Upgrade or not to upgrade ....?

N

nosferatu

Audioholic
Hi i currently going back and forth about upgrading my receiver.
I currently have denon 2808ci with emotiva upa-5 . I been happy with the denon ever since i got it , idid not have any problems however i feel like my speakers ( Vienna acoustic Haydn Grand,Waltz
Grand,Theatro) could sound better.
Is it worth upgrading to another receiver with emotiva or just a more expensive AVR without emotiva. I was considering NAD but they seem to have too many problems wiht HDMI.I have little 2ch. Nad setup in a bedroom and its sound really good.
would Marantz or Pioneer improve anything over my current Denon ?
would i be able to run Viennas of Marantz or newer Denon AVR only. ?
 
lsiberian

lsiberian

Audioholic Overlord
Honestly I only replace receivers when they break or a when a new connector is standardized. My suggestion is to put that money in the bank and get some interest at least until one of the above scenarios happens or pay down the house even. Honestly you won't gain much upgrading one good receiver for another. Now about that sub.:D
 
STRONGBADF1

STRONGBADF1

Audioholic Spartan
I don't believe that changing would do much. I think adjusting placement and/or playing with the receiver settings would do more to change the sound then a new receiver.

Can you try the NAD receiver from the bedroom system with the Vienna acoustic Haydn Grand in the room they are currently in?
 
N

nosferatu

Audioholic
yes i can try NAD but its only 2 Ch. but i will give a try . maybe i will try adding few more acoustics panels above the TV. I just feel like im missing the crisp sound of Viennas that i heard when i first auditioned them in Magnolia HT
 
STRONGBADF1

STRONGBADF1

Audioholic Spartan
yes i can try NAD but its only 2 Ch. but i will give a try . maybe i will try adding few more acoustics panels above the TV. I just feel like im missing the crisp sound of Viennas that i heard when i first auditioned them in Magnolia HT
Good. Try the Vienna acoustic Haydn Grand in the bedroom also. Never hurts to play and learn about your equipment and rooms. don't forget to play with placement and your receiver set-up.

Let us know what you come up with.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Hi i currently going back and forth about upgrading my receiver.
I currently have denon 2808ci with emotiva upa-5 . I been happy with the denon ever since i got it , idid not have any problems however i feel like my speakers ( Vienna acoustic Haydn Grand,Waltz
Grand,Theatro) could sound better.
Is it worth upgrading to another receiver with emotiva or just a more expensive AVR without emotiva. I was considering NAD but they seem to have too many problems wiht HDMI.I have little 2ch. Nad setup in a bedroom and its sound really good.
would Marantz or Pioneer improve anything over my current Denon ?
would i be able to run Viennas of Marantz or newer Denon AVR only. ?
If you don't like your sound change your speakers and not the receiver. I have heard the products of Vienna Acoustics, and they are lousy.
 
AcuDefTechGuy

AcuDefTechGuy

Audioholic Jedi
If you don't like your sound change your speakers and not the receiver. I have heard the products of Vienna Acoustics, and they are lousy.
I've never listened to Vienna Acoustics.

I believe GlocksRocks said one time he thought they sounded pretty good.

But I saw this measurement on Home Theater Magazine:

The Vienna Acoustics Beethoven Baby Grand listening-window response (a five-point average of axial and +/–15-degree horizontal and vertical responses) measures +2.84/–6.48 decibels from 200 hertz to 10 kilohertz.

It doesn't look good to me, but then again everyone says it's just one snapshot of the overall picture and you have to listen to the speakers for yourself.

For example the B&W 803D's listening-window response (a five-point average of axial and +/–15-degree horizontal and vertical responses) measures +1.90/–3.68 decibels from 200 hertz to 10 kilohertz. But PENG and a lot of other people say that the B&W 800 series sound great.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
I have heard some Vienna Acoustics in different places.
They sounded good, but great to me. Most likely your issues are with your room. Magnolia rooms are very carefully acoustically designed to provide be experience - I bet your room - not so much...

I agree with others - replacing amp/receiver will do nothing, but placebo effect.
If you want brighter sounds, maybe you checkout some Klipsch speakers
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
Hi i currently going back and forth about upgrading my receiver.
I currently have denon 2808ci with emotiva upa-5 . I been happy with the denon ever since i got it , idid not have any problems however i feel like my speakers ( Vienna acoustic Haydn Grand,Waltz
Grand,Theatro) could sound better.
If the UPA-5 is anything like the UPA-7 that Gene measured, we're talking 140 wpc in 8 ohms, 238 wpc into 4 ohms amp already - not likely having much difficulty with your haydn grands. Unless you listen at blistering drive levels, i really doubt it`s having trouble. It sounds like you`ve got some randomly placed acoustic panels which may be messing up your sound perception, and you`re chasing a treated room sound for some probably flawed speakers.

Your best bet, if you want to spend, is to pick up a measurement microphone and USB mic preamp, and measure things to find out what`s wrong with your room (and speakers).

Ultimately, you may come to the realization that your room is obscuring details; and conversely, you may realize that the way your vienna acoustics radiate sound is exciting these problems in your room.
 
BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
btw: just to make sure - did you set all speakers to "small" and crossover to about 80-90hz?
Your surrounds needs to be crossed at 85-90.
I'd try to rerun auto setup just to make sure if you added any objects into the room after last auto-config run
 
N

nosferatu

Audioholic
btw: just to make sure - did you set all speakers to "small" and crossover to about 80-90hz?
Your surrounds needs to be crossed at 85-90.
I'd try to rerun auto setup just to make sure if you added any objects into the room after last auto-config run

im running fronts and Center as Large and rear i think 60hz


i also thinking of adding few panels above TV , not sure if it will help any or not
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
I would start with a few things.

Add bass traps along anything that resembles a corner near the front of the room.

Take off the rear absorption panels altogether and switch them with diffusion.

Now pull the couch 2 to 5 feet away from the wall. The more the better.

Pull the Left/Right front speakers out into the room. Preferably 2 to 3 feet in front of the screen. Toe them in so that the tweeter axis of each is aimed at the nearest shoulder at the listening spt.

Place two of the absorption panels you already have on the side walls at 1st reflection points. The other two should fit on the front wall, right beside the TV.

And if none of the above works... buy new damn speakers after an actual in-home audition. Maybe some Pioneer S2-EXs :D

Add diffusion panels in the ceiling at the first reflection points. Also add diffusion panels at reflection points where furthest speaker reflects off wall)
 
GranteedEV

GranteedEV

Audioholic Ninja
im running fronts and Center as Large and rear i think 60hz


i also thinking of adding few panels above TV , not sure if it will help any or not
Set them to small at 80hz. running those puny things as "large" will just strain the amplifier and midwoofer unessessarily.
 
N

nosferatu

Audioholic
what is a difference in diffusion panel and absorption panel . after i installed the panels i did tremendous difference in how everything sounds . also guys i need to keep this as living room looking as possible its not a HT room wife won't allow that. it was hard enough to hang the panels as it is.
would i make more difference if i put 2 large panels behind the speakers instead of above the Tv


ps.off topic where can i get some spades for speakers cables . AA has it for $6 each is that price about right
 
B

bikdav

Senior Audioholic
btw: just to make sure - did you set all speakers to "small" and crossover to about 80-90hz?
Your surrounds needs to be crossed at 85-90.
I'd try to rerun auto setup just to make sure if you added any objects into the room after last auto-config run[/QUOT

Also, be ready to experiment with each channel level. As I discovered the hard way, sometimes just a small change in levels could fix a vexing room acoustic problem.
 
timoteo

timoteo

Audioholic General
All the advice you have recieved so far has been very good & there is a lot of proof behind their recommendations as well. Definately have all your speakers set to small & crossed over somewhere between 80-100hz. Your rear speakers should reflect a bit off the back wall but if diffused will sound better. The absorption should be placed up front behind your 2 mains & on the side walls at their first reflection (as mentioned). Have a friend hold a mirror at ear level along the side walls. Once you can see either of your mains from your seating position, you know where to place a panel. Thats the most basic explanation i can come up with:)
Your system looks great & im sure with a few tweaks you will be very happy to keep all the gear you have. If not....time to save up!!!
 
STRONGBADF1

STRONGBADF1

Audioholic Spartan
im running fronts and Center as Large and rear i think 60hz


i also thinking of adding few panels above TV , not sure if it will help any or not
as I recommended and the others have stated in more detail, play with the settings in your receiver and also placement. (speakers and panels)


My suggestions (just as a starting point) would be to move your center channel and mains out to the leading edge of the credenza. Then toe the mains in so the tweeters are pointing half way between straight out and directly at the sweet spot. Set all speakers to small and the THX recommended crossover of 80htz. Make sure there is no other DSP or EQ processing turned on. Turn the crossover knob on the sub all the way up (~150 htz) so not to cross over twice. (receiver and sub) With a tape measure set all of your speaker distances and then level match using a SPL meter. (the basic radio shack meter will do fine)

If you do this the room will look basically the same and the mids and highs will sound clearer but you can still tweak from there to preference or start to measure the rooms response with one of the systems like REW...

As far as sound absorption I know very little as I have not used any other than drapes and carpeting and there are conflicting views on what is "correct". Others have givin some guidance on the subject and I say experiment and see what you like and don't like in your room.

Have fun with it!:)
 

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