The Perfect Remote? An Audioholics Soundbyte.

gene

gene

Audioholics Master Chief
Administrator
It seems like remote controls are the one piece of any equipment that we’re never really happy with. Many manufacturers seem to have given up. They know their remotes are barely adequate and trust that you’ll just go find a better, universal remote to use.

We take a quick look at remote control designs and search for the perfect remote, one that will control all of our devices easily and be simple to program.




Read: What is the Perfect Remote Control?

Tell us what you think the perfect remote is and if you've found the holy grail of remotes, what is it?
 
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R

rjplummer

Enthusiast
The problem with remotes aren't so much the remotes as the devices they control. Infrared is not a particularly reliable communication method. But the biggest problem with remotes is that communication is one-way. The Harmony is a great idea where you can push a button to switch sources and settings, but it has to know the current settings to work correctly, and if one command fails to reach its intended device, or arrives before that device is ready, recovery is tedious to say the least. I really don't care about buttons or screens when you've got a consumer electronics device that can talk to dozens of network sources but won't tell the remote whether its' on, off or which source it's currently set to.
 
DJWPAR3

DJWPAR3

Audioholic Intern
I'm sure there are many others, who like myself, have at least 6 remotes that are in a nearby drawer. All are useful for only one or 2 devices in my system. Plus I have a Logitech Universal(700), which is my go to remote and MOSTLY replaces all the others. Even it has it's shortcomings though. It can't dig all the down to some(receiver) options and some times I have to scramble to find one of the other remotes when a device has a temporary fit. Then there's the WAF consideration. Get too advanced she won't touch it, too basic and she won't try the other remotes. I think sometimes she'd like to go back 50 years to one knob on the telly.
I have never found a 100% solution, but the universal is the best so far. WHEN THEIR SOFTWARE UPDATES WORK...another factor.
Just another thought..EVERY KEY SHOULD BE BACKLIT..I'm tired of searching for a small flashlight or turning on a bright light after my eyes have been used to the dark for an hour, so I can find a button.
I do like the APPS that are now appearing for receivers...they are pretty cool....but even they can't do it all.

I guess I vote for the Logitech.
 
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Montucky

Montucky

Full Audioholic
Falling in love with the Harmony Elite. Has the functionality I want out of a high end integrated system type remote, but for 1/10th the price. Plus you don't have to pay a fortune every time you switch out a component and need to pay to have it reprogrammed.

Is it a total replacement for the high end solutions out there. Not completely. But when you're talking a single room system, it's tough to beat.
 
A

AndrewLyles

Audioholic
I got sucked into Logitech many years ago, and when it worked it was great. I'll echo many of the other issues mentioned above about staying in sync with your devices, but I also had serious issues with durability. My remote would simply die about 1-2 years and it was frustrating.

I've had family members go higher end with custom URC tablet/panel remotes built for them many years ago but the amount of dealer servicing to keep everything working was silly.

I'm trying the "app" route lately. Like all of the options, there's limitations. I miss having physical buttons, and the amount of work required to get everything up and running to my satisfaction is tremendous, but the results are very cool. I've been using iRule for a couple years and like the 2-way feedback from my devices (RS232 and IP) that support it. The graphical interface is the definition of custom as I can design and incorporate anything I want (I have had to learn some graphic design though) and have a simplified version for my better half (still building that one!) that also does what she wants without being overwhelming.

IMO there's still no silver bullet that is all things to all people, but the additional options available have been good for me so far.
 
crossedover

crossedover

Audioholic Chief
It's all a matter of what level of control you want and want others to have. IMHO after 3 sources, including the display, a universal is a convenient product that you shouldn't have to do with out. Like any automation product, ease of use and overall functionality will come with a price. With speakers, amps, subs, etc. people will pay for the features they want, oddly that rarely translates into control systems (oddly the guy that would never build a diy component will attempt and likely fail at an automation system). Stop by a friend's or a dealer with proper automation and you will be hooked, doesn't mean that its for you but most will clearly see the benefit.
 
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panteragstk

panteragstk

Audioholic Warlord
One of the things I love most about having an HTPC control everything instead if the remote is that I can use a very simple RF remote that works with everything I want to control. I use rs232 (favorite, old reliable), IP (good, could be great depending on network infrastructure), IR (some devices don't have another option), and HDMI CEC (terrible. Unreliable. Should be fantastic, but it isn't), and z-wave. All this done with free software running on my multiple HTPC's. I purchased a little HA box to see if I can take it to the next level.

I am still searching for the perfect, simple remote, but haven't found it yet. I'd like to keep the same remote for all zones, but they stopped making my awesome Gyration remote.
 
Alexandre

Alexandre

Audioholic
OK, I watched the video, then browsed the neeo website and pre-ordered one, it actually looks really neat. I also contacted them to ask about integration with Kodi and my receiver and got responses within 20 minutes. They seem to have a good plan of attack for Kodi (as in they're going to implement basic remote support at first, over IP, and then, later implement the 2 way communication with listing of content and all).

:)
 
Montucky

Montucky

Full Audioholic
That Neeo IS intriguing. I'm a big fan of going outside of the mainstream, and this may be just the ticket for home automation at a surprisingly affordable price (for what it is). I'm half tempted to pre-order one just to investigate how well it ends up working. Since I work directly with customers, support will be the biggie for me. I like the Harmony a lot, but in my experience their user support is definitely lacking. You may get better support with the higher end control systems, but you end up paying substantially more for them. Perhaps the Neeo will end up being sort of a middle ground? I definitely want to learn more about it.
 
Stanton

Stanton

Audioholics Contributing Writer
I don't like touchscreen remotes (don't really like touchscreen anything) because it's difficult when you're "fumbling around in the dark". I've owned many tactile remotes (Memorex/Marantz/URC), and have been very happy with URC's consumer (where you don't have to pay someone to program it) remotes; the only problem with that is they are down to (1) consumer model and availability is sometimes scarce. Having said that, I recently purchased a URC MX-450 and have been very happy with it's ease of use and performance (it has a cannon for an IR blaster). YMMV.
 
Alexandre

Alexandre

Audioholic
I currently have a Harmony One which is good enough but is a bit of a pain to setup (the setup is clunky). The timing of it is also not great, sometimes some devices don't turn on (the Classé Sigma SSP is pretty finicky) which isn't all that hard to fix by pressing the Help button but still.

One thing I'd like to actually get away from is control via IR whenever possible. My receiver and my 2 main sources (TV and Mac Mini running OpenElec/Kodi) are controllable by IP and that'd just be so much better. I also have a blu-ray player which isn't controllable by IP but eh… these days I use it less and less as I tend to rip blu-rays before watching them from the mac mini. Another issue I have with IR control is that both the mini and the tv currently share the same IR codes which is annoying, I could probably mess with the Kodi config to make it use a different set of commands but it's more time than I care to spend, especially since then I would have to figure out a "fake device" for the Harmony to use. ;)

The touch screen aspect doesn't bother me all that much, and the Neeo is kind of like the new TV remote in the sense that it uses a combination of touch screen and a few physical buttons.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
I don't like touchscreen remotes (don't really like touchscreen anything) because it's difficult when you're "fumbling around in the dark". I've owned many tactile remotes (Memorex/Marantz/URC), and have been very happy with URC's consumer (where you don't have to pay someone to program it) remotes; the only problem with that is they are down to (1) consumer model and availability is sometimes scarce. Having said that, I recently purchased a URC MX-450 and have been very happy with it's ease of use and performance (it has a cannon for an IR blaster). YMMV.

You would think that the touch screens for a remote control would be backlit just like the physical buttons on a remote. Remotes I would think were designed to operate in the dark.
 
Alexandre

Alexandre

Audioholic
You would think that the touch screens for a remote control would be backlit just like the physical buttons on a remote. Remotes I would think were designed to operate in the dark.
If the touchscreen stays black, I think there is a problem. ;)
 
D

DebbieC

Audiophyte
Hi, you only seem to be comparing universal remotes that need to be purchased here, what about universal remote apps?

Anyone with an Android smartphone that has an IR blaster can download an app. Our company develops a free app which is called SURE Universal. We have around 3 million installs already and some great reviews.

Just search for it on Google Play and let us know what you think.
 
rojo

rojo

Audioholic Samurai
DebbieC said:
Hi, you only seem to be comparing universal remotes that need to be purchased here, what about universal remote apps?

Anyone with an Android smartphone that has an IR blaster can download an app. Our company develops a free app which is called SURE Universal. We have around 3 million installs already and some great reviews.

Just search for it on Google Play and let us know what you think.
I think for frequently used functions such as seek / skip, volume, and on-screen menu navigation, a smartphone or tablet app is a poor substitute for a remote with tactile buttons the user can operate without taking his eyes off the tv. Even with haptic feedback, your app would require the user to look at the gadget and away from the movie.

Know what would be cool though? An app with no visible controls -- only a cheat sheet showing swipe gestures. Swipe up / down for volume, swipe left / right for seek, two-finger swipe for skip, tap to mute, double tap to activate voice control where you can say directions / ok / guide / info / buttons (which would then display buttons), two-finger pinch for exit / back.

Sent from my LG-VS980 using Forum Fiend OSP v1.3.3.
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
Hi, you only seem to be comparing universal remotes that need to be purchased here, what about universal remote apps?

Anyone with an Android smartphone that has an IR blaster can download an app. Our company develops a free app which is called SURE Universal. We have around 3 million installs already and some great reviews.

Just search for it on Google Play and let us know what you think.
I use a smart app called AnyRemote. It worked really well until I upgraded the OS and lost the IR capability. I chased the corporate whores at both Samsung and Google and both sides are pointing the fingers at one another.
 
Alexandre

Alexandre

Audioholic
Hi, you only seem to be comparing universal remotes that need to be purchased here, what about universal remote apps?

Anyone with an Android smartphone that has an IR blaster can download an app. Our company develops a free app which is called SURE Universal. We have around 3 million installs already and some great reviews.

Just search for it on Google Play and let us know what you think.
One issue I find with those is that it's impractical for guests visiting. A physical remote is much easier/familiar for that purpose. I've also never found a particularly good one that could deal with a bunch of devices à la Harmony One (but maybe I haven't looked hard enough – I'm also on iOS).
 
3db

3db

Audioholic Slumlord
One issue I find with those is that it's impractical for guests visiting. A physical remote is much easier/familiar for that purpose. I've also never found a particularly good one that could deal with a bunch of devices à la Harmony One (but maybe I haven't looked hard enough – I'm also on iOS).
AnyRemote worked really well...even created macros for my setups in 3 different rooms.
 
highfigh

highfigh

Seriously, I have no life.
I started using Hermony remotes in '04, after I saw a late-night show with one of the founders (because I couldn't sleep) and it was OK, but the jog wheel was a problem for some customers. It was also small and a bit slippery, so it could fly out of the hand when walking. The next few versions had their good and bad models (the 676 was actually pretty good) and then, Logitech bought them and so began the great sleep WRT how they performed and dealt with the market, dealers (we were treated like the ugly, redheaded step-child) and worse, consumers.

I have been using their 650 for simple systems because it works and then, they changed their website and an account only allows 5 remotes, with our dealer site not working for all models when cloning or an update was needed. That raised the possibility that dealers who have more than 50 separate customer accounts in their page would need to search for the login info, rather than just go to the dealer page and click on what we need.

Fast forward a few months and voila! New dealer site that is expanded to show customer account name, most of the equipment and all of the old buttons for removing, cloning and updating. The new software even allows cloning an old remote's program to the new models although the H1100's side buttons need to be created in the new models because these don't have actual side buttons, but they do allow adding buttons.

This brings me to the reason I considered the Elite in the first place- a customer's husband dropped and killed their 1100, which was doing a great job of operating the main system with Zone 2 controls in all activities- no need to go to a separate page and deal with any commands that might be re-sent and screwing up the activity. I decided to pick up an Elite and try it- I had checked out the Harmony One and absolutely hated it, although a large reason was that my laptop was having some issues but I DO NOT want any way for a customer to make changes to the remote's setup or activity functions by pressing buttons. This goes for their curious kids, too (yeah, I know it reads like the Wicked Witch), but.....).

I watched a couple of YouTube videos and started migrating the program, then stopped myself and transferred the setup for my own system, so I could see if it would get the TV's commands right, which had been a problem with the URC-780, even with the "help" of their tech support people. They keep telling me their database is the most complete, but I continue to see models missing, corrupt commands and that wastes my time, costs me money and it has been an expensive ride.

I didn't place the hub carefully, to allow the commands to hit all of the equipment and it still works flawlessly. As a matter of fact, it's sitting on a chair and not even aimed at the rack, without a wall to reflect from and the only piece I set to be controlled by the remote itself is the TV because I assumed it wouldn't receive the commands.

Pros-

The IR commands and emitters in the remote and hub are strong, they have delays built in so the equipment isn't flooded with commands that make it lose the will to live and just ignore them. The TV I have doesn't use discreet commands for power or sources and it scrolls through the inputs perfectly, turns it on and off without needing the Help button (it's still there, but it's part of a set of "fixes". I haven't tried the additional emitter "bugs" yet- I might not need them in the cabinet with my customer's system and that's pretty amazing since it's a tight space.

The hub has two IR ports, which accept the emitters that have two ends for the equipment. Like their older RF repeater, the output can be sent to an IR distribution module from companies like Zantec and Proficient, if more devices need to be controlled and aren't in the same area or when the hub can't be visible for aesthetic reasons.

The IP control for my Roku works great, although I have been testing the remote more than the iPhone app. I'll probably connect my ReQuest server to see how that works, too- I have another customer with two H1100 remotes that are getting a bit long in the tooth and I think the Elite will be a good replacement. It needs to work because I'm doing things Harmony told me I couldn't with that model, yet they work extremely well. So far, it hasn't lost connection to the router and I can still control the system through the hub that's using the main SSID, even though the phone was on the Guest Network, on a different address range.

It has a good feel- very solid. The hard buttons are plentiful, distinct and all are back-lit. It still has the learning window, too. That's a plus- some of the URC models require a separate learning device, at a cost that may not be practical for someone who doesn't add many models to their own database.

It has a rechargeable battery and charging base that takes up little space and doesn't allow the remote to slide out of position the way the 880 could.

It's easier to go from an Activity to the Device area, do what you want and return to your Activity without messing up the activity. If the activity stops or a device goes to the wrong input, etc, the help button now has separate buttons for 'Help" and 'Fix it myself'. It also has a settings button, and so far, I haven't found a way to screw up the setup.

Setup is in the Cloud, which means that a remotely located remote system can be set up without someone making a six hour round trip at a time when they really can't (my customer with two H1100s have a second home) and I think I'll use the Elite for the theater and another for the rest of the house) and it won't require the customer/user to do anything, which is great for someone who might be programming these for family & friends around the country/World.

It can control lighting and because it operates over IP, this isn't only the Z-Wave lighting. I'll explore that later.

Here's a list of compatible devices and it includes water heaters, thermostats, Lutron shades and lighting, Nest products, Hunter-Douglas, door locks, dimmer outlets and more.

https://support.myharmony.com/en-us/compatibility

As usual, they allow adding buttons. This makes adding and scrolling through more pages necessary, but it's better than not being able to add the needed commands. Also, they allow what they call 'Sequences', which are just additional command steps, including delays.

Speaking of delay settings, I just looked- delay time starts at 1 second and can be increased to 20 seconds. If more delay time is required, they have a button for Add Delay and another for Add Step. I added 45 more delays and it didn't stop me, even though I set most of them for 20 seconds. That means it will have no problem letting a projector to cool before shut-down. It would also allow the lights to be turned up/down/on/off for watching a movie, leaving, arriving, playing a movie trailer that's on a thumb drive, etc (as long as all needed commands are added, in the correct order and with the proper delays).

Cons-

I'd like to see them expand the height of the touch-screen buttons. It's a little too easy to press one that's adjacent to the one wanted.

I'd like the edges of the remote to be more "grippy". The back has a matte finish, but it's not like the old rubberized coating, which is good and bad- good because it became sticky over time and bad because it can slide off of a pant leg, sofa or out of a hand.

A battery charge indicator would be nice, but they had a warning before the battery went dead on other models, so I'll assume this does the same.

If I find more 'Pros' and 'Cons', I'll post them and at this point, I think the 'Pros' will continue to outnumber the 'Cons' by a good margin. I'll be working with this more in the next few days and since I only got it on Thursday, I think the fact that I haven't returned it out of frustration says a lot- I tolerate too much when it comes to remote control flaws and I haven't found anything that I would put in that category.

WRT the feel, I like that it doesn't feel cheap, but I also worry that dropping it might be a problem and more damage will result from landing on some surfaces. Stone and some hardwoods will damage any remote, so I'm not even thinking of those. The grippy edge and taller soft buttons could be fairly easy- I know they have space for the buttons because some screens require scrolling to see everything but the grippy edge requires re-tooling, so I'm not sure how they might address that. The shiny front wraps around to the backside and the textured back is a separate piece- I might suggest some kind of rubber strip that's replaceable and comes in a quantity that's not too expensive, but would allow a few replacements. Any additional sets could come in a bag, for display rack.

I think they got it right. I'll play with the iphone app more, but I really prefer the remote, at this point. I'll see if the iPad app is better, but I suspect the phone battery will be depleted sooner than I want but I will say that the phone recognizes the hub very quickly when starting/returning to the app.

A stable network will definitely be required if anyone expects an IP-based remote control to operate seamlessly. If not, it does use Bluetooth, too. Adding/editing activities is easy enough, although I plan to advise my customers to do this carefully. OTOH, if they really mess things up, the remote can be restored to its previous setup (I hope- will call about this).
 
DJWPAR3

DJWPAR3

Audioholic Intern
Very enlightening!
My Logitech Harmony 700 seems to be having some issues now. I just added a Chromecast and a TV4k input, and something is not right.
Input now reverts to the TV4k input after startup after first going to designated "settop Box".
I then have to go to the Yamaha remote to reset the input.
Several attempts on the setup software have only mangled the unit further, I now need to keep 3 remotes handy....NOT what I intended.
I have remotes for: My Yamaha 2050, Samsung 8500(smart hub remote), The Harmony 700 and a PS3....not to mention several kept in a nearby drawer,,(Xfinity remote, Samsung TV remote, PS3 remote)
I can get it all to work....but my spouse is NOT happy.

Considering jumping to the Elite. Reviews are good, but losing faith in Logitech. Any advice?

Samsung 65 in. 8500
Yamaha 2050
Sony PS3
SVS Towers LRC
Yamaha in-ceiling (6)
Xfinity 1 STB
 

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