Considering a DIY design for 2.0 system.

Discussion in 'DIY Corner - Tips & Techniques' started by panteragstk, Apr 3, 2013.

  1. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    I have another thread about my speaker choice for the 2.0 system I'm putting together, but I thought I'd throw a few DIY choices to see what you guys have built/heard.

    Since I have to have a specific finish, and I'd hate to choose a speaker based on the way it looks instead of how it sounds, I figure DIY may be the way to go since I'll be the one doing the finish.

    I've got a few choices, but want to see if you guys know of any other designs I could check out. http://meniscusaudio.com makes it much easier since they have the pre-assembled kits for quite a few designs.

    I've narrowed it down to these:

    ER18MTM with the ribbon option
    Mini Statements

    I like them due to the fact that they use a ribbon tweeter. I've become a big fan of those and would like to stick with a design that uses them.
    Out of those which do you guys think would be better used without a sub? My room and WAF won't let me have a sub in that space.

    Anyone heard both? Either?

    Looking forward to your suggestions.
  2. Swerd Audioholic Ninja

    Swerd
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    mattsk8 has built both the ER18 MTM and the big Statements, not the Mini.

    This thread was posted soon after he built them:

    http://forums.audioholics.com/forum...es/81296-er18-mtm-vs-statement-sound-off.html

    If Matt doesn't post here soon, you should send him a PM. Now that he's had some time with these speakers, he may have more to say.
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  3. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    Thanks for that. It seems from his experience they are both good. I wonder if the mini statements would be closer to the ER18's as far as bass goes? I would like to be able to crank some metal without them breaking up, but I don't do that all that often.

    One thing is my placement isn't all that great for the statement series. I won't be able to place them 18" from the wall. My cabinet is only 21" deep and I don't want the speakers to stick out way in front (I say me, I should say the wife). I'm going to research the ER18 more to see if it will work in my room. Thanks

    EDIT: I also noticed that in the original ER18 thread you mention the SongTowers. Those were one of the ID speakers I'd consider. How do you think these compare?
  4. Swerd Audioholic Ninja

    Swerd
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    Both SongTower and ER18 MTM were designed by the same guy, Dennis Murphy. They sound remarkably similar across nearly the entire audio range, except that the ER18 MTMs dig deeper, with an F3 about 35 Hz and with useful response down as low as 31 Hz. The STs go down to just under 40 Hz. I am familiar with both. I own STs, and have heard the original prototypes of the ER18 MTM at Dennis's house. I think they have very potent bass.

    I haven't heard the Mini Statements, and I'd have to read the 3 page write up to see what the bass response is. I trust you to do that ;). I can't imagine dual 8" woofers producing puny bass.

    I think one of the biggest differences will be the ER18 MTM is a standard front-firing monopole design. The cabinets are 13½" deep (plus a little extra depending on the size of the plinth you build). They can easily sit with the rear-mounted port less than 2" from the wall behind them without impacting the bass sound. Dennis and I deliberately did that to see if it mattered. We couldn't get the cabinet closer to the wall, and if anything, it may have sounded better that way. That seems to be an advantage of the mass-loaded transmission line cabinet design, at least those designed by Paul Kittinger.

    The Mini Statements have a mid range with an open back, similar to the original Statements, the Salk SoundScapes, and the Philharmonics. You can vary the amount of stuffing to adjust the balance between that driver's front and back waves, and adjust the depth of the resulting sound stage. To take full advantage of that, you probably have to place them so the back of the cabinet is at least about 12" to 18" away from the wall behind them. Further may be better. The front of the cabinets will be another 13¾" further out into the room. They will also need some room to the sides, so in a corner or immediately beside a cabinet may be less than optimal. That's an educated guess on my part, but I do think it would be a waste to build them and be forced to place them close to the wall behind them.

    Dennis Murphy might be a good person to ask about this. From his work designing the Salk SoundScapes and the Philharmonics, he has a lot of experience with the room placement of his open back designs.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2013
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  5. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    Thanks again. I guess the ER18's will be the ticket then. I'd hate to build the statements and not be able to place them properly. I may build those for the living room. Can't ever have too many speakers around.

    Thanks for the comparison between the ST's and ER18's. I should have remembered that Dennis designed both. Thanks for clearing that up. I read most of the ER18 thread so I think I'll give them ago once we get all the furniture in place.

    I'll start my own thread once I start.
  6. slipperybidness Audioholic Ninja

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  7. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    Thanks. Very familiar with Curt's page. I've been going back and forth for a few years on the whole DIY speaker project. I've got the tools now, so no reason not to jump into it.
  8. slipperybidness Audioholic Ninja

    slipperybidness
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    You should build me a pair of cabs while you're at it :D

    Seriously, I might consider that if you wanted to trade for something or make some $? But I'm not sure how that would work with the public domain stuff. I see that you are in TX. I'm in central TX.
  9. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    :D We'll see how these go first. I'm leaning toward birch due to the fact that MDF generates so much dust. Plus, I can just stain the birch instead of veneering the MDF.

    If you think what I build is good enough we'll talk. I'm not exactly a master carpenter, but I know what I'm doing (mostly).
  10. lsiberian Audioholic Overlord

    lsiberian
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    I know what I'm doing too. That's why is still have 9 fingers. ;)

    Have fun building just remember it's not cheaper.
  11. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    9 huh? You learned a hard lesson. ;)

    Not cheaper? If you're strictly speaking from a monetary standpoint I'd say it is. If you are speaking of all the time, effort, and learning curve then oh yeah, not cheaper. Price of workmanship (assuming I don't royally screw it up) is more than worth it to me. Plus, if the ER18's perform anywhere close to the SongTower's then I think I'll be happy.
  12. slipperybidness Audioholic Ninja

    slipperybidness
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    Yeah, understood. In fact, I would mostly be interested in just a flat-pack and I could do assembly and finishing.

    I just don't have the tools or the space, and don't want the mess of woodworking. Plus, the Tx summers are brutal.
  13. panteragstk Audioholic Chief

    panteragstk
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    Here they aren't too bad now, but two years ago 110+ 50% humidity was brutal. I grew up in west tx and 120+ summers were the norm. I like being outside so working on this stuff is fun for me. Keeps me busy.
  14. ARES24 Full Audioholic

    ARES24
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    I don't know, I think I would rather build in 120F sun then the -10C snow I just built my sub in!:rolleyes: THE GLUE HATES COLD WEATHER!!!
  15. slipperybidness Audioholic Ninja

    slipperybidness
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    I suppose that you are correct. I don't care for the cold, that's why I'm in TX

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