Network multiple recievers?

[bferrell]

I just bought a house with whole-house in ceiling sound, but it is divided, the first floor is one zone with a cabinet, the upstairs a second zone wired to the master bedroom, and the garage a third separate zone. I would like to be able to play the same source to all three, without pulling a bunch of extra wire. Each of these has a media cabinet area with ethernet wiring, so it would be cool to get a networking reciever that can output audio over the network to another receiver to play. I suspect this available somewhere today, but I can't seem to find the right search term to find it. I've been looking at the Onkyo TX-NR616 which has good networking and bluetooth/mobile app functionality, but I couldn't find anything in the manual about sending audio out over the network. Any idea?

 

[avengineer]

Networked AVRs do not "output" audio over a network, as a server would. AVRs are considered "players" in that they can play audio streamed over your network from either an outside source like Pandora, or a media server on your home net. Applications like iTunes have a built-in method to play to multiple destinations (in iTunes it's "Airplay", and your Airplay capable AVR will show up in iTunes as a speaker/destination). If you're not using iTunes, there are ways of setting up network devices to play from a central library. iTunes has an advantage of playing the same audio in sync to different destinations.

Sonos has several solutions too worth looking at. It's very neat and simple, but more costly per zone in some cases.

 

[tmurnin]

I would second the Sonos recommendation, but I'm not sure I understand the wiring. Are you saying each of these zones are wired to a different "home" location? Meaning your first zone has all the speaker wire terminating in a cabinet, the second in the master BR and the third in a garage? If so, you will need a Sonos Connect for each zone and potentially a separate amp for each zone. Sonos has a "Connect + Amp" device that has a small amp capable of driving small speakers (this may work fine for your garage), but I wouldn't recommend it for more than that.

If I'm wrong and you have three separate zones where the wires all terminate in one single location, then you could work with a multi-channel amp and a single Sonos Connect and add additional Connects over time if you want to play different sources in eeach different zone.

 

[tmurnin]

Apple's Airport Express is also a good way to play a single source across multiple zones and it's cheaper than the Sonos solution (albeit more limited in function). Get a $99 Express for each area, plug it into an amp and you can stream iTunes from your computer to all of those zones. It's limited to iTunes output (so no Pandora, Spotify, etc.) but it's about 1/3 the cost of a Sonos solution.

 

[bferrell]

Yes, each of the zones has wiring terminating in a different location (wired circa 2000). There is a media cabinet on the main floor for the speakers on level one, a panel in the master bedroom for the second floor, and a panel in the garage for the garage speakers.

If I understand correctly, this is what I think I want to do. Right now only the main floor has a receiver, and older Denon. I'd like to get a Sonos Connect for it, so I can output iPhone/iPad/iTunes media to it. This location has ethernet, so that unit can be the base of a Sonos network. The only thing I'm unsure about is what I can directly output from my iPhone. The app says I can send "iTunes media" to the Sonos, but if I use a different third party Podcast app, for instance, I'm guessing I'm out of luck, the app will probably only grab media from the standard iTunes folder on the Mac or iPhone/iPad. Therefore I'm tempted to get an Airport Express so I can use Airplay to send whatever output from whatever App I want from my device to the Sonos.

Since the other 2 zones have nothing hooked to them, I'm tempted to get Sonos Connect:Amp for those. I could then play iTunes directly to them / play different sources from the main floor unit, as I understand it, or play the same output as the main floor Sonos. Therefore the only reason for an Airplay Express on these two, if I understand correctly, would be to play different iPad/iPhone streams (say from my wife's phone) directly to these sources.


If I understand the Airport Express, I could use it with my existing receiver to output my phone to the main floor, but it requires something to drive the speakers in the other zones, correct? The one open item in my mind is the driving several Airport Express units in each zone at the same time. I've not tried that before, in my experience I've only used one Airplay "out" from my phone at a time. Are you saying that AirPlay will allow me to select three Airport Express units at the same time from one iPad or iPhone? If so, that's fabulous, and means I could just pick up really cheap receivers and connect each of them to Airplay Expresses, correct? In that situation would the Sonos' provide me any value?

 

[bferrell]

Apple's Airport Express is also a good way to play a single source across multiple zones and it's cheaper than the Sonos solution (albeit more limited in function). Get a $99 Express for each area, plug it into an amp and you can stream iTunes from your computer to all of those zones. It's limited to iTunes output (so no Pandora, Spotify, etc.) but it's about 1/3 the cost of a Sonos solution.

You say "limited to iTunes output", but I can use Airplay from my iPhone, so if I have Spotify on my phone or Mac, I can do this, I just need that device to control, the Express can't do it on it's own, correct?

 

[bferrell]

One more piece of clarity that I think I just got reading the Sonos Airplay webpage.

I can group several Airport Express units and send the same stream from my Mac/phone to all of them, but I can't send different streams to each from one device via Airplay (though the Sonos App could do this from my phone/one device).

Therefore, I guess the big question is, if I'm going to use Sonos at all (because it's a good way to power the speakers in the other two zones, and provide a good set of sources), does Airplay add anything. I do like being able to use the native apps to select and control the output, but I'm not sure yet if that's a game changer, or nice to have. I guess I need to play with the Sonos app and see what it can really do.

Brett

 

[bferrell]

One more piece of data for airplay, it seems a lot of folks aren't totally satisfied with the Sonos app's ability to playlist, etc., so using Airplay would let me use the native apps easily, so I think I'm leaning that way.

 

[jcunwired]

The best solution to your problem is Logitech Squeezebox. It's unfortunately a retired product from logitech, but there are still many available. With a Squeezebox (classic or touch) at each receiver and library on a computer in your home you can sync audio to multiple zones. Additionally, there are several Logitech and third party apps for Spotify, Pandora and several other services. Another benefit, there is a great Squeezebox app for both Android and iOS, allowing for remote playback management.

 

[avengineer]

All your observations about Airplay are correct. You can stream to multiple devices (in sync), but you can't stream multiple streams from the same device. Turns out, that's not really a big deal for most people.

Sonos has some advantages in terms of product design and packaging, and ease of installation. It also has the benefit of generating different streams to each device, but form the same library. This is because it's only looking at the iTunes library, and not using iTunes itself. There are some issues, so you have to weigh cost/benefit.

I promote Sonos because it's a well publicized brand, recognized well, and customers ask for it. However, when it gets to brass tacks, Airplay via Airport Express, and other Airplay enabled devices covers 80% of the need at a fraction of the cost. In some cases I can use low cost amps with any speakers I want for even more flexibility. That's why I still say the cost per room for the Airplay solution is lower than Sonos, unless the customer is doing a self-install.

I don't recommend discontinued products because of the potentially short product file and poor support.

 

[tmurnin]

Airport Express is definitely the cheaper option - if you have an amp in each location to drive your speakers. If not, you will have to figure the cost of an amp plus the airport vs the cost of a Sonos Connect:Amp. I'm not sure what third party program you're using for podcasts, but Sonos supports a lot more than just iTunes natively (I'm not a big podcast listener but I use Spotify, Pandora and a few other music services on Sonos). You could output from your podcast app to the Airport via Airplay if you decide to go that route.

I've not had any issue with playlists and Sonos, but I tend to manage playlists on my computer in iTunes and use Sonos just for playback.

Before you commit to a big investment, i would buy one Sonos Connect:Amp and try it out - both in terms of the services it offers as well as whether its sufficient to power your speakers. If it can't drive the speakers to the levels you want, that may move you back to the Airport direction since you would need a standalone amp regardless. You will also need a Sonos Bridge to establish a wired connection to your home network. The bridge then establishes a separate wireless Sonos network for your other devices.

ive never used a Squeezebox personally, although many on these boards are positive about that device, I just can't comment on any personal experiences with it.

 

[bferrell]

Thanks for all of your advive, it's been EXTREMELY helpful.

 

[jcunwired]

I don't recommend discontinued products because of the potentially short product file and poor support.

If you're speaking of Squeezebox, there is still a very active community developing and supporting plugins to extend capabilities. If it works, and works well, community support is all that's necessary.

I NEVER recommend proprietary systems, but that's subject for a blog post, not a discussion forum.