In-Ceiling Sub Build

[GO-NAD!]

I've started constructing the enclosures for my pair of in-ceiling subwoofers. I have all the pieces of MDF cut to size. Just need to cut out the excess material for the bracing, driver holes and port opening. Then, assemble and radius the corners in the slot vents. It's practically finished!

I'm using Dayton RSS265HF 10" drivers that Annunaki kindly modeled and procured for me. I'm going with 10 inchers instead of 12, so that the enclosures will fit in the space between ceiling joists. Plus, these subs are for my 2-channel system - music only - so the deepest extension isn't necessary.

Since these enclosures will be installed in the attic, enclosure volume won't be a restriction. However, it took a lot of head scratching, crawling around in the attic and ripped up sketches to get the dimensions right, so that they will fit beneath the slope of the roof.

I was originally planning to get an EP 2000 to power them, but a guy who lives near me is selling an EP2500, which he says is in mint condition, for a good price. So, I think I'll go with that. It's massive overkill for my application, but it's much cheaper than buying a new EP2000. I'll just use the power I need from it. Who knows - some day I may decide to build a killer HT sub and that amp would be ideal. Then, I'd look for a smaller amp for the 2-channel subs.

As I make progress, I'll post photos. At this point, a pile of cut up MDF isn't terribly photogenic....

 

[GO-NAD!]

Some Photos

Well, one of the enclosures is just about complete. I still need to add some mineral wool, attach the side, cover the screw holes in the baffle and do some sanding around the port opening. The baffle will be the only visible part after it's installed.

It's turned out pretty well so far, IMHO. The only real hiccup had to do with the driver. Don't know what kind of fasteners are meant to be used with this driver, but the smallest propel nuts I could find were 14"-20, which means 1/4"-20 bolts, which means the bolt holes in the driver were just a little bit too small. So, I bored them out without any problems. But, the mounting flange isn't overly wide, so when the propel nuts were inserted into the holes I drilled into the baffle, the nut flanges overlapped the driver hole, as you can see in the photo. The sides of the driver fouled on the nut flanges when I lowered it into the hole. This was also fixed fairly easily, by grinding off the nut flanges flush with the edge of the driver opening.

I had considered assembling both enclosures simultaneously, in an assembly line-type setup. This could save time with tool setup and so on. However, my shop isn't very big and that would make it very awkward to try, not to mention somewhat hazardous. Besides, if I screwed something up on one, I didn't want to repeat the same mistake on the other. So, I'm willing to take the hit in extra assembly time.

This thing is a bit heavy, so after I cut the holes in the ceiling think I'll attach a pulley to a roof rafter in order to pull it into the attic. After they are installed, I may add some external bracing, especially along the top, above the vent, which isn't really braced at all right now. I'll post more photos when they're both complete and ready for installation.

Any comments or suggestions are welcome! Unless, of course, you suggest I tear it apart and start over....

 

[annunaki]

Well, one of the enclosures is just about complete. I still need to add some mineral wool, attach the side, cover the screw holes in the baffle and do some sanding around the port opening. The baffle will be the only visible part after it's installed.

It's turned out pretty well so far, IMHO. The only real hiccup had to do with the driver. Don't know what kind of fasteners are meant to be used with this driver, but the smallest propel nuts I could find were 14"-20, which means 1/4"-20 bolts, which means the bolt holes in the driver were just a little bit too small. So, I bored them out without any problems. But, the mounting flange isn't overly wide, so when the propel nuts were inserted into the holes I drilled into the baffle, the nut flanges overlapped the driver hole, as you can see in the photo. The sides of the driver fouled on the nut flanges when I lowered it into the hole. This was also fixed fairly easily, by grinding off the nut flanges flush with the edge of the driver opening.

I had considered assembling both enclosures simultaneously, in an assembly line-type setup. This could save time with tool setup and so on. However, my shop isn't very big and that would make it very awkward to try, not to mention somewhat hazardous. Besides, if I screwed something up on one, I didn't want to repeat the same mistake on the other. So, I'm willing to take the hit in extra assembly time.

This thing is a bit heavy, so after I cut the holes in the ceiling think I'll attach a pulley to a roof rafter in order to pull it into the attic. After they are installed, I may add some external bracing, especially along the top, above the vent, which isn't really braced at all right now. I'll post more photos when they're both complete and ready for installation.

Any comments or suggestions are welcome! Unless, of course, you suggest I tear it apart and start over....

Nice start so far. It looks quite good.

The placement of the brace right at the port opening inside the enclosure some. This will be very minor however, probably .25hz or so.

Also, the wide flat part or flange of those mounting nuts is supposed to be on the inside of the enclosure. it is designed to sandwich the mdf between the woofer's frame & the flange from the nut.

Other than that it looks quite nice.

Great work!!!

 

[GO-NAD!]

Nice start so far. It looks quite good.

The placement of the brace right at the port opening inside the enclosure some. This will be very minor however, probably .25hz or so.

Also, the wide flat part or flange of those mounting nuts is supposed to be on the inside of the enclosure. it is designed to sandwich the mdf between the woofer's frame & the flange from the nut.

Other than that it looks quite nice.

Great work!!!

I did wonder about the brace placement right at the inside opening of the port. Guess I should've asked....

Actually, the nut flanges are on the inside. I just flipped the baffle over before taking the photo. I couldn't get the camera to focus when the baffle was right way facing up. I had just screwed the baffle to the enclosure, without glue, before cutting the port opening and driver opening, just in case I screwed it up. I screwed n' glued it later, after the photo.

Thanks for the input!

 

[annunaki]

I did wonder about the brace placement right at the inside opening of the port. Guess I should've asked....

Actually, the nut flanges are on the inside. I just flipped the baffle over before taking the photo. I couldn't get the camera to focus when the baffle was right way facing up. I had just screwed the baffle to the enclosure, without glue, before cutting the port opening and driver opening, just in case I screwed it up. I screwed n' glued it later, after the photo.

Thanks for the input!

I saw the brace through the opening and thought it was attached. Cool!

 

[GO-NAD!]

I saw the brace through the opening and thought it was attached. Cool!

I suppose it was an easy assumption to make. I may be new to speaker building, but cabinetry, I have sussed out. That said, I'll probably screw up the next one royally!

 

[annunaki]

Any more progress here chief?

I am going to be doing one of these drivers for a customer now in a basement finishing project. I am starting tomorrow or Wed.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Any more progress here chief?

I am going to be doing one of these drivers for a customer now in a basement finishing project. I am starting tomorrow or Wed.

The enclosures are pretty much finished. I have to leave one side off of each, until my binding posts arrive from parts express (should be any day now). The binding posts have to be installed at the opposite end from the driver hole, due to the location of the vent and mounting brackets. I wouldn't be able to reach that far from the hole, to run the internal driver wiring so I have to leave the side off until I get the wiring/posts installed.

Also in my P.E. order are RCA compression connectors, RCA/XLR adaptors, grill cloth and guides. I intend to make my line level cables using RG6, so that I can get perfect lengths and be able to make more, if I move my components around.

My DCX has arrived (just have to pick it up), but still waiting on the EP2000 - should be any day.

Once all the bits and pieces arrive, I'll set the subs up in the living room and test the whole works. I'd rather make sure everything works correctly before I go through the effort of installing the subs in the attic.

I hope to be doen within the next 2 - 3 weeks. I don't get much time during the week to work on this project. Any major progress only happens on weekends - and that's when I haven't been assigned other activities . This past weekend was a write-off, sub-wise, because Saturday was spent in the yard doing spring cleanup and Sunday was at the out-laws. Oh well, it'll get done eventually.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Picked up the DCX yesterday (he says, recalling sitting on the couch, stroking its brushed aluminum case.....mmmm....aluminum...). However, when I inquired about the ETA for my EP2000, the guy looked it up and told me that it's on back order. He said Behringer USA/Canada has none on hand. None!? WTF!? Since they have none, they cannot give an expected delivery date, until they actually receive them. The guy at the shop said such items are not usually on backorder for more than a couple of weeks. That fills me with confidence.....

In the meantime, I hope to receive my Parts Express order any day now. Then, I can at least get my cables made up and mess around with DCX. I'll see if I do some EQing of my mains.

While I wait for my sub amp.....Grrrrrrr.......

 

[GO-NAD!]

Well, both enclosures are finished. I have the DCX figured out and it's currently set up with the mains and old subwoofer. My EP2000 arrived just yesterday, so I plan to test both subs this evening. I plugged the amp in and turned it on - it is quite loud. Glad it's going to be setup in the basement! If all goes well with the testing, I am going to try to install them this weekend. I'll post more photos as things progress.

Wish me luck!

 

[GO-NAD!]

Just finished some preliminary testing. I decided to test them with the HT system in the rec room before lugging them both upstairs. Murphy's Law would tell me that the more effort I put into setting them up, the greater the chance that there will be a problem.

Well, I evaded Murphy this evening! They are sounding good! But, even with the gain at max on the EP 2000 I can't get high SPLs in proportion with the mains coming straight from the RXV1800 (x-over at 80Hz) to the EP. However, I should be able to compensate with the DCX to boost the gain to where I need it. Hopefully. To get some SPL out of them, I disconnected the mains and cranked the AVR to about -10dB.

I started with a Diana Krall track that has a prominent stand up bass. The lower notes sounded well-defined to me, although I didn't have time to give it a close listen.

Then I tried some test tones. I started at 25 Hz and scared my daughter upstairs - and myself, to tell the truth! I don't think there will be a problem with extension - especially since these will just be for music. I worked my way up to 40Hz and quit there, as I was satisfied that there are no problems with the build. Even at 25 Hz and 100dB, there was not much vibration to be felt in the enclosures. There should be practically none from music at normal listening levels.

So, next step is to start installation this coming weekend! I'm kinda nervous about it though, as I'm cutting a couple of holes in my living room ceiling, then hoisting these big lumps into the attic.

So here are a couple of pics. They're set up vertically for testing right now. When installed, they will lay horizontal and the painted baffles will be all you see when looking at the ceiling.

 

[annunaki]

Just finished some preliminary testing. I decided to test them with the HT system in the rec room before lugging them both upstairs. Murphy's Law would tell me that the more effort I put into setting them up, the greater the chance that there will be a problem.

Well, I evaded Murphy this evening! They are sounding good! But, even with the gain at max on the EP 2000 I can't get high SPLs in proportion with the mains coming straight from the RXV1800 (x-over at 80Hz) to the EP. However, I should be able to compensate with the DCX to boost the gain to where I need it. Hopefully. To get some SPL out of them, I disconnected the mains and cranked the AVR to about -10dB.

I started with a Diana Krall track that has a prominent stand up bass. The lower notes sounded well-defined to me, although I didn't have time to give it a close listen.

Then I tried some test tones. I started at 25 Hz and scared my daughter upstairs - and myself, to tell the truth! I don't think there will be a problem with extension - especially since these will just be for music. I worked my way up to 40Hz and quit there, as I was satisfied that there are no problems with the build. Even at 25 Hz and 100dB, there was not much vibration to be felt in the enclosures. There should be practically none from music at normal listening levels.

So, next step is to start installation this coming weekend! I'm kinda nervous about it though, as I'm cutting a couple of holes in my living room ceiling, then hoisting these big lumps into the attic.

So here are a couple of pics. They're set up vertically for testing right now. When installed, they will lay horizontal and the painted baffles will be all you see when looking at the ceiling.

These are looking very good! Nice job!

As for the sound, be sure that your polarity is correct all the way through. The placement is obviously a potential factor. I am glad to see how far you have come with this project!

I hope all proceeds as planned for your install.

 

[GO-NAD!]

Ooh, my aching back! It wasn't easy, but it's done! The enclosures weigh almost 70 lbs each so, although that isn't an extreme weight, it certainly isn't something I want to carry up a step ladder and shove up into the attic! Therefore, I rigged a pulley from the rafters, right above one of the ceiling holes and hauled them both up by rope. The installation of the enclosures took a full day. Then, running all the wiring was another full day. It was complicated by the fact that the components are in the living room, the sub in the attic and the sub amp (EP 2000) is in the basement below the living room.

Actually installing the drivers was no walk in the park. Trying to hold the driver in place, on a stepladder, using one hand and my head to hold it in place, while inserting a bolt with the other hand was not fun!

I have the gains matched (pretty much) between the sub and main amps, through the DCX, but I haven't done any equalizing. That's something I can do in slow time, now that everything is installed and functional. I also have to make some grills, but again, no hurry. It sounds very good to my ear right now. No more one-note-bass! I gave it a quick high spl workout, but I could not detect any resonance in the ceiling, which is a big relief! I have to admit, I was a bit concerned about that.

Now that I have this system set up the way I want it, I'll post further pics in the Members System Gallery.

 

[ParadigmDawg]

That looks really good. Nice, clean work.

Ooh, my aching back! It wasn't easy, but it's done! The enclosures weigh almost 70 lbs each so, although that isn't an extreme weight, it certainly isn't something I want to carry up a step ladder and shove up into the attic! Therefore, I rigged a pulley from the rafters, right above one of the ceiling holes and hauled them both up by rope. The installation of the enclosures took a full day. Then, running all the wiring was another full day. It was complicated by the fact that the components are in the living room, the sub in the attic and the sub amp (EP 2000) is in the basement below the living room.

Actually installing the drivers was no walk in the park. Trying to hold the driver in place, on a stepladder, using one hand and my head to hold it in place, while inserting a bolt with the other hand was not fun!

I have the gains matched (pretty much) between the sub and main amps, through the DCX, but I haven't done any equalizing. That's something I can do in slow time, now that everything is installed and functional. I also have to make some grills, but again, no hurry. It sounds very good to my ear right now. No more one-note-bass! I gave it a quick high spl workout, but I could not detect any resonance in the ceiling, which is a big relief! I have to admit, I was a bit concerned about that.

Now that I have this system set up the way I want it, I'll post further pics in the Members System Gallery.

 

[GO-NAD!]

My wife asked me what I plan to do with the Reel Acoustics sub, now that the in-ceilings are done. I said, "I dunno - maybe I'll bring it downstairs and see how it works with the Velodyne in the HT. That is, until I build another pair to replace them....."

I got a rolling of the eyes in response...

Hey - at least it's not a flat "NO"!

 

[annunaki]

Ooh, my aching back! It wasn't easy, but it's done! The enclosures weigh almost 70 lbs each so, although that isn't an extreme weight, it certainly isn't something I want to carry up a step ladder and shove up into the attic! Therefore, I rigged a pulley from the rafters, right above one of the ceiling holes and hauled them both up by rope. The installation of the enclosures took a full day. Then, running all the wiring was another full day. It was complicated by the fact that the components are in the living room, the sub in the attic and the sub amp (EP 2000) is in the basement below the living room.

Actually installing the drivers was no walk in the park. Trying to hold the driver in place, on a stepladder, using one hand and my head to hold it in place, while inserting a bolt with the other hand was not fun!

I have the gains matched (pretty much) between the sub and main amps, through the DCX, but I haven't done any equalizing. That's something I can do in slow time, now that everything is installed and functional. I also have to make some grills, but again, no hurry. It sounds very good to my ear right now. No more one-note-bass! I gave it a quick high spl workout, but I could not detect any resonance in the ceiling, which is a big relief! I have to admit, I was a bit concerned about that.

Now that I have this system set up the way I want it, I'll post further pics in the Members System Gallery.

Nice work! I am pretty impressed with how you have finished this up so far!

I hope the sound is worth the effort so far? It sounds like it is at this point. It should be interesting once you begin to have some time to tweak things a bit more.

Thanks for the updates!