Yamahaholics

<font color='#000000'>I am very curious as to why there is so much hype about Yamaha in these forums?? One user has even gone so far as to use his model number as his user name. I have heard of such loyalty in other aspects of life. Take Ford and Chevy for example.. One is &quot;Like a Rock&quot; and the other is &quot;Built Ford Tough&quot;. In reality both are great products and accomplish the same results. So do all us non-Yamaha owners a favor, and tell us what is so wonderful about these units. I am not at all being sarcastic when asking this. I am not asking for the specs that can be found in a PDF file at Yamaha's website.

Personal use and experience is prefered when replying. I guess the reason I am so curious is most answers to &quot;please help me decide&quot; questions is.. Yamaha 2400/1400. Is this personal bias, or have your thoroughly researched your product, comparing it to all models in its price range?

Please reply to this post so that we all may know the secret only Yamahaholics seem to know.</font>

<font color='#000000'>Hi

Some salesman told me that there was Yamaha customer that would get nothing but Yamaha. It seems this company was able to get extra fidelity. The fact that they have their owns DSP and their own 'sound' might be part of the reason.

From what I have seen the Yamaha lovers that are posting in this site have been able to propose other products (after Yamaha of course).

I must say that the RXV-2400 and 1400 are very good deals for the price. Also the RX-Z9 seems to be a good challenge for the title of best receiver. But a lot of other companies propose good products: Denon, HK, Pioneer, Rotel, etc.</font>

<font color='#000000'>My reason for loving Yamaha is a bit complex. In high school, I was over at a friends house, and he kicked on his dads Yamaha rack system. Now, this was a complete system with Yamaha speakers, and a small receiver. Looking at the system, you would think it was not that big of a deal. The reason it was not a big deal to me was because I had a system consisting of a seperate amp, tuner, eq, and Cerwin Vega D7's. The sound quality was so real. Not as loud as mine, but the sound was like the band was right there!

So when my amp gave out, I looked around for a new one. This was before the internet, or before I had ever heard of it. So I had to go with what was available. Onkyo was the best I could find. I went with a Pro-Logic receiver. I was never happy with this set-up. It did not match my seperates, although it has been very reliable.

My older brother later built a system with Yamaha and Paradigm. Out of the blue, there it was. That great sound I remembered so well. Since my system was working fine, I had no reason to go out and buy a new one. But, I did get a Yamaha 5-disc cd player knowing I would build a Yamaha system eventually. The cd player has never skipped in ten years.

With my Cerwins showing their age, foam surround cracking, it was time to update. I was able to hear many different brands of speakers, along with receivers and seperates. I knew what brand of electronics I was looking for. What I didn't know was which speakers.

So, I ordered the Yamaha RX-V1400, Yamaha DVD-S840, MB Quarts, &amp; a recommended NHT sub. And there it was, although not as pure as the B&amp;W 804's on seperates, the clean, pure, feel the vocals in your chest, and feels as if the musicians were in the room sound. Oh, and at a fraction of the cost of the B&amp;W set-up! </font>

<font color='#000000'>Pam has answered this question correctly, The Z9 is the best consumer reciever out there, and the 2400 is the best value out there. That is why right now Yamaha is flavor of the month.

This question also reminds me to ask &quot;where is Yamahaluver?&quot;
he has not been around for some time!</font>

<font color='#000000'>One of the main reasons I use Yamaha for my home theatre (Z9) is because I used to work for a high end audio store that sold the line, so I am very familiar with the sound and set-up. Yamaha has tremendous value and good sound for the buck, although I admit the Z9 is in different territory cost-wise. Yamaha is trying to make a statement - separates look out! There are a few things I don't &nbsp;like about their A/V receivers, especially the multitude of DSP programs. I only use the DSP theatre programs (especially 70MM Spectacle, Sci-Fi, and Adventure) because of the huge theartre-like sound with the extra set of front DSP speakers. As far as I know, Yamaha is still the only company offering this speaker array. Theatre sound is so gimmicked anyway, and you can't beat the extra dimension the front DSP speakers give to the sound field.

As to the other DSP programs, which I never use, at least Yamaha has gone far afield to measure frequency response, reflection, decay etc. in actual cathedrals, concert halls, night clubs, etc. (all identified with each program) and attempted to duplicate the sound in your home. All this tremendous computing power is done with their own in-house chips, unavailable to any other manufacturer. The other manufacturers DSP programs are brewed in a lab and sound mostly awful. Still, I am of the old school - if the recording is done properly don't monkey with the sound.

There certainly is a lot of other A/V receivers with good sound, and I was very close to buying a Denon AVR5803 when I decided to wait for the Z9 (and wait I did - 5 months!!). The market is very competitive, and the A/V manufacturers are stumbling all over themselves to offer bang for the buck with good sound. The average consumer is very savy because of internet research, and the fact that most of the surviving audio/video (most, not all) mags pay a lot more attention to ear evaluation and less to meaningless specs ( thanks Harry Pearson and J.Gordon Holt!!).
A lot of the A/V manufacturers are now using proven high-end designs with high class power supplies, caps, decoding chips, etc. and paying a lot of attention to the resulting sound. Great for the consumer and the ear!

I just spent last evening helping a friend set-up his home theatre and music system (Yamaha &amp; Totem speakers and sub woofer, a great combo). He bought a RX-Z1 that was heavily discounted and the sound that brute (I'm talking well recorded music) with the Totems put out was jaw-dropping. I am talking about wall to wall soundstage with incredible depth and imaging. This is sound that a few years back you would have to purchase super-buck BAT, Pass, Mark Levinson, Audio Research etc. to achieve.

I am runing the Z9 in 6.1 mode, as I don't have a big enough room for 7.1. I am using Totem Mani 2's as the front mains, a Totem Signature One for centre, a pair of Totem Micros for front DSP, Totem Model Ones (3) for rear, and 2 Velodyne HGS10's for stereo bass (thumbs up to Yamaha for providing 2 sub outputs that are actually stereo!). The sound is magnificent, and I know Gene and the boys will love this one (to bad about no sub output in Pure Direct Mode - Gene, a solution??).

I am currently setting up another system in my home using a NAD T763 with a different speaker manufacturer (Athena). Will report on my experience with this combo.

Other A/V receivers such as Marantz, Onkyo, Rotel, Arcam, B&amp;K, Outlaw, JVC etc are receiving good press. All in the all, the consumer is the winner. Shop carefully and use the best A/D converters ever produced - your ears!!

Al</font>

<font color='#000000'>Yamaha is all hype!

I based my purchase decision off of hype and appearances alone.

Why should I even look at other brands?

The word &quot;Yamaha&quot; has a nice ring to it!

All of the cool guys were buying them!

No other brands even come close.

All other brands bow down at the mighty thrown of Yamaha!

---------------------------------------------------------

Is this what you expected to hear? &nbsp;My above comments are obviously meant to be sarcastic. &nbsp;However, I do detect quite a few snide and condescending remarks in your post. &nbsp;

&quot;have your thoroughly researched your product, comparing it to all models in its price range?&quot;

I think myself and other may take offense to your comments because you make it seem like we just woke up one morning and decided to throw money at something we did not adequately consider beforehand. &nbsp;If you have any specific questions about the yamaha products we own, I'm sure myself and others would be happy to answer them!

best,

</font>

<font color='#000000'>Yamaha makes a fine receiver but so do most of the top receiver makers. &nbsp;However, &nbsp;right now, Yamaha is beating the comp. with it's features, realiablity, cost, performance, &nbsp;value etc. &nbsp;For under $1000 or even $1500, you can't find a better receiver than the rx-v1400 AND 2400. &nbsp; I am sure once the Denon 3805 comes out, people will go wild over it. &nbsp;But, from what I have seen so far it's seem to be pretty on par with the 1400/2400 and it's more money. &nbsp;

In the end, go with what you like. &nbsp;

Shinerman</font>

<font color='#000000'>I've not had much experience with Yamaha receivers. The ones I have had experience with were more of the mid priced models. I never liked that they had the cheap spring clip speaker connections for the rear channels, while other brands in the same price range usually didn't. Maybe their higher end models compare better with the competion, but I've not had anyone specifically explain why they are so compelling. Their mid priced models always made me shy away from the brand in the past. Now there are numerous models that can be had for +/-150 dollars in the RX-V1400's price range yet I keep hearing in these forums that they are the best bang for the buck? Is it the components? the pre amp? what exactly? that makes it all the rage. And what about the Sony components is it that sucks so badly?

I'm not a real fan of trying to nit-pick over small differences in the quality of components anyway, especially when my room isn't completely acoustically sound. I think many people would be better off concentrating on getting every ounce of quality from their room sound rather than swapping receivers every couple of years for a new bell or whistle.</font>

<font color='#8D38C9'>Features are nice but most are overrated. &nbsp;I'm not gonna chase my tail trying to get ten extra DSP's that will sound like crap anyway (no knock on Yammy- I don't really like hardly any of the DSPs except PLII). &nbsp;For a feature to move me, it has to radically improve convenience or greatly improve the sound. &nbsp;Not many &quot;features&quot; of the last couple years have done that, IMOHO.

I'm not a big Yammy fan myself, but to be honest, I haven't kept up with the new models. &nbsp;I'm not an EE, but I'd guess that if you cracked the case on 10 budget models from 10 manufacturers, you'd probably find 95% of the same parts inside. &nbsp;Sure, some brands make some of their own parts (or get them branded for them) how different are they in reality from competing parts? &nbsp;Certainly they're not identical, but at lower price points you simply don't find many big performance differences. &nbsp;It largely comes down to ergonomics, familiarity and brand loyalty/preference.

BTW, I'm a &quot;Denon guy.&quot; &nbsp;I'll buy another brand IF they make something I like better, but I'll always give them first crack when I'm ready to buy another model (I've got 2 Denon CD players, 1 Denon DVD deck, a Denon Dubbing CD deck &amp; 1 Denon receiver). &nbsp;Pretty much just like all you Yamaha guys! </font>

<font color='#000000'>So maybe I was being a little condescending. Oh well! I am sick of people recommending this product and not justifying their reasoning. Give me a Break! The differences in the Denon 3803, Pioneer Elite 53TX/55TXi, Marantz SR7400 and the Yamaha 2400 are negligable.

It is not that I don't like the product, I just don't understand why so many people make it out to be so far superior. At this point if someone gave me one definitive reason it is so far above the other products mentioned I would be grateful. Comments such as &quot;Best Value&quot;, &quot;Some salesman told me&quot; or &quot;it blows the others aways with features&quot; are unsatisfactory.

What concerns me is, that people who visit this site will read your comments and not take the time to audition various products. Making a blind purchase based on hype for the Yamaha 1400/2400 simply to save time. I am only making a stink about this because this site is supposed to be about pursuing the truth in audio.

Truth of the matter is.. There are several products out there that are equal to the almighty Yamaha.</font>

<font color='#000000'>rgriffin25: You are quite wrong when you say

&quot;The differences in the Denon 3803, Pioneer Elite 53TX/55TXi, Marantz SR7400 and the Yamaha 2400 are negligable.&quot;

Can you get the Denon (which I love by the way) for $675? The reason the 2400 is a winner in its class is its value. It's not the greatest thing out there, I have NAD 2600 monoblocks attached to the front end of mine to make it work, but as a 7.1 ES/EX processor it is excellent and great value. The 2400 was rated a rave by all the mags and reviewers BEFORE it was flavour of the month here.</font>

<font color='#000000'>My reasoning is similar to others'. 3 years ago,when I went shopping, I was able to compare the Denon, Yamaha, &amp; Sony(ES too) with each other through the same sets of speakers. It came down to Denon &amp; Yamaha(Sony sounded,well, kind of phony).Then the price difference made it simple. I don't have anything bad to say about Denon. The two compared pretty evenly so for $200 less I took the Yamaha. I just recently upgraded to a 3300 @ the closeout price of $600. That's $900 off retail &amp; $700 cheaper than anywhere else within 50 miles of me. Didn't find any deals on Denon equipment.I would have to venture into Seattle to find any NAD or Marantz equipment, but for what I want,I can't see the reason to.Have listened to B&amp;K,Krell, &amp; Parasound at the same place I bought the Yamaha(my original 620) &amp; I loved most of it,but can't afford it.</font>

<font color='#000000'>In one of the earlier posts a fellow yamaha fan stated that &quot; For under $1000 or even $1500, you can't find a better receiver than the rx-v1400 AND 2400&quot;. So that is why I included the 3803 and the 55TXi in this group. If you were to buy the 2400 or the 3803 at Ultimate or other similar electronics stores the price would be the same $999. So I do feel that they should be compared. Even if you throw out the Denon, and only compare the Marantz 7400, and Pioneer Elite 53TX (which I bought for $645) the value is the same.

Please do not feel that you must defend your receiver. This topic was brought up to help others decide on a more realistic level which receiver to buy.</font>

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rgriffin25 : <font color='#000000'>So maybe I was being a little condescending. Oh well! I am sick of people recommending this product and not justifying their reasoning. Give me a Break! The differences in the Denon 3803, Pioneer Elite 53TX/55TXi, Marantz SR7400 and the Yamaha 2400 are negligable.

It is not that I don't like the product, I just don't understand why so many people make it out to be so far superior. At this point if someone gave me one definitive reason it is so far above the other products mentioned I would be grateful. Comments such as &quot;Best Value&quot;, &quot;Some salesman told me&quot; or &quot;it blows the others aways with features&quot; are unsatisfactory.

What concerns me is, that people who visit this site will read your comments and not take the time to audition various products. Making a blind purchase based on hype for the Yamaha 1400/2400 simply to save time. I am only making a stink about this because this site is supposed to be about pursuing the truth in audio.

Truth of the matter is.. There are several products out there that are equal to the almighty Yamaha.</font>

Click to expand...

<font color='#000000'>The differences are not negligable. &nbsp;Like RX-V2400, there is a pretty big price defference in street prices. &nbsp;That's a big deal to some. &nbsp;Customer service is also very good with Yamaha. Try getting good customer service from Denon. &nbsp;Won't happen. &nbsp;YPAO on the Yamaha and a similiar system on some Pioneers is also a big difference.

Also I don't think you need to be concerned with anyone here giving hap-hazard advise about receivers. &nbsp;Most people here are very good at telling people to get what they like. Most here will point out differences between models and give their favorites but will rarely state &quot;get this receiver&quot;. &nbsp;It just does not happen.

Why are you so concerned about advise on this board? &nbsp;You state that most common answers won't cut it for you. &nbsp; Fine, but the fact is and like Rob B. stated, most mid and lower level receivers are pretty much the same. &nbsp;Because of this, answers like &quot;best value feature for feature, best customer service, best DSPs, Auto Calibration, and PLIIx&quot; become very important to some people. &nbsp;

If your really worried about getting the best, then get some seperates. &nbsp;They will outperform most mid to low ened A/V receivers hands down. &nbsp;

Shinerman</font>

<font color='#000000'>That's a nice price for the Pioneer you have.</font>

<font color='#000000'>Hi All
One more thing to consider is reliability As a custom installer that last thing I want to do is put a system together for a client only to have to come back a week or two later and rip it all back out because of a defective component &nbsp;I have the unique ability to see what the most dependable components are and Yamaha is the most dependable by far &nbsp;I am not saying that I have never had a defective Yamaha
component but I have had far fewer than &nbsp;the other major brands &nbsp;The worst for me has been Pioneer/Pioneer Elite
with Onkyo not far behind
</font>

<font color='#000000'>Have to comment on the price issue. Got my 1400 to my door for $581.

As far as recommendations, I have been recommending a H/K receiver because it is $1000 off!

Value for the features &amp; power is the bottom line! If someone were to ask YOU for a receiver under $1000, what would YOU recommend?   (rgriffin25)</font>

<font color='#8D38C9'>Odd, I've had superb service from Denon on the rare occasion that any was necessary (once in many years and almost a dozen purchases).</font>

<font color='#000000'>rgriffin25,

This post has me wondering. &nbsp;Why don't the answers given to support a receiver's worth/value hold much weight with you?

I read comments like,

&quot;Oh well! I am sick of people recommending this product and not justifying their reasoning. Give me a Break!&quot;

and

&quot;Comments such as &quot;Best Value&quot;, &quot;Some salesman told me&quot; or &quot;it blows the others aways with features&quot; are unsatisfactory.&quot;

and

&quot;What concerns me is, that people who visit this site will read your comments and not take the time to audition various products. Making a blind purchase based on hype for the Yamaha 1400/2400 simply to save time. I am only making a stink about this because this site is supposed to be about pursuing the truth in audio.

Truth of the matter is.. There are several products out there that are equal to the almighty Yamaha.&quot;

and

&quot;Please do not feel that you must defend your receiver. This topic was brought up to help others decide on a more realistic level which receiver to buy.&quot;

I start to feel like maybe myself and others are biased and maybe not giving the best advise. &nbsp;Could we be Yamaha snobs? &nbsp;You have given me and maybe others the idea that maybe you think our advise it not in the best interest of the posters. &nbsp;You have given me and maybe the others the idea that we are missing something. &nbsp;You seem to think our advise does not cut it in making an informed decision, at least by your standards.

BUT, then I read this post by you.

&quot;After comparing the 2 units and finding no major difference, I decided to go with the unit that caught my eye with its glossy finish. No regrets here!&quot;

WTF!?!?!? &nbsp;LOL, LOL! &nbsp;

Ah ha, when all else fails, go for the pretty one! &nbsp;

Is that helping someone make a decision of which receiver to buy on a more realistic level?

No offense intended but I pride myself on giving pretty sound advise. &nbsp;I try not to play favorites but tell it like it is. &nbsp;I also &nbsp;try not to talk above my head about things I don't understand. &nbsp; &nbsp;

Anyway, just thought it was kindof funny.

Shinerman</font>

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