Brightness of Interlaced vs. Progressive

Discussion in 'CD/DVD/Blu-ray & Misc Hardware' started by Doug917, Jun 7, 2005.

  1. Doug917 Full Audioholic

    Doug917
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    Interlaced vs. Progressive

    Hello,

    I just got a Denon 1910 DVD player and had a couple questions. The interlaced component image looks great through my InFocus Screenplay 4805. When I set the player to progressive, the video becomes brighter and I see more pixels in the image. Is it normal for progressive to be much brighter than interlaced. I can turn the brighness and contrast down and get a progressive picture that is comparable to the interlaced. I have no experience with progressive players as this is my first one. It really doesn't look any better than my 5 year old non-progressive Pioneer DV-C503 player. Is there something I am missing or need to set on the player/projector. I have a DVI cable ordered as that is how I am planning on hooking up the player, but was expecting better results from the component outputs using a progressive signal. Thanks in advance!
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2005
  2. tbewick Senior Audioholic

    tbewick
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    It's not surprising that you notice some difference between the quality of interlaced and progressive video brightness levels, because they will have to be processed differently by the DVD player. There isn't any reason why there should be any difference between the brightness levels though, in other words, progressive scan does not always produce brighter pictures than interlaced. The difference between progressive and interlaced scan modes is that progressive scans the image on to the screen in one pass rather than interlaced which does so in two passes (even lines first then odd lines second).

    If you want to get an accurate picture, you need to worry about the gamma level and the black level (brightness setting) of your display/DVD player. The brightness of the displayed image is controlled by the contrast control on the display device, and is much more down to personal preference.
  3. Doug917 Full Audioholic

    Doug917
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    A better understanding produces more questions

    I have now figured out that the Infocus has DCDi decoding (deinterlacing). The DCDi decoding in the projector (interlaced output from the DVD player)smokes the decoding in the Denon 1910 via the component outputs. I am really curious to see if the DVI connection will make a difference or not. I will be able to send a higher signal (720p or 1080i) to the projector although the projectors native resolution is only 854 X 480. I'm curious to see if the Infocus' conversion of 480i into 480p will still produce a better picture over the Denon's 720p or 1080i via the DVI connection.

    The questions:

    If I send the signal out the DVI input of the Denon will the digital signal be processed by the DCDi in the projector? How does this work; does the projector only apply DCDi to a 480i signal coming in so that DCDi is never applied to a signal from both components? Also, am I correct in my understanding that if I send a 480p signal from the component output of the Denon that the signal will start digital, be converted to analog to go over the cable, then be converted back to digital at the projector?

    Where's BMXTRIX? He could set me straight on all of this!
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2005
  4. BMXTRIX Audioholic Spartan

    BMXTRIX
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    Well... I can't set you straight on all of it. I have specifically avoided upconverting DVD players because, as you have found out, projectors already do scaling work internally that sometimes does a far better job than even a good DVD player does with the signal.

    I would definitely give the DVI a try though if you have it already. The image will still go through the same processor, but it does not appear that DCDi processing may be applied - at least to 720p - not sure on 1080i. LOOK HERE: http://www.av-outlet.com/en-us/dept_335.html But, the Denon may do a very good job taking the DVD video and upconverting it to 720p/1080i. Plus, the digital interface sometimes allows for a little better quality signal to reach the projector.

    The problem is that there is no way to know until you test it. Two DVD players from Denon may not even give you the same results on the same projector if they use different processing. So, with so many variables, it is only possible for you to know for sure, by hooking things up and testing it yourself.

    You are correct about the video sent over the component video connection. Composite, S-Video, and Component Video are all analog connections. Anything found on those lines is analog, not digital. DVI & HDMI are digital and are (almost) exclusively used for digital information. DVI has an analog allowance, but you are very unlikely to see it or use it, so you can pretend it doesn't exist to keep things more simple. :)
  5. Doug917 Full Audioholic

    Doug917
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    I got my DVI cable today. I can now say with 100% certainty that the DCDi decoding in the InFocus Screenplay 4805 smokes the DCDi in the Denon 1910. I tried the Denon's 480p, 720p and 1080i through the DVI cable and none could even come close to feeding the Infocus a 480i signal and letting its DCDi do the work. I had heard many good things about the 1910 but I have now seen the results first hand. The DVI output at any resolution is near unwatchable on my 92" screen. The component output from the Denon using interlaced looks fabulous on the 92" screen thanks to the Infocus' excellent deinterlacing.
  6. Duffinator Audioholic Field Marshall

    Duffinator
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    You really have two issues going on with your projector. First, as you have noticed, is the deinterlacing with the Faroudja chipsets in the projector and the DVD player. Just because is says DCDi on both of them does not mean they are the same chips, although they could be. A friend of mine has the Infocus 7200 and like your projector it does the deinterlacing much better than his Panasonic DVD player which does not have a Faroudja chip.

    The second issue is the scaling. Your DVD player is capable of rescaling the 480 image to either a 720P or 1080I image. Your projector is not an HD projector and is only capable of displaying a 480P image. Your projectors native resolution is 854x480. Your projector accepts a 720P or 1080i input but then it rescales the image to it's native resolution. So if you "upconvert" the image from your DVD player and send it to your projector, then your projector needs to "downconvert" the image to 480P. So you are rescaling the image twice. This is probably never a good idea. Sending the image as a 480i (or 480P) to your projector will minimize any scaling and should provide the best picture quality.

    The purpose of DVD players that "upconvert" the image is to match the native resolution of fixed pixel displays. Sometimes the DVD player will do this better and sometimes the projector (or TV) will do this better. It's always a good idea to experiment with all possible configurations to determine the best picture quality.
  7. BMXTRIX Audioholic Spartan

    BMXTRIX
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    It's good to know though Doug. I hear a lot of people asking that over at Projector Central and I haven't had the chance to experiment with them myself. My general belief (as I keep saying) is that upconverting DVD players are almost always a waste of money. Sometimes there is a VERY minor improvement, but usually not dramatic, and quite often there is a loss in quality over regular component video.

    The SP4805 is an awesome little projector, and I have been recommending it to people for a while now. If you can control the light, it's hard to beat a 100 inch screen for about a thousand bucks. Plus, the projector almost asks for a simple DVD player, not a nicer, more expensive unit.

    At least until HD discs come along...
  8. Doug917 Full Audioholic

    Doug917
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    Tonight I should receive my Denon 1815 DVD changer. I will compare the DCDi decoding from the player to the DCDi decoding in the projector once again. I planned on letting the projector handle the video from the changer from the get go. The 1910, I figured would best the projector, but I was wrong. Maybe the 1815 will surprise me.
  9. Doug917 Full Audioholic

    Doug917
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    I hooked the Denon DVM-1815 up and the Infocus' DCDi creamed that of the Denon once again. I expected it this time around. I've really got to give Infocus credit for putting such a great deinterlacer in one of their cheapest offerings. I have loved the projector since the day I got it and still can't get over the quality of the picture. Without the projector's DCDi my 92" screen would be in real trouble.
  10. Mario Audiophyte

    Mario
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    Pixelated image

    Hi all, will anyone know why am I getting a pixelated image out of my Media Center system when playing DVDs?

    I have a Power Spec MCE-410 with an internal Toshiba DVD-R / RW using an ATI X300SE video card with 64mb and Cyberlink Power DVD software hooked up to an LCD TV thru the DVI output/input.

    The image has good quality but is not as good as my Pioneer DVD player which I'm trying to replace with this Media Center system.

    BTW, the MCE is really cool.

    thanks,
    Mario.

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