Yamaha RX-V777 + 2 Tannoy SFX Sub Setup Help Please

[Haxel666]

Yamaha RX-V777
http://uk.yamaha.com/en/products/audio-visual/av-receivers-amps/rx-v777_g/?mode=model
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/705448/Yamaha-Rx-V777.html?page=34&term=subwoofer&selected=21
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/705448/Yamaha-Rx-V777.html?page=15&term=subwoofers

Tannoy SFX SUB
http://www.richersounds.com/product/subwoofers/tannoy/sfx-sub/tann-sfx-sub-blk
http://www.richersounds.com/static/manuals/SFX5-1.pdf

My setup of subs and amp picture:

Struggling to get setup my subwoofers with amp to get best sound.

Read the manuals but not enough information.

Richer sounds give me different advise to manual and youtube subwoofer guides also have different info.

Really need some good advise on the best way to setup my subs with my av receiver.

My setup is

2 Tannoy SFX Subwoofers identical connected to sub out 1 and sub out 2 on my receiver.

Using RCA Cables

Single RCA digital cable plugged into L on left sub which is connect to sub out 1 on receiver
Single RCA digital cable plugged into L on right sub which is connected to sub out 2 on receiver.

Crossover set to maximum on both subs as was told this would bypass the subs from controlling
crossover and allow av receiver to set crossover.

It does seem to work into amp settings after running ypao mic speaker setup sub have crossover set to 120hz

Volume left half way.

both phase set to 0

Important info is that even though my receiver has two sub outs it states in manual
two subwoofers connected to the unit output the same sounds

Some advise is to connect rca on both subs to L and some is connect one sub to L and other to R which make sense to me but not sure.

Room setup is here
http://forum.kodi.tv/showthread.php?tid=281262


Thanks
Haxel

 

[WaynePflughaupt]

Not sure I get the problem. If you run YPAO everything should be set up automatically and work fine. What exactly are you not happy with?

Regards,
Wayne A. Pflughaupt

 

[lovinthehd]

Does sound like you set it up okay. Your speakers are set to small? The crossover is that for the speaker to sub, not the LPF of LFE setting?

On the subs you should use the LFE input if the sub has one; subs so equipped generally will bypass the sub's own low pass filter, by dialing the sub's low pass filter to maximum the same thing is essentially accomplished. You can actually combine those filters in the avr as well as on the sub, but its generally not recommended.

 

[Haxel666]

bass does not seem loud enough and vocals in music and movies are hard to hear.

all speakers set to small except center using ypao as it sets this to large. should i change this?
ypao set levels to

sub -3.0db
front l and r to 0.0db
center to +1.0 db

side l and r to 0.0db

rear l and r to +3.0 db and +4.0 db

considering my layout seems about right

layout distances

center 4.00m
front l 4.40m
front r 4.75m
sub 4.80m
side l 1.45m
side r 1.45m
rear l 1.20m
rear r 1.20m

this is my center speaker
http://www.richersounds.com/product/centre-speakers/monitor-audio/mr-centre/moni-audio-mr-cen-bk
its bigger than the rest i upgraded it from a small yamaha center it does sound alot nicer
than the yamaha center and more clearer vocals. But still something not right.

It helps when turning the level of the speaker up to 2.0 db

speakers i am using include

4 identical yamaha satellites for front L and front R, Side L and Side R

2 tannoy satellites for rear l and rear r

Monitor audio mr center speaker

tannoy sfx 2 x subs

setup 7.1 basic
default parametric eq flat sound

 

[Haxel666]

ive read the setup guide on this site. I think i should set all speakers to small and crossover to 80hz? is that correct.

 

[lovinthehd]

I would set your center to small and start with a crossover of 80 but experiment above and below as well. It is not unusual to boost the sub levels if you feel its a bit light; same for the center level if having trouble with dialog. Is the center aimed at your seat and aimed at ear level? Is it obstructed by a shelf in front of the baffle or anything like that?

 

[Pogre]

another thing that helped me a ton to get the best sound at my seat is the sub crawl. it looks silly, but it works. you put the sub in your seat and play something with lots of bass, then crawl around on the floor and find where it sounds best. that's where you want to place your sub.

 

[Haxel666]

I watched a movie last night with crossover on 80hz and all speakers set to small.

sound was really good bass was just right kicking in when explosions went off etc.

but dialog was lacking still had to turn up the overall volume very loud to hear the dialog over the other effects.

I did try turning up the center speaker level by 2 and this seemed to help abit and also experimented with dialog lift which also seems to help needs some more experimenting.

I found the 80hz crossover seems little more bass than the 120hz is that correct that the lower crossover makes the sub do more of the work.

By changing the values of the ypao auto config. E.g. center level from 1.00 db to 3.00 db i guess this also effects the other speakers like the front l and r that the sound from them would sound alot weaker?

Overall much happier with it now with the changes i made

Thanks for helping.

 

[lovinthehd]

Lower crossover means the sub is being asked to do less, not more. Is your center speaker well positioned/aimed? In some movies dialog isn't clear at all times, either.

 

[Haxel666]

Centre is exactly middle lower than ear level but can't adjust this is 120hz what took set should be good as have 2 good subs

 

[lovinthehd]

Centre is exactly middle lower than ear level but can't adjust this is 120hz what took set should be good as have 2 good subs

No way to angle the center towards your ears?

 

[Haxel666]

I could angle up will try that thanks
Would you recommended 120hz what ypao set

 

[lovinthehd]

I'd angle it up and then run YPAO again, it may change. Doorstops like this work and are cheap.

PS Sometimes with higher crossovers localization of the sub becomes an issue. I am currently crossing my speakers at 120 with no particular localization issues but I have four subs around the room, too.

 

[Haxel666]

Hi Thanks for all the advise sounds much better bought the door stops for center speaker.

I also bought new front speakers to replace yamaha front satellites
with Q Acoustics 2010i
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Acoustics-2010I-Compact-Bookshelf-Speakers/dp/B0063FT3WW

Running the setup detects front left and right now as large aswell as center.

It does sound nice but from what i read on here I have set them all to small instead of the detected large. Understanding that as I am using subs that they will handle the bass bits better.

and left crossover to 120hz sub level has gone down to -5.0db i guess because ypao had set the front left and right to large.

Should I just change sub back to -3.0db.

Hope makes sense any advise be great. Didnt get any help from Richer Sounds ( think if i was buying more expensive items would of)

So My Setup is now

Bass Cross Over 120hz ( YPAO set this )
All Speakers to small ( YPAO wanted front left and right and center to large)
No Other Changes

 

[lovinthehd]

Hi Thanks for all the advise sounds much better bought the door stops for center speaker.

I also bought new front speakers to replace yamaha front satellites
with Q Acoustics 2010i
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Acoustics-2010I-Compact-Bookshelf-Speakers/dp/B0063FT3WW

Running the setup detects front left and right now as large aswell as center.

It does sound nice but from what i read on here I have set them all to small instead of the detected large. Understanding that as I am using subs that they will handle the bass bits better.

and left crossover to 120hz sub level has gone down to -5.0db i guess because ypao had set the front left and right to large.

Should I just change sub back to -3.0db.

Hope makes sense any advise be great. Didnt get any help from Richer Sounds ( think if i was buying more expensive items would of)

So My Setup is now

Bass Cross Over 120hz ( YPAO set this )
All Speakers to small ( YPAO wanted front left and right and center to large)
No Other Changes

When one of these auto room correction eq setup routines (YPAO, Audyssey, etc) tests your speakers they generally determine an in-room f3 point for your speakers (aka its -3dB point on the low end of their range), if it's 40Hz or so they will set bass management to off (aka speakers set to large). Your room is part of this so it can be different than the specs of the speaker (the -3dB point of those 2010's is 68Hz per the specs). However, when using a sub it's generally better to simply set your speakers to small (aka bass management on) and let the sub handle the lower frequencies.

When I see a phrase like bass crossover I wonder if its the LPF of LFE or if you just mean crossover (crossover is a filter applied to both the speaker and sub together). LPF of LFE is a separate low pass filter for LFE channel content (like a movie with a .1 channel), and is generally set to 120hz.

IIRC Yamaha does it a bit differently with the interplay of levels between mains sensitivity and sub gain setting, they're intertwined with YPAO whereas sub level is more independent in Audyssey avrs. I'd leave it where YPAO set it for speaker levels, perhaps raising the sub level if you feel it's a bit light.

I glanced at your manual, are you using all the possible mic positions when running YPAO?

 

[TLS Guy]

Hi Thanks for all the advise sounds much better bought the door stops for center speaker.

I also bought new front speakers to replace yamaha front satellites
with Q Acoustics 2010i
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Acoustics-2010I-Compact-Bookshelf-Speakers/dp/B0063FT3WW

Running the setup detects front left and right now as large aswell as center.

It does sound nice but from what i read on here I have set them all to small instead of the detected large. Understanding that as I am using subs that they will handle the bass bits better.

and left crossover to 120hz sub level has gone down to -5.0db i guess because ypao had set the front left and right to large.

Should I just change sub back to -3.0db.

Hope makes sense any advise be great. Didnt get any help from Richer Sounds ( think if i was buying more expensive items would of)

So My Setup is now

Bass Cross Over 120hz ( YPAO set this )
All Speakers to small ( YPAO wanted front left and right and center to large)
No Other Changes

Your real problem is puny left and right main speakers. Most of what is perceived as bass is well above sub range. This is so often forgotten. Most bass is 80 to 500 Hz. People call that midrange. It is not, it is bass range. There is a lot of power there which requires competent speakers and not puny satellites.

You need to invest in some nice Monitor audio speakers to match the center.