S

sterling shoote

Audioholic Field Marshall
Seems there's a new love for listening to music recorded to LP's. So, not wanting to miss out on this love fest, I fired up my 40 year old turntable with a brand new cartridge which I read would give me all my ears could handle. I thought, why not take a Rolling Stones album for a spin with my dusted off outfit. I also thought why not compare the LP to the same tunes in fabulous AAC from my iTunes library. Well, I've got to tell ya Love In Vain does sound pretty dog gone good from the LP; but, the AAC file even sounds better. Getting the turntable back in action did bring back a lot of memories though, not just the snap, crackle, and pop memories but of the way it was when a guy had to have a Hi-Fi before anything else. Boy, have times changed. Today, its about having a huge music library of everything ever recorded since the beginning of recorded music at your finger tips on a cell phone. Wow! Simply amazing. I guess loving LP's today for me may indeed be a Love In Vain.
 
Last edited:
vsound5150

vsound5150

Audioholic
Seems there's a new love for listening to music recorded to LP's. So, not wanting to miss out on this love fest, I fired up my 40 year old turntable with a brand new cartridge which I read would give me all my ears could handle. I thought, why not take a Rolling Stones album for a spin with my dusted off outfit. I also thought why not compare the LP to the same tunes in fabulous AAC from my iTunes library. Well, I've got to tell ya Love In Vain does sound pretty dog gone good from the LP; but, the AAC file even sounds better. Getting the turntable back in action did bring back a lot of memories though, not just the snap, crackle, and pop memories but of the way it was when a guy had to have a Hi-Fi before anything else. Boy, have times changed. Today, its about having a huge music library of everything ever recorded since the beginning of recorded music at your finger tips on a cell phone. Wow! Simply amazing. I guess loving LP's today for me may indeed be a Love In Vain.
I recently jumped on the LP bandwagon picked up a used 1980's turntable my first ever and all the required tools. It's been an awesome experience tweaking the turntable, washing records, trying different tonearms and cartridges, etc.. I ordered an elliptical stylus hoping it will be more tame for older LP's, the audio-technica microline I'm using now seems too accurate and picks up every nook and cranny sound but on good clean LP's it sounds great.

I didn't know Love In Vain was by the Rolling Stones but it does ring a bell now. I listen to it all the time by Tesla such a cool song, can't wait to pickup some Rolling Stones albums.
 
Dan Madden

Dan Madden

Audioholic
The digital vs analog debate has raged for years with audiophiles and with the recent resurgence of vinyl, it has begun yet again. I'm 53 years old now and spun a lot of vinyl back in the day. In 1983, I bought my first CD player and first CD and spun Supertramp's "Breakfast in America" on it (On the same system) which I had listened to a thousand times on vinyl. My head was blown off at how good the CD sounded and I have never looked back since.
 
Bucknekked

Bucknekked

Audioholic Samurai
The digital vs analog debate has raged for years with audiophiles and with the recent resurgence of vinyl, it has begun yet again. I'm 53 years old now and spun a lot of vinyl back in the day. In 1983, I bought my first CD player and first CD and spun Supertramp's "Breakfast in America" on it (On the same system) which I had listened to a thousand times on vinyl. My head was blown off at how good the CD sounded and I have never looked back since.
I went to the home of a budding audiophile recently to listen to his setup. He had high end everything. 1,000's of dollars of gear. He wanted better sound from his system which was primarily fed by a pretty nice turntable. He asked me if spending a few grand on a new turntable would get him better sound. After listening to the pops, crackles and snaps on his record collection I said "maybe", but there's a better way to get all these 1,000's of dollars to sound better. Get a digital source.

Say what you want about the benefits of vinyl, and there are a lot of good things about vinyl, but a noise free CD is a pleasure to listen to. I too remember the noise, particularly in headphones, and a good quality CD is pure pleasure.

(editors note: no vinyl records were harmed in the expression of this opinion)
 
F

flippo

Full Audioholic
I will agree that digital is better UNLESS the digital is a victim of loudness wars.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
I went to the home of a budding audiophile recently to listen to his setup. He had high end everything. 1,000's of dollars of gear. He wanted better sound from his system which was primarily fed by a pretty nice turntable. He asked me if spending a few grand on a new turntable would get him better sound. After listening to the pops, crackles and snaps on his record collection I said "maybe", but there's a better way to get all these 1,000's of dollars to sound better. Get a digital source.

Say what you want about the benefits of vinyl, and there are a lot of good things about vinyl, but a noise free CD is a pleasure to listen to. I too remember the noise, particularly in headphones, and a good quality CD is pure pleasure.

(editors note: no vinyl records were harmed in the expression of this opinion)
Sounds like he'd benefit more from a good record cleaning machine....
 
S

sterling shoote

Audioholic Field Marshall
All,

I think most here understand "Love In Vain" meant no matter how much money you put into the means to enjoy LP's, rarely does the medium return the favor; therefore, the experience is more frustrating than it is satisfying.

Now, since beginning this thread, I've purchased another new cartridge which seems to retrieve and deliver everything there is to deliver from the groove. It's a Shure 97xE which only cost me about a hundred dollars. Thing is, I had purchased an Ortofon 2M Red cartridge a few days earlier, based on YouTube reviews; but, it did not satisfy, making my ears bleed from its harsh and inaccurate sound; and thus, it became the inspiration for this thread.

This made me wonder, how could anyone with decent ears suggest the Ortofon 2M Red was an upgrade to the Shure, which was what most of the YouTube videos alluded to. I came to the conclusion that perhaps these videos were not the amateur enthusiast productions that they were professed to be. This perception was reinforced with a look at reviews from verified buyers of both products posting on Amazon. At any rate, these are my last thoughts on the whole matter. One thing for sure, for my personality, enjoyment of LP's is not, it appears, good for my health, since it's raising my blood pressure with every snap, crackle and pop I cannot get rid of.
 
Last edited:
Bucknekked

Bucknekked

Audioholic Samurai
Buck, Tell your loaded friend if he is seriously wants to get much better table - get a http://elpj.com/.
I learn something everyday when I read stuff on AH. I had never heard of such a device although as soon as you read the description it would seem like an obvious solution. I bookmarked their website for future reference. Who knows? Someday somebody will come to the AH and a laser record player will be their hearts desire.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
All,

I think most here understand "Love In Vain" meant no matter how much money you put into the means to enjoy LP's, rarely does the medium return the favor; therefore, the experience is more frustrating than it is satisfying.

Now, since beginning this thread, I've purchased another new cartridge which seems to retrieve and deliver everything there is to deliver from the groove. It's a Shure 97xE which only cost me about a hundred dollars. Thing is, I had purchased an Ortofon 2M Red cartridge a few days earlier, based on YouTube reviews; but, it did not satisfy, making my ears bleed from its harsh and inaccurate sound; and thus, it became the inspiration for this thread.

This made me wonder, how could anyone with decent ears suggest the Ortofon 2M Red was an upgrade to the Shure, which was what most of the YouTube videos alluded to. I came to the conclusion that perhaps these videos were not the amateur enthusiast productions that they were professed to be. This perception was reinforced with a look at reviews from verified buyers of both products posting on Amazon. At any rate, these are my last thoughts on the whole matter. One thing for sure, for my personality, enjoyment of LP's is not, it appears, good for my health, since it's raising my blood pressure with every snap, crackle and pop I cannot get rid of.
I must say I have read a lot of recommendations for the Ortofon...maybe you need the blue or bronze colors to get somewhere. I also use a Shure 97xE these days, always liked my old V15s, too. Don't think I've tried an Ortofon, don't remember it at least but I've used Stanton, Empire and Grados. None of them are going to do much about surface noise IME. When I play vinyl it's more because I don't have a digital version, and more for nostalgia's sake than anything else.
 
Dave Blount

Dave Blount

Junior Audioholic
The digital vs analog debate has raged for years with audiophiles and with the recent resurgence of vinyl, it has begun yet again. I'm 53 years old now and spun a lot of vinyl back in the day. In 1983, I bought my first CD player and first CD and spun Supertramp's "Breakfast in America" on it (On the same system) which I had listened to a thousand times on vinyl. My head was blown off at how good the CD sounded and I have never looked back since.
Dan, I've got ten years on you, therefore I've been spinning 'black pizza' for a considerably longer period of time. As for the early days of CD blowing away analog, no way ! Save for a few good labels, Sheffield Labs, DMP, GRP, the majority of digital had yet to catch up. Granted the technology was their but initially the playback was ahead of the median. That was then, were now 35 years in and things are much better.

As for never ending analog vs. digital debate, the mastering speaks volumes. One can spend 'stupid' money for either option yet generally speaking it takes considerably more $$ to put a top notch analog rig together. Synergy of everything from table, tonearm, cartridge, phono-pre, isolation of table set up, all come into play. As for the pops and clicks issue, far more of a problem with respect to poor care and handling. Just last night I listen to Clapton's 'Slow Hand' Lp (40 years old), I might of detected 2 pops .......
 
D

Diesel57

Full Audioholic
While I still have a little over 600 vinyl LP's with the covers and LP's in pristine condition, the care & handling along with the up keep is challenging and the quality of the sound and care of cd's is as pleasant as a walk in the park but we all have our picks of what we enjoy most... as far as the snap, crackle and pop, just give me a bowl of Rice Krispies, I'll stomach that sound;)...
 
Last edited:
Dan Madden

Dan Madden

Audioholic
Dan, I've got ten years on you, therefore I've been spinning 'black pizza' for a considerably longer period of time. As for the early days of CD blowing away analog, no way ! Save for a few good labels, Sheffield Labs, DMP, GRP, the majority of digital had yet to catch up. Granted the technology was their but initially the playback was ahead of the median. That was then, were now 35 years in and things are much better.

As for never ending analog vs. digital debate, the mastering speaks volumes. One can spend 'stupid' money for either option yet generally speaking it takes considerably more $$ to put a top notch analog rig together. Synergy of everything from table, tonearm, cartridge, phono-pre, isolation of table set up, all come into play. As for the pops and clicks issue, far more of a problem with respect to poor care and handling. Just last night I listen to Clapton's 'Slow Hand' Lp (40 years old), I might of detected 2 pops .......

You are sooo right Dave !! I quickly found out in those days that in some cases, the vinyl actually sounded better than the CD. One big eye opener was Fleetwood Mac's "Rumors". When I bought the CD version of this album, I expected to be blown away and was really disappointed. I found out quickly that NOT all CD's were created equally in those days. However, my first encounter with CD listening to Supertramp's "Breakfast in America" was a real eye opener as to what CD audio could do. Nowadays because most everything is recorded digitally, most CD's sound very good. I too like the GRP stuff. Fantastic sounding recordings!!
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I recently jumped on the LP bandwagon picked up a used 1980's turntable my first ever and all the required tools. It's been an awesome experience tweaking the turntable, washing records, trying different tonearms and cartridges, etc.. I ordered an elliptical stylus hoping it will be more tame for older LP's, the audio-technica microline I'm using now seems too accurate and picks up every nook and cranny sound but on good clean LP's it sounds great.

I didn't know Love In Vain was by the Rolling Stones but it does ring a bell now. I listen to it all the time by Tesla such a cool song, can't wait to pickup some Rolling Stones albums.
'Love In Vain' isn't "by the Rolling Stones', it was covered by them- it's a Robert Johnson song.

If you hear a lot of background noise, deeply clean your LPs and if it persists, they're worn from years of having a stylus plowing dirt around he grooves. You should hear a little noise, but not a lot. I would look around for the record cleaners that leave as close to no residue as possible- I have never been a fan of using any kind of liquid on my LPs, having begun selling audio gear in '78, when the Discwasher was on its way to becoming the most common cleaner and when I saw the big smudge on he LPs that were cleaned by these, I stopped using any liquid- with excellent results. My LPs are still very quiet, with the exception of the ones I had when I got my first turntable, which was a real POS and the few that were cleaned with some kind of liquid. Recently, one of my reps told me to bring some LPs to his house for cleaning and IMO, they came back with more noise than before and he has an $800 cleaner. I'm in the process of repairing it (the pump for the cleaning fluid failed and inside, it looks more like a science fair project than something that would cost $800) but I A) won't buy one like it and B) won't clean many LPs with it, only the worst of the ones I no longer play because they have been replaced due to wear.

I would double check the setup of the cartridge- excessive noise can be an indication of the stylus not being in the correct position or the tracking force may not be correct- it usually works best near the upper limit stated by the manufacturer. Good job on the AT Microline- I always liked those.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
WRT surface noise- never underestimate the ability of the human mind to ignore extraneous sounds when we're fully involved with listening to something.
 
S

sterling shoote

Audioholic Field Marshall
'Love In Vain' isn't "by the Rolling Stones', it was covered by them- it's a Robert Johnson song.

If you hear a lot of background noise, deeply clean your LPs and if it persists, they're worn from years of having a stylus plowing dirt around he grooves. You should hear a little noise, but not a lot. I would look around for the record cleaners that leave as close to no residue as possible- I have never been a fan of using any kind of liquid on my LPs, having begun selling audio gear in '78, when the Discwasher was on its way to becoming the most common cleaner and when I saw the big smudge on he LPs that were cleaned by these, I stopped using any liquid- with excellent results. My LPs are still very quiet, with the exception of the ones I had when I got my first turntable, which was a real POS and the few that were cleaned with some kind of liquid. Recently, one of my reps told me to bring some LPs to his house for cleaning and IMO, they came back with more noise than before and he has an $800 cleaner. I'm in the process of repairing it (the pump for the cleaning fluid failed and inside, it looks more like a science fair project than something that would cost $800) but I A) won't buy one like it and B) won't clean many LPs with it, only the worst of the ones I no longer play because they have been replaced due to wear.

I would double check the setup of the cartridge- excessive noise can be an indication of the stylus not being in the correct position or the tracking force may not be correct- it usually works best near the upper limit stated by the manufacturer. Good job on the AT Microline- I always liked those.
O.K., so, how do you clean without "using any liquid for excellent results"?
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
O.K., so, how do you clean without "using any liquid for excellent results"?
I keep the cloth on the cleaner free of the mixture of liquid and dust which is almost like sandpaper and it doesn't dissolve immediately, as well as removing the dust immediately. As long as nothing beside dust gets on the surface, it's easy to remove with just the directional fibers. I ALWAYS keep the cover closed, I ALWAYS put the LPs in the jacket when I'm done, I NEVER touch the surface with my hands and I NEVER loan my albums because I have seen the way others handle their own. Granted, I haven't seen more than a few people touch an LP in decades, but when LPs were the typical software, I was amazed by the way people molested them.
 

Latest posts

newsletter

  • RBHsound.com
  • BlueJeansCable.com
  • SVS Sound Subwoofers
  • Experience the Martin Logan Montis
Top