Emotiva UPA-7 Seven Channel Power Amplifier Review

J

jsleonardo

Audiophyte
There isnt any such thing as an 8, 6, 4, 16 ohm speaker. They all have dips and peaks. You need to look at the impedance plot for you speakers and see where they dip and if that frequency is an area that calls for power, ie mids and lows :) Thats why manufactures rate as "nominal"
Hi bandphan, thanks for the feedback.
The nominal impedance of the speakers I'm using is 6 Ohms.
 
J

jsleonardo

Audiophyte
If the UPA-7 and UPA-2 were both operated in 2 channel (UPA-2 only being capable of operating in 2 channel) the UPA-7 would wipe the floor with the UPA-2. The UPA-7, as described earlier in this thread when comparing to the UPA-5, has a larger power supply. In fact, the power supply in the UPA-7 is so much bigger than the one in the UPA-2, they won't even come close to each other in performance. Compare 300va transformer to 850va and 40,000uF in the UPA-2 to the 90,000uF in the UPA-7.

At 6 ohms the UPA-2, assuming their published specifications are correct, would achieve around 160 watts in a 6 ohm load. Like Bandphan said though, no speaker is constantly at one impedance. Nominal ratings are an average or more correctly the mean of the impedances the speaker will impose on an amplifier. Basically the rating is meant to give you an idea of what the impedance will most often be throughout the frequency band the speaker will play.
Hi Seth=L, thanks for the information.
It looks like I'm going to consider the UPA-5 or the UPA-7 than the UPA-2.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
More dynamic headroom, simplest answer. The UPA-1 also employs a true triple darlington output stage with 6 transistors. I believe the UPA-2 uses a version of triple darlington, but somehow does it with only 4 transistors per channel.
The base Darlington set-up is two transistors per channel. Darlington refers to how the transistors are connected together...rather than make a mistake of my memory,, take a look at this link:



http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/circuits/transistor/darlington-pair-amplifier.php

I built a variable DC power supply incorporating an NPN darlington arrangement about 30 years ago.

Parallelling (if thats a word) Darlington pair setup per channel for greater current handling is what is being done.
 
Seth=L

Seth=L

Audioholic Overlord
The base Darlington set-up is two transistors per channel. Darlington refers to how the transistors are connected together...rather than make a mistake of my memory,, take a look at this link:



http://www.radio-electronics.com/info/circuits/transistor/darlington-pair-amplifier.php

I built a variable DC power supply incorporating an NPN darlington arrangement about 30 years ago.

Parallelling (if thats a word) Darlington pair setup per channel for greater current handling is what is being done.
Emotiva claims the UPA-2 uses a triple darlington output stage with only 4 transistors per channel. I think Onkyo does this in their receivers and they call it a triple stage inverted darlington configuration.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
Emotiva claims the UPA-2 uses a triple darlington output stage with only 4 transistors per channel. I think Onkyo does this in their receivers and they call it a triple stage inverted darlington configuration.
I would like to see the schematics because what they describe doesn't make sense. The smallest darlington configuration is a pair as I had linked too. :confused: Doing the math means 12 transistors.
 
P

PENG

Audioholic Slumlord
M

MichaelJHuman

Audioholic
Thanks for the correction, Seth!

But let me check my understanding.
1) If you only used 2 (or 5) channels on both the UPA-7 and the UPA-5, the UPA-7 definitely has the edge, correct?

2) If you actually were powering all channels equally (which, as you point out, is not a realistic scenario) would the UPA-5 have more capability into 5 channels than the UPA-7 into 7 channels?

Your answers will let me know if I have a fundamentally incorrect understanding, or if I misapplied a correct understanding!:confused:
Thanks!:)
I would think it would depend a bit on the situation. After all, the UPA-7 has the bigger power supply transformer. It should be able to provide more power.

Also, you have to consider the limiter circuitry. That could be the main factor limiting power.

The bigger power transformer on the UPA-7 may be less subject to having the supply voltage sag. That may mean the UPA-7 holds up better under load.

I don't think you can do simple calculations as these factors are not simple to analyze.
 
S

scattershot

Audioholic
TBQH I don't even know any seperates receivers under $700, period.

I'd look into the marantz SR5005 from outlaw audio's site. It's an AVR with HDMI1.4, and makes a great prepro. Plus they've got deals to pair it with one of their amps.
Thanks for the heads up, I will look into that.

It just suprises me that say a Onkyo 808 could be had for like $700, but I can't find an equivalent pre/pro for say $500 (considering there is no amp section)...
 
B

blindcat7

Enthusiast
On the surface, it seems odd for them to charge more for removing the amp section, but pre/pros are still generally designed for the higher end market, so a pre with the same features and connectivity as a particular receiver model will generally have superior internal components which ups the cost. Of course, I am not certain that they would lower the cost even if that were not the case because, of course, only high end audio/videophiles are interested in separates. The rest of us rabble couldn't possibly be concerned with such things. Plus, if they gave a price break on such a budget model, it might pollute the value of their brand and product, right?

This is why my plan is to get a good receiver that will work as a pre, then get the amp, then pick up a good pre/pro from someone like Outlaw or emotiva. This approach lets me save up in chunks instead of having to save forever while being stuck with my woefully out of date current setup the whole time.

Regards,

Chris

Thanks for the heads up, I will look into that.

It just suprises me that say a Onkyo 808 could be had for like $700, but I can't find an equivalent pre/pro for say $500 (considering there is no amp section)...
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
Thanks for the heads up, I will look into that.

It just suprises me that say a Onkyo 808 could be had for like $700, but I can't find an equivalent pre/pro for say $500 (considering there is no amp section)...
In very general terms, look at it this way.
For each product and manufacturing-assembly line, there are four costs:
$D = Development costs (design, testing, etc.)
$MS = Manufacturing Setup costs (work instructions/training)
$CO = Changeover costs (switching work-flow & inventory streams to support production of the other product)
$U = Unit cost (cost of components and labor to assemble each unit)

Let's assume a REC and a PRE are made using essentially identical preamp components. I'll throw out some fictitious costs for this fictitious scenario:
$D(REC) = $30,000
$D(PRE) = $15,000 (has the benefit of the design and testing results of the REC, but still needs to be proven for durability and any certifications and some redesign to distribute components throughout the chassis so it doesn't feel/look cheap).
$MS(REC) = $20,000
$MS(PRE) = $20,000 (the documents & process is essentially the same for both items)
$CO = $3,000 (the same work is required to change production line from REC to PRE as from PRE to REC)
$U(REC) = $175
$U(PRE) = $100

Our fictitious market analysis predicts sales volume of 2,000 receivers per year and 400 preamps per year (and the product is replaced/updated annually).
Let's say they decide to changeover to run preamps once each month following a demand forecast).

So the cost to manufacture the 2,000 receivers is:
30,000+20,000+3,000(X12)+175(2000) = $436,000 or $218 per REC (cost to manufacturer before profit, shipping/distribution, and retailer markup).

The cost to manufacture the 400 preamps is:
15,000+20,000+3,000(X12)+100(400) = $111,000 or $277.5 per PRE (cost to manufacturer before profit, shipping/distribution, and retailer markup).

Again, this is fictitious (and grossly simplified), but it shows the basic benefit of mass production and why a company might not be too interested in selling a separate pre in the competitive <$500 market. They might, however, see fit to take this "$277.50" preamp and spend another $50-75 gussying it up for the upscale market and sell it at a premium price!:)

Unless you're ready to spend big bucks, just buy a good receiver!;)

Also consider that adding a 3 channel amp leaves a receiver free to handle the less demanding back/surround speakers with ample reserves to spare! You might consider adding a UPA-5 amp to drive the front 3 channels - also with power to spare.
 
J

jsleonardo

Audiophyte
AV Receiver as a preamp?

Hi guys,

I have a question to the expert, I'm using a H/K AVR 255 AV Receiver which has a preamp outputs.
I'm planning to buy either UPA-5 or UPA-7 to drive the L/R/C and let the AVR drive the surround channels.
Is there a problem using the AV Receiver as a preamp??
I asked this because I read in other internet forum that using AV Receiver as a preamp is BAD?

Thanks in advance for the help.
 
J

JJMP50

Full Audioholic
Hi guys,

I have a question to the expert, I'm using a H/K AVR 255 AV Receiver which has a preamp outputs.
I'm planning to buy either UPA-5 or UPA-7 to drive the L/R/C and let the AVR drive the surround channels.
Is there a problem using the AV Receiver as a preamp??
I asked this because I read in other internet forum that using AV Receiver as a preamp is BAD?

Thanks in advance for the help.
All I can say is that I've been using a Yammy RXV659 as a pre-pro for my UPA-5 for about 9 months and the only problem I had was I created a ground loop initially. After a little trial and error I got rid of it and I'm very pleased. I'm sure an upgrade to a dedicated pre-pro would be an improvement and when I replace my Yammy (not any time soon) I'll probably pick up a UMC-1.
 
J

jsleonardo

Audiophyte
All I can say is that I've been using a Yammy RXV659 as a pre-pro for my UPA-5 for about 9 months and the only problem I had was I created a ground loop initially. After a little trial and error I got rid of it and I'm very pleased. I'm sure an upgrade to a dedicated pre-pro would be an improvement and when I replace my Yammy (not any time soon) I'll probably pick up a UMC-1.
Hi JJMP50, thanks for the feedback.
I should not worry then.
By the way, how did you eliminate the ground loop? Thanks.
 
J

JJMP50

Full Audioholic
Ground Loop solution - I'm reluctant to explain because it makes no sense to me, it just worked. All of my equipment except the sub was plugged into a power bar (the sub into a wall outlet behind it). I had no problem before I added the Emo but now I did. Simply process of elimination and it seemed the Fios box was the culprit. I ran an extension cord to an outlet behind the sofa and no buzz. There are gremlins in this stuff.
 
J

jsleonardo

Audiophyte
Ground Loop solution - I'm reluctant to explain because it makes no sense to me, it just worked. All of my equipment except the sub was plugged into a power bar (the sub into a wall outlet behind it). I had no problem before I added the Emo but now I did. Simply process of elimination and it seemed the Fios box was the culprit. I ran an extension cord to an outlet behind the sofa and no buzz. There are gremlins in this stuff.
No problem, thanks anyway.
 
croseiv

croseiv

Audioholic Samurai
Great review! The Emotiva amps seem real soild. I really like my XPA-5.
 
Last edited:
E

eljeffe

Audiophyte
Every once in-a-while you find something that is so close to perfect that you wonder how it's allowed to exist.; My XPA-5 is one of those things. It is the ideal balance of performance, quality, service and price. I almost wish I had a good excuse to purchase a second one.
 
B

blackzarg

Junior Audioholic
I like how "Embarrasses more expensive amps" is a con ;-)
 
KEW

KEW

Audioholic Overlord
While all of these numbers are good (and below the audible threshold when actually playing music), it is surprising how much the S/N ratios vary between models. The range at 1 watt is 26dB, which represents a better than 25% increase in S/N ratio over the UPA-2's 93dB rating!

UPA-2 Signal to Noise Ratio 1 watt: >93db, Full Power: >107db
UPA-5 Signal to Noise Ratio 1 watt: >119db, Full Power: >116db
UPA-7 Signal to Noise Ratio 1 watt: >115db, Full Power: >120db

Does anyone have any ideas what might cause such large differences?

PS - The UPA-1 was not included since it is not based on the same modules at the other UPA's.
 
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