work for me, but then I try to avoid that. My main system is an 11.2 channel system, with quite decent speakers all around, a CX-A5000 preamp, and a bit over 9 KW worth of power amplifiers (if you count all of the various builtin subwoofer amps as well as the Outlaw Audio power amps). Personally, I find the system sounds quite good no matter how many channels happen to be operating at the time. Whether it's two channel SACDs in pure direct mode or a movie blasting all 11.2 channels, I enjoy it. :)

I've been listening to 'hi-fi' since the mid 50s, starting with my first 10 watt mono system. My goal has always been to try to recreate the experience that I had (felt?) with live performances. I feel that my current system, though still not there, is the closest that I've come to that goal.
 
Pyrrho

Pyrrho

Audioholic Ninja
I really can't claim for how the 5.1 music mixes work as I really only ever had two channel systems, and I would much more like to spend the money on two as good channels as possible, rather than 5, although I fully respect people who have differing views and different ways of looking at these things.

I was in Musikverein last May, it's where they do the famous new year concerts, it's a shocking experience and highly recommended....
The obvious thing there is the absolute lack of ability to pinpoint locations of any instruments, whether we can really reproduce such an event in a two channel, 5 channel or 10 channel system I really don't know, probably not possible to reproduce the sheer smack and the dynamic..... well, you just have to experience this guys :p
Live is best, if one can get it.

I think you might change your mind about surround if you heard a good multichannel recording on a good system that is properly set up. [I recommend identical speakers all around, not merely "voiced matched" ones.] I was skeptical of it at first, but having gotten the system for movies, I tried some multichannel SACDs and now I think it is best (compared with other recorded music; live is better). But, unfortunately, most things are not and probably never will be available that way, so I can certainly understand wanting to go with just a good 2 channel system for music. Most of the time, I listen to music on my main 2 channel system, as most of the music I listen to is recorded as 2 channels. And I have never been happy with artificially generated extra channels, so for most music, surround sound isn't useful to me. But it is really fantastic on those relatively few recordings that I have that do make proper use of those channels.

[I say "proper" use, as I do have a disc that I don't like that is multichannel, as it is not really a proper recreation of the sound one would have at a live concert, but improperly puts sound in the back channels. It is not a classical or jazz disc, which, so far, have all been done well among those that I have. As an additional aside, I also have some RCA Living Stereo recordings on SACD, that are only 3 channels, and I like them better than only 2 channels, which was also not entirely expected, though not a total surprise, as I had read some old research on the question in which it was claimed that a third, center channel was better than having only 2 channels for recreating the sound of performers in front of one. I now believe that research, based on hearing these recordings. Having only 2 channels is not ideal.]
 
I

ichigo

Full Audioholic
So basically Yamaha took the amp section of the RX-Z11, turned it into power amp, then paired it with an updated processor? It costs about the same as a Z-11 too, so it's basically a Z-12? xD
 
haraldo

haraldo

Audioholic Spartan
Live is best, if one can get it.

I think you might change your mind about surround if you heard a good multichannel recording on a good system that is properly set up. [I recommend identical speakers all around, not merely "voiced matched" ones.] I was skeptical of it at first, but having gotten the system for movies, I tried some multichannel SACDs and now I think it is best (compared with other recorded music; live is better). But, unfortunately, most things are not and probably never will be available that way, so I can certainly understand wanting to go with just a good 2 channel system for music. Most of the time, I listen to music on my main 2 channel system, as most of the music I listen to is recorded as 2 channels. And I have never been happy with artificially generated extra channels, so for most music, surround sound isn't useful to me. But it is really fantastic on those relatively few recordings that I have that do make proper use of those channels.

[I say "proper" use, as I do have a disc that I don't like that is multichannel, as it is not really a proper recreation of the sound one would have at a live concert, but improperly puts sound in the back channels. It is not a classical or jazz disc, which, so far, have all been done well among those that I have. As an additional aside, I also have some RCA Living Stereo recordings on SACD, that are only 3 channels, and I like them better than only 2 channels, which was also not entirely expected, though not a total surprise, as I had read some old research on the question in which it was claimed that a third, center channel was better than having only 2 channels for recreating the sound of performers in front of one. I now believe that research, based on hearing these recordings. Having only 2 channels is not ideal.]
I can agreen if the recording is made properly and we're talking about a native multichannel recording, not merely some additional effects added artificially; problem, I reckon, is that there is not so many of them. Another problem is that European housing in general is different and it's really less possibility to make this setup proper. Heck, I have more than enogh challenge to get two speakers positioned properly..... My Duntech's require at least 3 feet distance to the front wall just to get the imaging working properly, ideally at least 5 to 6 feet .... this means they're in a holding position (not in use)

So I would much rather have two speakers set up for maximum performance than 5, 6 or 7 in a mediocre place..... If you want all speakers setr up properly they cannot be close to wall, if you ask me.... well' it depends on speakers of course, but according to my experience there are very very very few speakers that work optimally close to wall
When Is ay optimally, I don't talk about frequency balance, which always can be adjusted, but all theswe other aspects that affect performance, related to first and second relections from walls...... you just need distance to walls to get this working well
 
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