3.1 suggestions/question

[SoberSteve]

I am currently using the Philharmonic AA monitors with a vtf 15th with a denon x3100.

I recently set up my gf with an inifinity p363 towers with the p351 center channel with a vtf 3 subwoofer. It sounds really awesome. I was wondering what price range would I expect a noticeable difference if I was going to upgrade the 3 speakers. Her mix is 80 music 20 movies/tv.

I was noticing the vocals on some her of Opera music is lacking.

 

[markw]

Interesting question. How does she listen to her music, straight 2 channel as it was recorder or via some sort of "all channel stereo" DSP mode that emulates more channels than that in which it was recorded.

 

[SoberSteve]

Her music is 2.1 usually. I play with the settings sometimes use Dts or the dolby pro logic ll.

 

[KEW]

The new AA monitors (6.5" mid-woofer) will definitely be an audible step up. Their bass easily outclasses the Pioneer FS-52 towers. Surprisingly, they put out bass that goes as deep as the P363. My biggest complaint with the P363 is if you play them loud they get kind of boomy and detail gets lost (especially mid-range detail which is already being suppressed compared to bass and treble).
Whether or not you are certain of the step up (assuming there is a substantial time lag between listening to each) depends on how good your audio-memory is.

Another consideration is the P363 needs a pretty decent amp because it drops to 4 ohms.
From the AH review:
http://www.audioholics.com/tower-speaker-reviews/primus-p363/primus-p363-measurements

The Infinity P363 floorstanding speaker system is not quite as sensitive or as easy of an amplifier load as Harman spec’d them to be. They are truly a 4-ohm speaker, so care must be taken when pairing them with modestly priced A/V receivers, especially when trying to achieve high output levels in medium to larger sized rooms. These speakers would greatly benefit from external amplification; Emotiva and Outlaw Audio come to mind as great performance/value solutions. You can run these speakers full-range but in a multi-channel setup, I’d recommend bass managing them and allowing a separate powered subwoofer to handle the bass notes below 80Hz. Only moderate toe-in is recommended on these speakers since they exhibit very uniform off-axis horizontal dispersion and produce a rather lively top end response as is.

 

[SoberSteve]

I guess my question is. If I was going to upgrade my bookshelves or her infinity set what price range would I expect a noticeable difference.

 

[TheWarrior]

Having heard the AA's, I honestly would not consider it a substantial (or worthwhile) upgrade until you are spending atleast a grand for the pair. (for bookshelves)

Seriously!

 

[markw]

Her music is 2.1 usually. I play with the settings sometimes use Dts or the dolby pro logic ll.

Personal tastes vary but I found that using those DSP modes tends to smear the sound somewhat.

I prefer to listen to my music in the format in which it was recorded. If it was recorded in two channel, plain vanilla stereo it is. If it's a true multi-channel SACD or Blu-ray, then multi-channel it is. I really don't go for the synthesized channel thing, but YMMV.

 

[zieglj01]

JBL Studio 530 speakers
http://www.amazon.com/JBL-Studio-530-5-25-Inch-Bookshelf/dp/B00622STI0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1441683034&sr=8-1&keywords=jbl+studio+530

 

[KEW]

Having heard the AA's, I honestly would not consider it a substantial (or worthwhile) upgrade until you are spending atleast a grand for the pair. (for bookshelves)

Seriously!

Do I follow correctly?
Are you saying you would expect the cost to upgrade beyond the AA's would be at least $1,000?

 

[TheWarrior]

Do I follow correctly?
Are you saying you would expect the cost to upgrade beyond the AA's would be at least $1,000?

For a pair of bookshelf speakers, to achieve an appreciable performance level higher than the AA's, yes, I have not heard a pair of bookshelves under $1k that would (for me) give the mandatory WOW factor to justify an 'upgrade', OVER the AA's.

 

[KEW]

I would agree with you, but wanted to make sure you were not saying he needed to spend $1000 to realize a significant improvement over the P363's.

 

[TheWarrior]

I didn't even touch the floor standers cause thats definitely going to exceed $1k!

 

[herbu]

I guess my question is. If I was going to upgrade my bookshelves or her infinity set what price range would I expect a noticeable difference.

Suggest you take a look at the Philharmonic Audio site.
Your speakers have a freq response of 48 Hz - 20kHz (+/- 3db) but, "with a very audible output at 34Hz". $195/pair.

The next step up, Philharmonitor, is 30 Hz - 20kHz (+ / - 2db). $1450/pair.

Since you have the AAs, I suppose you have talked to Dennis and are familiar with the reputation he has in this forum. If you like his ear, (thus his speakers), it can be inferred he thinks the step up from AAs to Philharmonitors is significant enough to warrant the offering.

So at the risk of putting words in his mouth, I would suggest the jump to $1450/pair will not only give you a noticeable difference, but a worthwhile difference if it's in your budget... and if you stay in the Philharmonic Audio family.

 

[KEW]

Okay, this is getting confused.
Lets just clarify.
Correct me if I have this wrong:
1) You have the original AA monitors based on the Pioneer BS-22.
2) Your GF has P363 and you are wanting to upgrade her speakers.
3) Herbu is giving stats for the new AA monitor based on the Dayton Audio BR-1 kit (which Dennis Murphy only charges $15 more for his assembly and completely replacing the crossover!).

I know you have in mind paying more instead of less than the cost of the P363's for the upgrade, but you know the quality job Dennis does, so you should know where I'm coming from.
I agree with TheWarrior and really don't think you will find a better speaker until you are getting around $1000 for the pair. That makes sense if you think about it. Look at the offerings in BestBuy look closely at the drivers (too bad you cannot remove them from the cabinet), now look at the photos of the drivers Dayton uses for this kit. Which do you think have better quality?
Next, do you think the crossover in the BB speaker is up to Dennis Murphy's design standards?
Almost 100% of the money you spend on the AA monitors is going into the hardware. For a normal BB speaker,it is pathetically low, maybe 20% for the best cases.

 

[herbu]

Okay, this is getting confused.
Lets just clarify.
Correct me if I have this wrong:
1) You have the original AA monitors based on the Pioneer BS-22.
2) Your GF has P363 and you are wanting to upgrade her speakers.

In post #5 the OP said, "I guess my question is. If I was going to upgrade my bookshelves or her infinity set what price range would I expect a noticeable difference."
So I kinda got the impression he simply has upgradeitis and is thinking about buying one of them, (most likely him since he is a guy), some new speakers.

I thought, if I had AA monitors and wanted a better speaker, what would I do? Knowing what I know now, I would wait until I could afford Philharmonitors.

 

[shadyJ]

Agreed with much of the above, if you want a serious upgrade over the p363s, you will need to be prepared to spend some money. You say vocals are lacking in opera music, that sounds like a setup issue, because the p363s really shine in the mids, ie much of the vocal range you would expect to hear in opera. If you wanted a significant upgrade, I would be looking at the Wharfedale Jades, KEF LS50s, perhaps the Ascend Sierra 2s or Philharmonitors. All are $1500 speakers.

 

[KEW]

Agreed with much of the above, if you want a serious upgrade over the p363s, you will need to be prepared to spend some money. You say vocals are lacking in opera music, that sounds like a setup issue, because the p363s really shine in the mids, ie much of the vocal range you would expect to hear in opera. If you wanted a significant upgrade, I would be looking at the Wharfedale Jades, KEF LS50s, perhaps the Ascend Sierra 2s or Philharmonitors. All are $1500 speakers.

Actually, the p363 is slighted in the mids with an emphasis on bass and treble.

 

[AcuDefTechGuy]

I think some music sources will never sound GREAT no matter what speakers you have.

And some sources will sound GREAT on most speakers.

I agree that it may take upgrades above the $1K mark to see an appreciable improvement over the P363.

 

[shadyJ]

Actually, the p363 is slighted in the mids with an emphasis on bass and treble.

Not according to the measurements I have seen for it.

 

[KEW]

From Gene's review of the P363:

The combined response tracks very closely with the anechoic data Harman sent me for comparative purposes. As you can see, the frequency response is fairly linear with a slight tilt in bass response below 500Hz and treble response above 5kHz. These results don’t surprise me as the P363’s have a lot of top end energy and a good deal of bass punch and depth for a speaker of its size.