Sapphire Speaker Owners Thread or Non owners that have listened

2

20Glove

Audioholic
Hello all.

I have had 2 private messages regarding the Sapphire speakers. So I thought I would start an owners thread. Maybe there are more of you out there that I had thought... maybe not too, let me know.

I would love to hear what you have to say about these speakers. I have heard positive, neutral, and negative comments. I want to hear what the owners have to say, listeners have to say, and anyone who wants to talk.

Most comments that I have seen include people that were comparing these speakers at Tweeter or just were weary of the line (which they should have been since they are out of business and do not support their product any longer). That said I love my sapphire speakers, but there are some negatives as well, but with anything I could find negative... I am a pessimist!!

My A/V set up... I have these in my loft (which as of now is the entertainment room). We watch Movies, TV, and listen to music on a Panasonic 42" 1080i Plasma, Toshiba HD DVD player, Yamaha DVD-2500 upconvert DVD player, and have a Pioneer Elite CD changer (almost 8 yrs old now... still working like it did day one though), all this is hooked up to a Onkyo TXSR805 AV receiver (had this system hooked up to Denon AVR-3808ci, but do to space on my a/v rack, had to move my Denon down to the small Family Room, where I run my Infinity Interlude system, which replaced my Sapphire 6.1 SAT1500's.

MY Sapphire Speaker set up:

The set up is as followed: 2 fronts are the ST3's, the Sapphire Center, Surround Side Sapphire Dipoles, and the Surround back same thing Sapphire Dipoles, I have Martin Logan Dynamo as my subwoofer, tried out the Sapphire subwoofer... and it is the only speaker I HATED from Sapphire and luckily returned it b4 they had all sales final at my local store which went out of business.

Indifferent:

I do not listen to SACD's on this system as this system is not really set up for that with the Dipoles as my surrounds. I have listened to mutli channel music b4 on these and it sounds ok, more do to the setup I think then the speakers themselves.

Positives:

The build quality of all these speakers are great. They are heavy, the grilles fit snug and tight, and the weight is so evenly dispersed in the towers.

I also like the look of these speakers. They are more narrow then my Infinity IL 40's or my old Def Tech BP10's. They are a little longer than the two mentioned but not by much (now only talking towers here about size). The towers also have a glass top which to me is kinda classy. I think the black with blue S symbol is a nice touch not flashy but it adds a little style.

Ok now to the sound... In surround these speakers really shine!! The sound to me both musically and movie wise is clear, not hollow sounding, and not pitchy. The dialogue in the movies are perfect as the voice matching to my ears sound excellent. Movie sound in my mind are crystal clear and the surround Dipoles make the movie just wrap around you. When watching "Gone Baby Gone" during the scene at the park at night you could hear the crickets and bugs... and then bang... gunshots ring out around you... you start ducking for cover... not really but sound is that good to me.

Musically these speakers sound excellent with some music and sound just good to ok with other types of music, (I listen to all types).

When I want to listen to my remastered Kiss (70's Kiss, not 80's Kiss), Cream, The Doors, Duran Duran, Thompson Twins, Andrea Bocelli, Queen (or any Freddie Mercury), Samantha Fox, Debbie Gibson, Charlie Daniels, Alabama, Garth Brooks, or any instrumental movie soundtack/Disney Instrumental/Classical music these speakers again SHINE! The sound stage is centered and the sound clarity even with the Doors, Kiss, and Cream are just awesome. I do not get any hum or white noise sound while listening.

Negatives:

Though if I want to listen to 80's Kiss, Motley Crue, Sum 41, Linkin Park, Scorpions, Helloween, Pearl Jam, Seven Mary Three, Green Day, or any music you want to play loud with heavy guitar, bass, drums, and screaming vocals then these speakers do not hold up to the Infinity IL40's or my old Def Tech BP10's.

When I turn up the volume, (at least on my Onkyo and the old Denon 3805), the sound quality loses some clarity. It becomes fatiguing to listen to (not as bad as Klipsch Reference which make my ears fell like they are bleeding) and you begin to lose the vocals. You can listen to this music at lower levels... (kinda loud- 25Db but movies and other CD's at -12Db to -10Db) but I want to shake the walls when listening to the above music...

Now when you crank it up for a movie or the music listed in the positive section you do not lose that clarity and the speakers sound perfect, can not figure out why... but my buddy that comes over all the time... says there is a major difference too. For instance... we were having a new years day party and b4 football began, I put on some Frank Sinatra and even some Matt Dusk and cranked the sound and it was perfect. Then I threw in the Back in Black CD from AC DC and bam... distorted sound (mind you I did not adjust the sound)... then threw in Jazz CD that my buddy had in his car... and it was crystal clear (again did not change the volume)...

So a negative I guess would be inconsistency. With that said... they are out of business and not supporting there product at all anymore... I hope if anything goes wrong within the 3 yr warranty period (which I still have 1 and half years left on), that Tweeter will take care of me, I think they will, but still a concern and therefor a negative.

What friends and family say when they listen to these speakers:

Overall my friends and family love these speakers. They comment all the time that they sound so clear and the sound stage in stereo mode is very wide. Everyone that watches movies with us, say that the sound is very good.

One family member though does not like these speakers at all. He says they sound muddy and hallow. He also comments that the high sounds (cymbals and bells and such) are too sharp while the low end sounds (bass) sound hallow and overall do not match.

So as you can see, to me and others that have listened there are positives and negatives... but hey I got the entire 7 speaker set... for just under $1000... though now I can say, with all honesty, after listening to these for so long and comparing them to the Mirage, Polk, (I think Boston) and Klipsch when I bought them, I would have paid full price for these... it would have been between the Sapphire and Polk. I am very happy with my purchase as I got a $3000 set that sounds like a $3000 set for less than $1000. Who could complain!?!

So come one come all, Sapphire owners, people that have heard em in action, and anyone that wants to make a comment or ask a question... FIRE AWAY!!

I am sure this thread will be ignored... but I wanted to say my 2 cents anyway... and wanted to tell the world I am a FAN.

Have fun!
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
they are/were private labeled for tweeter and while sound is subjective, they are wayyyyyy overpriced.

http://forums.audioholics.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-1281.html
Bandphan,

This is a common misconception. I asked several Tweeter sales people b4 if this was a exclusive deal with Sapphire... they all have told me no. The salesman that I worked with since 1999 when we had United Audio b4 Tweeter bought them out... told me 1st hand not a Tweeter only company. When sapphireaudio.com actually worked... there were several dealers.

Here is a post from a different forum from a different site that talks about this... http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=638522

Though I do not trust salesman... even the one I have been using since 1999 and has gone through a buyout and has since moved stores since the store I used closed... I believe him... and I was lucky enough to buy them when the site was up and running and the company was still in business and there were several dealers that dealt with Sapphire, according to the website... there were 4 I think in total... Tweeter Inc... being one of them.

Ok, now to the over priced comment. The set was MSRP $2950 plus tax. The Polk Rsi10's and the center and surrounds in that set were about the same, Mirage was a tad higher and Klipsch was a tad lower... But overall in the same price range.

So, you are right sound is subjective... but when comparing... and if the sound is better to YOU... and the prices are all the same... are they overpriced in your mind?

Also, I think all speakers are overpriced when they first come out or sell for MSRP...

I have never bought speakers for retail prices... only clearance/closeout, demo's, or open box... or since recently Craigslist.

Craigslist is where I am going to put together my surround Infinity Interlude system... which some people have said were underpriced hence the production only lasting 18 months to 2 years (some say Inifinity lost money on these speakers)... but still even though the sound is suppose to be ultimately the best within its original price range (about $3000 for IL40's IL36C, and 4 IL10's), I would not pay that... and there are many that said they would pay more.... not me. And best to those people that like this set by the way... I do agree again sound is objective. I will report on the Interlude series when I get it put together.

So I agree Bandphan that all speakers are overpriced.... but looking back at the receipts and what I just purchased my last pair of Dipoles for.... was a total ($490 pair of ST3's, $109 Center, $198 pair of Dipoles, with the tax equaled... $848.81.. plus $116 with shipping for the 2nd pair of Dipoles... for a total of $964.81.

Now lets compare that to the price range... which would be satellite systems (KLH, Bose, etc)... maybe some some cheap sony towers, maybe cheap JBL towers, and cheap Yamaha towers for this along with center and surround...

Now are you saying $965 is overpriced or the MSRP of $2950 was overpriced?

Let me know.
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
Bandphan... by the way .... the forum I sent you too also talks about mark ups... overall... like your post does...

I used to work and being a manager in training at an audio store... but I saw some of the purchasing invoices... and we were not marking prices up 50% or higher... The biggest mark up in our store was on speaker wire, cables, etc. As far as receivers, speakers, audio and video components, it is a huge mark up when an item is introduced... then comes down a little... then stays steady... then sell off, right at or right above 5-10% profit margin to clearance/open box which is below profit, at least that is how our store was at the time... 11 years ago. As for exact profit margins... do not remember but I would say about %20-%30 except on cables and accessories which was much higher.

I have a friend that works at an electronics store I will have to ask him how it is now a days... and see what % on a normal basis it is.
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
well not a misconception, and i worked for them:D. The company started by carey christey tom devesto headquarted in boston(funny thats where tweters at). My opinion on them is with price. Here in florida its sound advice not tweeter, and once tweeter took control everything has gone down hill. These speakers are-were designed for tweeter period, and find a store in a tweeter market where they are carried. If they sound good to you thats fine but the profit margin on them is EXTREMELY ridiculous. Agian im not knocking your speakers im just telling you they are not worth the price.
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
well not a misconception, and i worked for them:D. The company started by carey christey tom devesto headquarted in boston(funny thats where tweters at). My opinion on them is with price. Here in florida its sound advice not tweeter, and once tweeter took control everything has gone down hill. These speakers are-were designed for tweeter period, and find a store in a tweeter market where they are carried. If they sound good to you thats fine but the profit margin on them is EXTREMELY ridiculous. Agian im not knocking your speakers im just telling you they are not worth the price.
Not worth the MSRP??? or the price I paid?? Again compare them to anything that you can put together under $1000 or at $1000... can you clarify?

Clarify too if you could... Polk worth the money?? Mirage worth the money??? Klipsh worth the money?? All of which were carried at the same time as Sapphire. If so, what makes them different? Just asking... not sure if you think the sapphire's should not have been in that price range??

Again... Tweeter was not the only company to carry these speakers... so even if you worked there or not, not disputing that... just disputing the claim that it was a Tweeter only brand... the site had 3 different authorized dealers... and it is Tweeter here in Chicago... Sound Advice in Orlando... it did not have both listed as authorized dealers cause it is the same company... there were 2 or 3 different companies. Also the claim that Sapphire was made in Boston and that is where Tweeter headquarters are does not prove anything... I could never find any correlation on the internet that linked Cary C. or Tom D. to Tweeter Corp. Not like the internet is all knowing but a good research tool... maybe I can ask Tweeter for their annual prospectus from 2003 -2006 and see if there is any correlation.

Also Tivoli is made in Boston... and Tweeter carries that... does that make it an exclusive to Tweeter... oh wait... no... cause Tivoli sells all over. What makes you think Sapphire was exclusive to Tweeter?? Did someone from the company tell you this?? If so, I would like to writer Tweeter and use names so that I can assure my warranty is upheld.

I also just got off the phone with my friend who works at a major electronics store... he said they wanted the sapphire line (in late 2005), but the distributor also carried the Klipsch line and Boston Acoustics line and in order to get the Sapphire they would have had taken the Klipsch and Boston line as well and they did not want those lines at the time.

Please let me know what you find out... or please give facts that sapphire was a tweeter only brand, not speculation. If someone in the company had told you this... please let me know. Again I want to assure my warranty is upheld if I need to use it.

This is fun... lively discussion I like it!
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
ok tweeter owned close to half of the company and when tweeter went into refi so went sapphire bye bye. In regards to polks, no i wouldnt own them, older miarges maybe, and as for mark up 180% above cost.You do the math backwards. Again speakers are subject listening, and profit isnt a dirty word. The same went with other brands and retailers, which is ok but imo they are over priced, even if they sound fantastic. Im out i dont own them and im not qualified to speak on anything else in their regards.

edit: if you have your reciept, that is you warranty with tweeter, and as long as they dont go under you should be ok. As for the exact percentage of ownership in them i dont know, but the rest is very true and factual. BTW the 9 stores in cali were owned by tweeter and the ones in jersey im not sure about.
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
Tweeter in Cali?

ok tweeter owned close to half of the company and when tweeter went into refi so went sapphire bye bye. In regards to polks, no i wouldnt own them, older miarges maybe, and as for mark up 180% above cost.You do the math backwards. Again speakers are subject listening, and profit isnt a dirty word. The same went with other brands and retailers, which is ok but imo they are over priced, even if they sound fantastic. Im out i dont own them and im not qualified to speak on anything else in their regards.

edit: if you have your reciept, that is you warranty with tweeter, and as long as they dont go under you should be ok. As for the exact percentage of ownership in them i dont know, but the rest is very true and factual. BTW the 9 stores in cali were owned by tweeter and the ones in jersey im not sure about.
I just talked to 2 store managers at Tweeter one that has been with the company 6 years and one that started in 2005 and just got his own store like 6 months ago.

Now I am not sure when Sapphire went out of business.. but the one manager (2005 guy) said he does not THINK so... so think... I am not comfy with.

But the guy that has been a manger since Tweeter took over United Audio 6 years ago said that he could not honestly tell me if Tweeter had a stake in Sapphire or not... he said though he leans towards possibly having a stake... due to the fact there was no guidelines to follow when they cleared out those speakers... he said companies usually have a rule on Demo's or open box items that they cannot sell them under a certain percentage... for instance he said that Martin Logan's rule on open box or Demo is no more than 5% of lowest price... which Martin Logan sets. Same issue with Bose.

Bandphan does this sound correct? But sapphire's had no rules for that... he said he sold his last set of bookshelves... which he approved for $20.00. He said they are normally not allowed to do that... but with Sapphire's they were, He said when they cleared out there Klipsch line though they were allowed to do that same thing... but those are the only 2 he can remember being able to do that with... even when the stores closed here the companies that they had these agreement with those products were shipped out to other stores b4 the closing. I remember in fact that even though the store had 2 days (real 2 days left)... the speakers and receivers were the only two things in the store that were only 20% off marked prices... never went lower than that... the salesman says that they had specific direction on closeouts and had not wiggle room... again, Bandphan does this sound correct?

As far as he said... when Tweeter took over there were no stores in California.. he is unsure of Tweeters in Cali b4 the take over. If I remember correctly one of the stores that was authorized is Fry's electronics or Fry's Audio/Video... not sure where that was ... but I think a company named Fry's was one of the authorized dealers... is that a Tweeter Corp?? At least that is what it says in a "sound and vision" review article given to me when I was trying to decide... it says at the bottom... but it is cut off... places to buy... and it looks like Fry's... Cannot even see Tweeter's name but again it is cutoff. But this review article was given to me at the Tweeter store and it says Sound and Vision September 2005. They reviewed the ST3, Center, Bookshelf, and Subwoofer.

So even at less than a $1000... there was still a profit? Is that what you are saying?? With the ads... and the cut prices... sounds like I got a "White Van" deal. Now that is funny... cause I choose the sapphire system over my Def Tech system as far as sound... which I just sold on Craigslist about 6 months ago... That system consisted of BP10's upfront... CLR2000.... And BP-1X for surrounds.... and that system on clearance when United Audio switched to Tweeter was I think close to $1100. I thought Sapphire sounded better in the room I was using them in... So I feel far from a "White Van" deal.
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
my freinds have been with sound advice since the 80's, dont read to much into what im saying, its mark up. The tweeter owned stores in cali(not tweeter named i believe) have been closed do to refi. Whether sappahire is defunct shouldnt matter, your speakers are fine....dont worry. I know what im telling you is true. Do you like your system? Yes, then i should have never opened my fingers:D its all good

http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/gadgets/tweeter-closing-13-of-their-stores-246845.php
 
emorphien

emorphien

Audioholic General
I've never heard of Sapphire but they do seem to spark quite a few debates wherever I see them being discussed in the quick search I just performed.
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
Yes you should of... I like this post... I hope you are not offended... I like arguing!!

On the lite side of things I do really like the system.. I think it sounds clear and the sound stage is excellent. I also like the build quality and the consistency in dialogue and voice reproduction.

I actually love my speakers.

I will compare them to the Inifinity Interlude system, it should be complete by Thursday... With my IL40's upfront, IL10's in back, and IL36C in the center.

From what I have heard... that IL36C will blow the Sapphire Center away. That is one other thing I noticed... on the sapphire center... when there is an action scene... you can hear the transition from Center to Front L/R... the center during action scences have a hard time keeping up with the L/R. I have heard the IL36C you will hear no transition and the bass sounds terrific on the IL36C... We wil see.

Should I do that comparison will anybody even care?! Since both systems are out??
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
I've never heard of Sapphire but they do seem to spark quite a few debates wherever I see them being discussed in the quick search I just performed.
Welcome to the post. I have read most of these forums about sapphire... you either love or hate them. I love mine... plus I feel like I paid a good price right under $1000 for 7 speakers... cmon 135.57 a speaker about... how can you beat that... They are better than Sony... or Yamaha I know that.

I am so glad I have these speakers... they sound awesome to my ear!!

Welcome to the sapphire debate.
 
J

jamie2112

Banned
I love my sapphire st-2s. I am very satisfied with them and have been for 3 years now. They or al least mine don't distort at hi volumes at all. I crank them up alot and no problems. I have B&W and polks and Jamos and I like the sapphire best out of all of them and I got my st-2s for 200 on craigslist. Oh yeah I got the Jamos for 10 bucks as well. Happy listening......:)
 
bandphan

bandphan

Banned
http://www.twice.com/article/CA306753.html

http://www.fixya.com/support/sapphire_technology/home_theater_speakers_and_subwoofers

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/archive/index.php/t-845750.html

http://www.secinfo.com/$/SEC/Registrant.asp?CIK=1060390

ill try to dig some old info on the specs, i dont know if i have it any more, but i seemed to remember the speakers distorting easily, not sure witch ones. From the article referenced the implication of 93 -94 sens is the only specs listed, and from fixya they have a couple of specs.
 
Last edited:
2

20Glove

Audioholic
I love my sapphire st-2s. I am very satisfied with them and have been for 3 years now. They or al least mine don't distort at hi volumes at all. I crank them up alot and no problems. I have B&W and polks and Jamos and I like the sapphire best out of all of them and I got my st-2s for 200 on craigslist. Oh yeah I got the Jamos for 10 bucks as well. Happy listening......:)
jamie, do you have the ST2's Bi-amped? I do... maybe that could be it... not sure.

I do not have the Infinity's bi-amped and they do not distort at all. I am wondering if Bi-amping them is too much power for these speakers?

Anyone, jamie, bandphan, anyone, when I bi-amp I am sending double the watts to the speaker, is that correct? I have a 130 watt receiver hooked up to them, and they are 150 watt speakers... so maybe that is why?

Could I be ruining these speakers? ( I think I will have to start a post asking this question).

By the way, I do love them. They sound so good to me, but I am wondering if I change locations of these speakers and bring them down stairs to the room with hardwood floors if that would change my mind. Right now they are in a carpeted room. But where they are now... sound very good. Just would like to compare think it might be interesting.

Keep the posts coming.
 
J

jamie2112

Banned
I do not bi-amp them and like I said I have had no problems with distortion. That said I think you should try running them full range instead of bi amped, I crank them up all the time as I check final studio mixes that I'd done. I couldn't be happier with them. I paid 200 for them and as far as I am concerned I got a hell of a deal. Run them in full range and see if you get distorted sound.....best of luck
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
Could we get some pictures of the Sapphires? I have no idea what they even look like. My brief googling has not rendered many results.:(
 
2

20Glove

Audioholic
Could we get some pictures of the Sapphires? I have no idea what they even look like. My brief googling has not rendered many results.:(
I am trying to get some pics up... and cannot.

Not sure why.
 

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