U

unclejohn

Audiophyte
I am new to the site, in my mid 60's and have limited tech knowledge. We are giving our home a facelift and my wife suggested (demanded) that I get rid of the deer head over the fireplace. I was able to leverage this into a complete audio/visual upgrade. I am replacing what we installed in 2006: Panasonic Plazma TH-50PHD8UK (commercial grade monitor rated high by CNET for its clear picture), Denon AVR-2807 receiver, Denon 1920 DVD player, Two Definitive Technology Mythos 2 and One Def Tech Mythos 3 speakers, Two Aim8 three rear speakers, One Def Tech SuperCube II subwoofer, and a Panamax M4300-EX power conditioner.
Off to Best Buy and I receive the following suggestions: LG 65B6 OLED 4K television ($3500), Denon AVRX 4300 9.2 channel receiver ($1500), OPPO BDP 103 BLU-RAY player ($500), Three Bowers-Wilkins CWM 8.5 in wall speakers ($800 ea), Three Back Boxes BBW85 ($600 ea), Two Bowers-Wilkens CCM663 mid speakers ($350 ea), Four Dynabox speaker boxes ($170 ea) for the two B&W mids and my two AIM8 rear speakers that I am keeping. One Panamax MR4300 home theater power management ($300), Four lengths Forest HDMI cable (two 2M $70 ea, one 5M $140, one 3M $70). One Blacklab 3M subwoofer wire ($40). I'm keeping my original subwoofer. I am pretty sure that I am going to let the install take place in about two weeks, but I will wait for the OPPO UDP-203 4K BLU-RAY player that is due out around the end of the year. It is predicted to be $499.
Except for the sub, we are donating the 2006 equipment to a local school. The consultation team from Best Buy are coming out Wednesday to check on the installation possibilities. The wall in question is an exterior wall. The in wall speakers are going to involve some serious drywall work what with the main speaker back boxes being 39" tall. How they handle the horizontal box for the middle speaker will be interesting; perhaps just like framing for a window. If the install proves impossible the front speakers would be changed to the equivalent cabinet speakers. I have found some of the items above cheaper on Amazon and Best Buy said that they do price match.
CONCEDRNS:
1. The necessity for the back boxes on the mid and rear speakers.
2. The need for high end HDMI cables. I know I need 2.0's but do I need Forest 2.0's?
3. From the TV down to the BLU-RAY player everything is Wi-Fi and everything has to be hooked up to the net for firmware updates and such. The whole thing sounds too complicated. I think the Best Buy rep said that he would turn off all of the Wi-Fi except for the TV. Does that sound right.
4. I am paranoid with the whole smart tv means "they can see and listen to everything you do" kind of thing. The rep said not to worry since the TV does not have a camera. When I asked, "What about the listening?", lets just say my fears were not alleviated. Do I need to worry?

Sorry about the length. Any help or suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you.
 
P

pewternhrata

Audioholic Chief
I would highly recommend finding a b&w dealer in your area, they are going to be more knowledgeable on the products, and I've always found them to be cheaper.
 
S

shadyJ

Speaker of the House
Staff member
Why the hell would a speaker manufacturer sell in-wall speakers with back boxes separate? That really makes me question that design. I would go with another speaker. Also, you don't need a 'power management' unit, and you are paying waaay too much for cables, as is the norm for best buy. You are paying way to much for items that have a high markup. This doesn't strike me as a very sensible system.

And no, your TV can not hear you unless it has a microphone, which I doubt it does.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Good grief give them that sub, too; it's pretty weak when it comes to what else is available; it is one of the bigger possible upgrades you're going to be able to make compared to the rest. Assume you want in-walls? Why the back boxes are separately priced is weird. B&W trades more on its name than they're worth IMO, and Audioquest cables are very overpriced for what they are (don't believe their marketing--its mostly nonsense which is why I don't recommend their stuff whatsoever, unless it has been deeply discounted, and priced similarly to decent stuff that isn't over marketed and over priced).
 
cel4145

cel4145

Audioholic
No. You don't need expensive HDMI cables. Look into Mediabridge cables on Amazon. Very affordable.
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
1. The necessity for the back boxes on the mid and rear speakers.
2. The need for high end HDMI cables. I know I need 2.0's but do I need Forest 2.0's?
3. From the TV down to the BLU-RAY player everything is Wi-Fi and everything has to be hooked up to the net for firmware updates and such. The whole thing sounds too complicated. I think the Best Buy rep said that he would turn off all of the Wi-Fi except for the TV. Does that sound right.
4. I am paranoid with the whole smart tv means "they can see and listen to everything you do" kind of thing. The rep said not to worry since the TV does not have a camera. When I asked, "What about the listening?", lets just say my fears were not alleviated. Do I need to worry?
The TV is excellent and you should be happy with it. I don't love LG for their build quality, but the image quality is really top shelf right now.

1. Back boxes to help control sound bleed and provide proper audio is common with better gear. They sell this as a secondary item to allow that upgrade option. If you have the means, then I wouldn't pass it by.
2. No, you don't need high end cables. You DO need, and want a path from your TV location to your equipment location. I would recommend 1" to 1.25" conduit. If you are having all this work done, why not put in a way to add/remove wiring in the future if you need to? You can pick up cables, or ask for HDMI cables which are $20 or less for a cable. Maybe $25 or so for the long cable. I'm not sure why you need 2m and 3m cables if your equipment is all just a couple of feet apart. I typically use one or two six foot cables, and one or two three foot cables. Never longer unless I'm in a full size rack. Then 9-15 feet from the equipment rack to the TV. Typically I pull two cables just because it is easier to do at the time, and an extra 20 bucks for peace of mind is a good thing to do. Complete cabling should be less than $100 for HDMI and achieve standards to accept a 4K signal.
3/4. Yes, everything hooks up to the Internet and it should be. Your phone is, your laptop is, your laptop has a camera, your phone has a camera... Stop being weird about it, your phone and laptop are far more vulnerable than your TV or Blu-ray Disc player will be. Count on your cable box being pure Internet driven as it is. It's only complicated when you do NOT connect it to the Internet because it doesn't get firmware updates and it doesn't get proper updates. I almost always recommend that you hard wire directly to the Internet if at all possible. This provides a more reliable connection. You don't have to put in passwords or anything since it is hard wired, and you don't have any issues with streaming and buffering issues when watching Netflix, Amazon Prime, or something off your Roku player.
Get a Roku.

I would strongly suggest, before donating to a school, you find out if they have any need or use for the gear. A church 'youth room' may get better use out of such gear. A school often doesn't have the room or technical prowess to properly setup a A/V system, or even use it. Double and triple check on that as they may say "YES!" - but really not have any final purpose in mind.

Be aware than DefTech Mythos equipment still holds a fair bit of value. I have no intention of ever getting rid of my Mythos 8 center channel. The subwoofer isn't bad and if you are happy with it, then by all means, keep it.

You may want to consider a local installer instead of the corporate mega chain.

I would also ask, what kind of remote do you intend to use with this gear to ensure it is easy for the family to use? Surround sound and the rest is what the real 'complicated' part is, and when the wife or family can't use it because you need 12 remotes, or even one lousy remote, then things can feel pretty weak in a hurry.
 
U

unclejohn

Audiophyte
Good grief give them that sub, too; it's pretty weak when it comes to what else is available; it is one of the bigger possible upgrades you're going to be able to make compared to the rest. Assume you want in-walls? Why the back boxes are separately priced is weird. B&W trades more on its name than they're worth IMO, and Audioquest cables are very overpriced for what they are (don't believe their marketing--its mostly nonsense which is why I don't recommend their stuff whatsoever, unless it has been deeply discounted, and priced similarly to decent stuff that isn't over marketed and over priced).
They originally suggested a Martin Logan 12" sub. Better choice? Your cable recommendation? I appreciate your time.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
They originally suggested a Martin Logan 12" sub. Better choice? Your cable recommendation? I appreciate your time.
For subs I'd look at SVS, Hsu, Power Sound Audio, Rythmik, JTR, Seaton....not Martin Logan, altho their dual opposed driver subs and maybe the 1500X are decent if you get a great big discount. Cables/wire try Monoprice.com or Mediabridge brand on Amazon...or if you want something a bit more upscale try bluejeanscable.com. Try this site for some background info on things wire http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm
 
D

Diesel57

Full Audioholic
Unclejohn, hear these guys, the information & support in this forum provides knowledge and understanding, why just spend $$$$ ?When you can invest $$$$
 
U

unclejohn

Audiophyte
The TV is excellent and you should be happy with it. I don't love LG for their build quality, but the image quality is really top shelf right now.

1. Back boxes to help control sound bleed and provide proper audio is common with better gear. They sell this as a secondary item to allow that upgrade option. If you have the means, then I wouldn't pass it by.
2. No, you don't need high end cables. You DO need, and want a path from your TV location to your equipment location. I would recommend 1" to 1.25" conduit. If you are having all this work done, why not put in a way to add/remove wiring in the future if you need to? You can pick up cables, or ask for HDMI cables which are $20 or less for a cable. Maybe $25 or so for the long cable. I'm not sure why you need 2m and 3m cables if your equipment is all just a couple of feet apart. I typically use one or two six foot cables, and one or two three foot cables. Never longer unless I'm in a full size rack. Then 9-15 feet from the equipment rack to the TV. Typically I pull two cables just because it is easier to do at the time, and an extra 20 bucks for peace of mind is a good thing to do. Complete cabling should be less than $100 for HDMI and achieve standards to accept a 4K signal.
3/4. Yes, everything hooks up to the Internet and it should be. Your phone is, your laptop is, your laptop has a camera, your phone has a camera... Stop being weird about it, your phone and laptop are far more vulnerable than your TV or Blu-ray Disc player will be. Count on your cable box being pure Internet driven as it is. It's only complicated when you do NOT connect it to the Internet because it doesn't get firmware updates and it doesn't get proper updates. I almost always recommend that you hard wire directly to the Internet if at all possible. This provides a more reliable connection. You don't have to put in passwords or anything since it is hard wired, and you don't have any issues with streaming and buffering issues when watching Netflix, Amazon Prime, or something off your Roku player.
Get a Roku.

I would strongly suggest, before donating to a school, you find out if they have any need or use for the gear. A church 'youth room' may get better use out of such gear. A school often doesn't have the room or technical prowess to properly setup a A/V system, or even use it. Double and triple check on that as they may say "YES!" - but really not have any final purpose in mind.

Be aware than DefTech Mythos equipment still holds a fair bit of value. I have no intention of ever getting rid of my Mythos 8 center channel. The subwoofer isn't bad and if you are happy with it, then by all means, keep it.

You may want to consider a local installer instead of the corporate mega chain.

I would also ask, what kind of remote do you intend to use with this gear to ensure it is easy for the family to use? Surround sound and the rest is what the real 'complicated' part is, and when the wife or family can't use it because you need 12 remotes, or even one lousy remote, then things can feel pretty weak in a hurry.
I really appreciate the time and effort you put into your response. I learned some good things from your experience and knowledge and promise to work on my acknowledged weirdness. I have Comcast cable service and use the remote for the DVR and for free and paid movie searches. Is there really one remote that can control all the equipment and replace the Comcast remote? If so which one would you suggest?
 
BMXTRIX

BMXTRIX

Audioholic Warlord
Is there really one remote that can control all the equipment and replace the Comcast remote? If so which one would you suggest?
There are a number of remotes which can control everything in your system. Some are models you can program yourself, others must be programmed by an installer. There is nothing wrong with the ones you program yourself, but you have to want to do it, and do a good job with it, for it to work well. It takes some time, and a bit of a learning curve as you go through it.

At the end, you will typically have a series of buttons that read "CABLE, BLU-RAY, ROKU, (etc.)"

You push that button and the TV powers on, the receiver powers on, the source powers on, and you are watching whatever you selected with a single button press.

I've used URC (Univeral Remote Control) remotes a few times, but I typically install b-stock Crestron gear, which is far higher end, and far more reliable, and with the way I get it, can be had for just a few hundred bucks.

If you don't change equipment often, then a remote installed and programmed by others is a good solution. It should work with the gear you have forever without issue, and then when you do upgrade, the installer can come in and tweak the programming for your new gear as needed.

If you have any programming done, and the programming code is stored on a computer instead of only in the remote, make sure you let them know that you want the original, editable, source code before they leave. This way, if you decide to go with someone else, they will have programming to work from.
 
lovinthehd

lovinthehd

Audioholic Jedi
Another remote option are the Logitech Harmony universal remotes with their database of most all gear available are fairly easy to setup with a computer; the 650 is a solid model and is available for about $55.
 

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