Using receiver as preamp?

[Jaybeez]

I recently picked up a Rotel RX-1050 receiver at a great price.

At the time, the seller demo'd the same music on an ATI-2004, which he also had for sale.

The sound of the 2004 was significantly better than the Rotel, though I opted for the receiver due to price and the fact that with the ATI, I'd have to deal with a preamp set up in order to hook up my turntable, etc. This is a set up for 2 channel (vs. HT).

After a few weeks with the Rotel (which I really like) I'm still thinking about the ATI.

Given my current budget constraints, and the need for new speakers, I'm wondering if I can use the Rotel as my preamp. It has pre-outs, so thinking this might be an option.

My concern is that by using the receiver the sound profile of the Rotel would impact / degrade the better sound of ATI. Would this be the case? What I liked about the ATI is that it seemed to have more "weight", and sounded like it didn't have to try very hard to drive the speakers, providing a wide, detailed image at pretty low volumes.

It may be better to just hold on to the Rotel for now, and spend a bit more $$ on speakers (Sierra 2 vs. Sierra 1), then upgrade the amp with a dedicated quality preamp at a later date.

All thoughts and opinions welcomed and appreciated.

 

[markw]

Yes, you can use your receiver as a preamp.

On the lower lefty of the rear panel, there are jumpers that marry the preamp out to the power amp in.

Remove those jumpers and connect the preamp out to your chosen power amp. that will take the Rotel's power amp out of the circuit.

As for the sound, I can't offer any advice on that but, assuming you already have the RCA interconnect, it shouldn't cost anything to try it. In any case a stereo RCA interconnects are a dime a dozen.

 

[fmw]

The ATI will only sound better if the receiver is clipping. Modern solid state amplifiers are free of audible distortions and have been for decades. The difference between the two would be power capacity, not sound quality. I suspect the dealer demonstrated the ATI at a higher volume which would cause you to think it sounded better. It is a common trick.

If your unit sounds bad when operating at your chosen volume level then a more powerful amplifier may be indicated although it is actually fairly uncommon. Most people get along fine with the amps included with the receivers.

 

[Irvrobinson]

Just to present another side to the fmw/mtycraft perspective, several of us who are pretty technical about electronics and do understand specifications and measurements think there are audible differences between amplifiers when operating below clipping. And personally, I also think DBTs as a means to differentiate subtle audible differences are baloney, and I've participated in a few. I've never heard a Rotel receiver, but if you really prefer the ATI, it's only money. If you want to spend it that way I think it's a fine choice. I own an ATI amp. If you didn't have a preference I would say save your money, but if you do, I wouldn't let the assertive advice of these guys make you feel stupid. They don't bother me one little bit.

 

[fmw]

If you didn't have a preference I would say save your money, but if you do, I wouldn't let the assertive advice of these guys make you feel stupid. They don't bother me one little bit.

I agree completely. One should always follow their preferences. I am just explaining why he heard an audible difference in the dealer's showroom.

 

[Jaybeez]

Thanks for the feedback. I'll sit on this awhile and see if my bonus leaves me enough $$ for the amp as well as better speakers.

By the way, I heard everything in an individual's home, and he took great pains to maintain the same output.

He had everything totally flat and rotated through 2 ATI amps and the receiver with the same FLAC files, routed through his Oppo with the same cables, and played on the same speakers without a sub.

The speakers (Revel Ultimas) were far better than any I'll likely own, and perhaps that's the difference I heard.

The overall sensation was that the ATI 2004 was playing the music with less effort. This could be a function of 250 WPC vs. 100 WPC, but I definitely heard a difference. It just sounded "fuller" at the lower listening volume presented. I have ample history with sub-par speakers (at home and in my car) where more volume makes them sound better, so I appreciated great sound at low volumes.

Appreciate the replies. I may be best off to upgrade the speakers then decide following.

 

[markw]

A lot of variables besides the amp could affect your impression of what you heard.

But, IMNSHO, I'd upgrade the speakers first and take it from there. Speakers have the biggest effect on overall sound. the more you can spend on them, the better off you will be.

The amplifier would have less of an effect.

 

[fmw]

Thanks for the feedback. I'll sit on this awhile and see if my bonus leaves me enough $$ for the amp as well as better speakers.

By the way, I heard everything in an individual's home, and he took great pains to maintain the same output.

He had everything totally flat and rotated through 2 ATI amps and the receiver with the same FLAC files, routed through his Oppo with the same cables, and played on the same speakers without a sub.

The speakers (Revel Ultimas) were far better than any I'll likely own, and perhaps that's the difference I heard.

The overall sensation was that the ATI 2004 was playing the music with less effort. This could be a function of 250 WPC vs. 100 WPC, but I definitely heard a difference. It just sounded "fuller" at the lower listening volume presented. I have ample history with sub-par speakers (at home and in my car) where more volume makes them sound better, so I appreciated great sound at low volumes.

Appreciate the replies. I may be best off to upgrade the speakers then decide following.

I don't doubt that you heard a difference. The problem is that it is a sighted comparison without level matching. That means that you knew which unit was playing at a given time. That brings bias into the comparison. Level matching is a matter of of getting the volumes to within hundreds of a volt, not trying hard to make them the same. Anything can happen in such a comparison.

Amplifiers don't have a parameter relating to effort. They either operate within their design parameters or they don't. Assuming both amplifiers were operating below clipping, the only difference is that the larger one would have more overhead (unused power capacity) than the other. That difference would represent about 4db of overhead. Playing music at reasonable levels in a home environment should require less than 1 watt of power per channel on average and up to 10 to 15 watts on peaks. In other words 100 watts per channel is probably beyond what you will ever dissipate in a typical home environment.

If you want the amp then by all means buy it. I'm simply providing some information based on years of testing.

Finally, the best way to get great bass at any volume is to employ a subwoofer.

 

[Jaybeez]

Got it thanks.

I do appreciate the education and advice.

Clearly my priority at this point should be speakers.

Thanks again!

 

[fmw]

Yes and a subwoofer.