Need help with boomy bass in a less than ideal space.

S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
This is my first post in this forum so bear with me. If there is a better thread to post this in please let me know.

I searched through many of the posts on bass management and none seemed to help. I have a room that is 20X12. It has a carpeted concrete floor, wood panel walls (yes we plan to replace them) and a 7.5ft high drop ceiling. A pretty typical 1970's basement. I recently purchased some used home theater equipment to upgrade from what I was previously using for nearly 8 years(Philips fr 996). I have an Integra DTR 40.3 paired with a Pinnacle sub 150 12" and some Phillips surround speakers (no they aren't the best but they sound fine for this space). Even after doing the crawl I have to set the sub volume to nearly it's minimum setting and turn down the sub output in the receiver to -10 to get a decent volume without the sub being too boomy. The surround speakers are plenty loud even at a volume of 50-60 but the bass overpowers everything. I don't have the microphone to try the Audyssey auto EQ but I do have one ordered and it should be here by this weekend.

Is the sub too much for this space? Do I need to adjust the sub EQ settings or is it still a placement issue?

I have my blu ray set to output bitstream via HDMI and the receiver set to a lossless format if possible. If not then I use THX cinema.

Thanks in advance.
 
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BoredSysAdmin

BoredSysAdmin

Audioholic Slumlord
Did you set sub distance on the avr settings? Do you have spl meter?
is that 20x12x7.5 space is sealed by walls/doors or is it open to other spaces?
Sub is not too much the space. It's ported 12" sub with 150w rms amp.
If you've done the crawl correctly then Audyssey is you next best bet.
After that - you're gonna need a new sub. Your current sub rated for f3 of 30hz - I think even low-mid range sub should do mid 20ths at the least
 
S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
The room is closed with a door There are 2 small windows but they are treated with heavy drapes. I do have an SPL. I have no plans to purchase another sub anytime soon. Just looking to get rid of the boomy sound and I will be happy with it. It has more than enough power for our needs. I will wait for the mic to arrive and try that. I wasn't sure if Audyssey would help since I have read mixed reviews on it with subwoofers.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Looked at the manual for that sub. I think long term you are going to need a new sub, possibly something sealed.
 
M

MrBoat

Audioholic Ninja
Have you tried sealing the port on the sub?

ETA: Above poster beat me to it.
 
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TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Also yes I did set all the distances.
What version of this sub do you have? It is used so we need to know. The current version is a ported sub with an F3 of 30 Hz. It is in a box of around 1 cu.ft internally, which I suspect is too small.

The earlier version was not only sealed but an acoustic suspension design. This type of design is not only sealed but uses a high Q driver with a very floppy suspension and the entire restoring force comes from the air in the box. This is a bad design and if you have that it explains why all you get is boom. I did note that a reviewer said this sub was easily driven into frequency doubling.

I would say your room dimensions are satisfactory. In addition unless the wood paneling is fastened to sheet rock, that type of construction is bass loosing and not boomy.

I would say you probably have a sub it is impossible to live with, especially if it that acoustic suspension horror.
 
S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
What version of this sub do you have? It is used so we need to know. The current version is a ported sub with an F3 of 30 Hz. It is in a box of around 1 cu.ft internally, which I suspect is too small.

The earlier version was not only sealed but an acoustic suspension design. This type of design is not only sealed but uses a high Q driver with a very floppy suspension and the entire restoring force comes from the air in the box. This is a bad design and if you have that it explains why all you get is boom. I did note that a reviewer said this sub was easily driven into frequency doubling.

I would say your room dimensions are satisfactory. In addition unless the wood paneling is fastened to sheet rock, that type of construction is bass loosing and not boomy.

I would say you probably have a sub it is impossible to live with, especially if it that acoustic suspension horror.

I am pretty sure this is the sub I have. http://www.pinnaclespeakers.com/pssub150a.html
It is ported. This sub when new cost far more than I would ever spend on one. I don't see a need to spend thousands of dollars on speakers. I have better things to spend my money on so again buying a new sub isn't an option nor is it a desire. I didn't have this issue with my older and less powerful sub in the same room. I have not tried plugging the port yet.
 
S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
Looked at the manual for that sub. I think long term you are going to need a new sub, possibly something sealed.
Since I just got this one I don't plan on spending more money on another. Unless you can recommend a better one for what I paid for this one which was $40
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Since I just got this one I don't plan on spending more money on another. Unless you can recommend a better one for what I paid for this one which was $40
That one looks like it might be the first one mentioned by TLS, so you might be OK there. $40 is a good deal for it.

LOL. That's why I said long term. EQ will probably get you part of the way, but changing the location will likely help as well. The "crawl" location normally works well, but in your situation it results in some odd room mode that will likely be cured by moving it even a foot or so from the current spot. Another thing can be your seating position within the room. Are you against the wall or further out into the room? In a basement, against the wall will be a very bad spot.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Since I just got this one I don't plan on spending more money on another. Unless you can recommend a better one for what I paid for this one which was $40
You get what you pay for. Try plugging the port. That will probably slug the sub. Cheap subs tend to be a real waste of space. Properly reproducing the lower frequencies is not a simple matter or cheap.

So your choice is simple get a better sub or put up with the one you bought.
 
j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
The one he linked shows acoustic suspension, so if so, it shouldn't have a port.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
The one he linked shows acoustic suspension, so if so, it shouldn't have a port.
I'm confused now. The one he linked is the acoustic suspension horror. He said his sub had a port, so most likely he does not have the one he linked.

If he has the sub he linked, then all it needs is a decent burial.
 
TLS Guy

TLS Guy

Seriously, I have no life.
Guessing it is this one if it has a port then, and it even mentions that the previous version was acoustic suspension. What you were talking about is likely why they changed the design lol.

http://www.pinnaclespeakers.com/dsub150.html
Looking at this closer, I have a feeling that they have used the same woofer! The description is identical. Sounds as if they had so many complaints they drilled a hole in the box and bought a bunch of paper towel or toilet roll centers cheap. If that is so and that is a high Q woofer in a tuned box that size, it will boom like crazy.

This reminds me of an answer the great Gilbert Briggs, the founder of Wharfedale, gave when I was a kid reading a Q and A column he had. The reader asked his advice of a speaker that sounded better with the back taken off. Gilbert told the respondent "to leave the back off as there was no point in nailing down the coffin!"
 
S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
That one looks like it might be the first one mentioned by TLS, so you might be OK there. $40 is a good deal for it.

LOL. That's why I said long term. EQ will probably get you part of the way, but changing the location will likely help as well. The "crawl" location normally works well, but in your situation it results in some odd room mode that will likely be cured by moving it even a foot or so from the current spot. Another thing can be your seating position within the room. Are you against the wall or further out into the room? In a basement, against the wall will be a very bad spot.
Not much choice in a room this size but the couch is about a foot from the back wall. The TV is on the long wall with the couch opposite. I made a crude drawing with basic layout to show couch and subwoofer placement.
 

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j_garcia

j_garcia

Audioholic Jedi
Rectangular rooms it is normally better to have the system oriented facing the short wall, but that doesn't usually work out layout wise in most rooms. A foot away from the wall is better than up against it. Have enough room behind the couch to place the sub there? With it near the listening position, it may help.
 
S

SatcomRanger

Enthusiast
Rectangular rooms it is normally better to have the system oriented facing the short wall, but that doesn't usually work out layout wise in most rooms. A foot away from the wall is better than up against it. Have enough room behind the couch to place the sub there? With it near the listening position, it may help.
I will try moving it around some later today. I built a new and longer cable to try it in different locations.
 

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