outdoor screen size ??

[sawzalot]

I watched Monday Night Football outside with my projector and must say it was awesome , I said I would get pics but with so much going on I never had the chance, we had a fire pit going , bbq , cold brew on ice , 20 plus seats and this, my second attempt to go BIG outside, for the screen I used a gray shiny tarp, it worked, many many wrinkles and just not as good as it should have been. Here are some of my questions based on the projector which is as follows,
Sony vpl-hs60a 1200 lumens.
I want to go as big as possible, I played around with the projector scale but this is all new to me so I don't get it so much. I would like next weeks game to play on a 9 x 16 if possible. I can get a blackout cloth in that size as a closeout with a border and grommets plus balled bungees , all for about 100 and change. make a wooden frame to hang on the side of an out building and try to fill the screen with said projector seating distance can be whatever but will I be pushing this unit to the limits for throw distance,is the screen material worth buying, is it too big, you guys get it I'm sure. I am just pumped up about making this happen next Thursday as we all had a great time, Thanks for input and advice , sawz.

 

[lsiberian]

Sports certainly allow you to use lower lumens projector outdoors especially at night. For that size I'd probably just mix black widow screen paint and hang a sheet of drywall or thin plywood. I definitely suggest the painted panel route over trying to stretch a screen that large.

 

[ImcLoud]

That sounds like a lot of work when you can buy something like these...

Amazon.com : MGM Mgm-84Pop 84-Inch Pop-Up Projection Screen : Electronics this one is a cheapo pop up, I would go for the full inflatables...
or
Amazon.com: Giant Gemmy Airblown Inflatable Movie Screen - 14.4 Ft: Electronics

a freind of mine has the regular old style gemmy, the one above is the giant gemmy, and he uses this bogus cheap projector he bought for $250 and to be honest with you, it looks really good... For speakers he uses a huge center channel that I don't know what brand it is but it has 2*"s driver 2 5" and a couple tweeters, and it has a plate amplifier in it, you can tell someone added the plate amp but it is a production speaker just huge center like 4 feet long, I have no idea what brand, its real veneer, must have been expensive, but now it gets thrown on the grass for outside parties...

edit - heres the one my buddy has, I didnt think they made them anymore... http://www.amazon.com/Gemmy-39121-32-Outdoor-Inflatable-12-Inch/dp/B000TLDCRS/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1379024368&sr=8-5&keywords=inflatable+screen

I am going to build one one day, I figure a projector, a giant gemmy, then mount the progector on a little handtruck and build the spaekrs and amp all into the hand truck so I can just wheel it out.. Picture that sitting on a float in the inground pool watching a movie on a 16ft screen... Welcome to america

 

[sawzalot]

I like the idea of a wooden frame with a grommet type screen , not a lot of work at all and very easy to store for next time, I am just concerned about the size, throw distance and clarity , I think it should work though.

 

[BMXTRIX]

You are worried about the wrong things.

There is one thing that matters outdoors on a large screen - brightness.

This isn't home theater, you aren't inside with a properly setup home theater, you are outdoors with street lights, moonlight, and other uncontrollable lighting situations. You would be lucky to achieve a 500:1 contrast ratio, and sports don't demand the same high contrast that a good movie asks for.

But, what sports does like is lumens. More light on the screen is a key part of the experience.

Now, your projector isn't 1,200 lumens. On the day you bought it, the first few hours of use, in worst quality, uncalibrated mode, it may have been able to deliver 1,200 lumens... maybe. But, in typical usage mode after some lamp wear, you are more likely getting 600 lumens or less out of that projector. So, your image quality will be significantly impacted by this. Very significantly perhaps.

It comes down to some math, but a 16'x9' screen is 144 square feet. At 15 lumens per square foot, you would want a projector which can output at least 2,000 lumens, and preferably 3,000 lumens after calibration. That's not a terribly bright business class projector, but is a very bright home theater projector. Since most home theater projectors run on about a 8' width (110" diagonal) you are talking about a screen that is literally four times the size of the average home theater setup. So, you realistically need no less than four times the brightness of an average home theater projector.

Now, that bit said, actual clarity - image quality through resolution - will follow the standard rules of projection. That is, middle seating should be 1.5x the screen width. So, a 16' wide screen should have optimal seating at about 24' away from the screen. That is the same as sitting 12' from a 8' wide screen in your home theater.

Most projectors have a lens system which allows them to focus on a screen up to 300" in diagonal or so in size. So, focus should not be an issue at all.

At the end of the day, I WOULD get the material you are looking at. The price is right, and building a frame isn't that pricey and will give you very good results. You will have fun with this setup, but you may end up wishing for more lumens. You DO want white material that is not shiny! Shiny materials for screens don't properly diffuse the light which is what you want/need for a decent image and a grey screen, while it can slightly improve contrast, will also dull an image, which is not at all desirably for a large setup. Hence, I don't think you've seen a movie theater in your life which uses anything other than a white screen.

Should you really enjoy doing a large screen outdoor setup, then you may decide to get serious with it by mating a proper projector to the screen size, in which case I would look at this list:
Find Projectors By Feature

That list represents 1080p projectors with at least 4,000 lumens which are under $3,000 and have a HDMI input on them. Right now I would probably recommend this model:
Optoma Projectors: Optoma EH501 DLP projector

With 5,000 lumens, decent contrast, HDMI input... It will handle the screen size you have and leave room for calibration of colors so that you get the best image possible while still having a bright, punchy image on screen.

 

[sawzalot]

Since the price is right for the screen material and the size may be too large for my current projector, could I and or should I just buy it and not worry about filling the whole screen at this time? I understand the whole degradation of lumens with my projector but at this time I am really just experimenting with the whole idea, thanks BMXTRIX for tour input, sawz.

 

[ImcLoud]

I like the idea of a wooden frame with a grommet type screen , not a lot of work at all and very easy to store for next time, I am just concerned about the size, throw distance and clarity , I think it should work though.

Why not the inflatable type?
No work, super easy to store, almost same price, wood is heavy doesn't like to get wet, think about setup times, ect, my buddies inflatable is super simple, just plug it in and its there... then roll it up like a air mattress, plus you have a resale value vs a pile of wood you will have to pay to get rid of..

 

[sawzalot]

Why not the inflatable type?
No work, super easy to store, almost same price, wood is heavy doesn't like to get wet, think about setup times, ect, my buddies inflatable is super simple, just plug it in and its there... then roll it up like a air mattress, plus you have a resale value vs a pile of wood you will have to pay to get rid of..

If theres one material thats always readily available at my place its wood and I mean wood of all types, the inflatable just seems too over the top for me, we shall see and thanks for all of the input, I appreciate it greatly.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Considering the price it certainly wouldn't be bad to get the large material and use it. If you enjoy it and want more punch from the image, you will need more lumens which means a different projector, but that can happen later.

 

[sawzalot]

Considering the price it certainly wouldn't be bad to get the large material and use it. If you enjoy it and want more punch from the image, you will need more lumens which means a different projector, but that can happen later.

I kinda thought you would say that, I already ordered the blackout screen with black border and grommets installed for just over 100.00 add in 19.00 for a large bag of bungee balls and I am still way less than I could find on a screen one half that size, the site says I bought the last one so I guess we do find bargains once in a while.( it may have a stain or two as it was a remnant but they guarantee mild detergent will remove it in seconds,or my money back, I am fine with that.)
I already built the 2 x 4 frame with corner gussets and pre drilled counter sunk screw at each corner a spreader board at the center for correct tension just waiting for dark lol I mean just waiting on the screen material and I will stretch it around the frame and bungee it up snug I have two eye hooks at the desired height on the out building and two in line on the top 2 x 4 with a few links of chain and s hooks, two long stakes with eye hooks are in the ground at each end to pull a longer bungee to each one for any winds/breezes I think it will be cool. the frame will take all of about 15 minutes max to take apart and stow away in the woodshop , I dont know how long the whole screen stretch will take, that remains to be scene (seen).

 

[sawzalot]

I am at it again with football via projector outside , overall the pq is fine for what it is now my problem is setting up for sound. I usually take my pioneer 1015 outside with the hd box from motorola and the occasional blu ray player , well it is getting old as the receiver is too heavy and I dont need all it has to offer so please give me a suggestion in a lightweight application to plug in an HD box and also a blu ray player and the power up my JBL theater speakers mostly just left and right fronts but maybe four speakers some time which would be left & right front and left & right rear via b speaker switch not actually as surrounds , just more sound period. 150 to 200 watts but lightweight ???

 

[sawzalot]

You are worried about the wrong things.

There is one thing that matters outdoors on a large screen - brightness.

This isn't home theater, you aren't inside with a properly setup home theater, you are outdoors with street lights, moonlight, and other uncontrollable lighting situations. You would be lucky to achieve a 500:1 contrast ratio, and sports don't demand the same high contrast that a good movie asks for.

But, what sports does like is lumens. More light on the screen is a key part of the experience.

Now, your projector isn't 1,200 lumens. On the day you bought it, the first few hours of use, in worst quality, uncalibrated mode, it may have been able to deliver 1,200 lumens... maybe. But, in typical usage mode after some lamp wear, you are more likely getting 600 lumens or less out of that projector. So, your image quality will be significantly impacted by this. Very significantly perhaps.

It comes down to some math, but a 16'x9' screen is 144 square feet. At 15 lumens per square foot, you would want a projector which can output at least 2,000 lumens, and preferably 3,000 lumens after calibration. That's not a terribly bright business class projector, but is a very bright home theater projector. Since most home theater projectors run on about a 8' width (110" diagonal) you are talking about a screen that is literally four times the size of the average home theater setup. So, you realistically need no less than four times the brightness of an average home theater projector.

Now, that bit said, actual clarity - image quality through resolution - will follow the standard rules of projection. That is, middle seating should be 1.5x the screen width. So, a 16' wide screen should have optimal seating at about 24' away from the screen. That is the same as sitting 12' from a 8' wide screen in your home theater.

Most projectors have a lens system which allows them to focus on a screen up to 300" in diagonal or so in size. So, focus should not be an issue at all.

At the end of the day, I WOULD get the material you are looking at. The price is right, and building a frame isn't that pricey and will give you very good results. You will have fun with this setup, but you may end up wishing for more lumens. You DO want white material that is not shiny! Shiny materials for screens don't properly diffuse the light which is what you want/need for a decent image and a grey screen, while it can slightly improve contrast, will also dull an image, which is not at all desirably for a large setup. Hence, I don't think you've seen a movie theater in your life which uses anything other than a white screen.

Should you really enjoy doing a large screen outdoor setup, then you may decide to get serious with it by mating a proper projector to the screen size, in which case I would look at this list:
Find Projectors By Feature

That list represents 1080p projectors with at least 4,000 lumens which are under $3,000 and have a HDMI input on them. Right now I would probably recommend this model:
Optoma Projectors: Optoma EH501 DLP projector

With 5,000 lumens, decent contrast, HDMI input... It will handle the screen size you have and leave room for calibration of colors so that you get the best image possible while still having a bright, punchy image on screen.

I am still at it with the outdoor viewing , see above post. I have a question for BMX - what do you think about this projector -Optoma HD25LV 1080P 3500 Lumens with 3D using DLP technology and HDMI inputs-
I was able to pick this up brand new for just under 450.00 I can return it if it is not worth the investment but it triples the lumens I currently use , please give me some insight again Thanks sawz.

 

[sawzalot]

I would still love to hear some thoughts on what to use in a light weight amp/pre amp to power my speakers when set up outside , needs to accept a blu ray player and an hd converter box have the power to give decent sound outside and needs to be on the lighter weight side for easy in and out , putting this all away after a night of football gets tiresome the pioneer receiver I use outside is a beast weight wise and just has to be replaced.

 

[BMXTRIX]

I am still at it with the outdoor viewing , see above post. I have a question for BMX - what do you think about this projector -Optoma HD25LV 1080P 3500 Lumens with 3D using DLP technology and HDMI inputs-
I was able to pick this up brand new for just under 450.00 I can return it if it is not worth the investment but it triples the lumens I currently use , please give me some insight again Thanks sawz.

The HD25LV comes in around 1,100 lumens once calibrated properly for color output. While it can hit a peak brightness with white light somewhere near (but not at) the 3,500 claimed lumens, it can't come close to hitting anywhere near that number with actual video content that has color. This is part of the failing of DLP and why they no longer publish color wheel speeds. They would actually be more easily caught in their lie.

The far lower light output rating of the W1070 is actually a fair bit brighter, and more accurate than the HD25LV because it uses a 6 segment RGB/RGB color wheel over a 2x color wheel with a clear segment like the HD25LV does.

If you want bright, then the Epson 3500 or the BenQ HC1200 deliver over 2,000 lumens after proper calibration.

Still, for the price you paid, I'm not sure I would return it. That's a good price, and if it looks good for your setup, then it's not a bad projector for sure.

 

[Strudelbaum]

Hi all...

I've been holding my breath reading these posts starting like two years ago. All this water under the bridge has floated a lot of improvements and new technologies to projectors (and hopefully screens, too).

I will be ordering my first projector in a month, along with an outdoor screen. The setup will be permanently stationed on my covered but otherwise open terrace here in southern Spain. The motorized screen will be hanging from the beams and the viewing distance can be anything up to 20'. The space is about 12' wide.

I will only watch movies during the darkest hours but would still require all the lumens available at around 2,500 bucks. Not going for the ultimate I still do not intend to purchase a new set in three years.

Would someone please help get me going? I really want to to be confident hitting that "buy now" -button.

Thank you.

 

[BMXTRIX]

Something like the Epson 3500 can really deliver solid lumens for a 120"+ screen diagonal for after dark viewing without much headache.

Your outdoor setup is potentially a bigger issue. Projectors are sensitive electronics. While it may be covered, it will still be open to heat/cool/humidity issues. Consider how long a laptop may last in the same environment, and that's realistically what you should expect from a projector.

 

[Strudelbaum]

Thanks a lot! Looks like I need to rig the projector so it can be taken inside when not in use. And, Epson it is, too.

I need to take a serious look at the screens, too. The only type I can think of is a roll-up thing and since the ceiling (it's a lean-to) is about 12' high on the average it just has to be motorised.

 

[jennicalexica]

I use a screen size of 120" for outdoors and its almost a little bit too big. Granted my yard is average in size so the viewing distance is not the largest.