HDMI processing issue - receiver or TV?

[nm2285]

My home theater setup has worked well for me for almost a year. Recently, I've had some issues with video processing and I can't figure it out.

All of my sources run via HDMI through my Marantz SR7008 to my Samsung F8500 plasma. The problems I've been having recently:
- DirecTV receiver: shows that certain resolutions are not processed by my TV (which are not true - it's capable of processing all available)

- Roku: when switching to watch Roku, "No Signal" is displayed on the TV. It recognizes the source (if it didn't, a "Marantz" logo would appear) but says it's not getting any video signal. If I let it sit long enough, the Roku goes into a "reset loop" where it shows the boot screen for about 15 seconds, loses video for about 20 seconds, boot screen, no video....

- Home theater PC: runs windows 7 and has HDMI out. When switching to this input, the resolution is often changed. Sometimes I get a message saying "resolution not supported." Other times, the desktop is displayed, but in some resolution not 1920x1080 like it should be. The resolution that's displayed is not consistent (not like it's 1920x1080 or something else - it's variable)

Disconnecting the HDMI cable that connects receiver to TV from either end (connected to TV or connected to receiver) is the only thing that works. All I need to do is unplug and plug right back in and things are back to normal. These issues also don't happen every time I try to use the devices. Probably about 50% of the time.

Things I've tried that have had no effect:
- Change cables between devices and receiver and between receiver and TV
- Change devices (had a back up Roku)
- Perform factory resets to receiver and TV. It might be worth noting that everything worked fine after these resets for maybe 2-3 days before having the issues again. However, that happened with both the TV and the receiver reset, so it didn't give me any clue as to the culprit.
- Turn on/off video processing in receiver

Does anyone have any clue what's going on? Any way to diagnose whether it's the TV or the receiver without going through the hassle of replacing one? Really frustrating since everything used to work fine!

 

[j_garcia]

Do you have the receiver set to pass thru or upconvert? It actually almost sounds like the receiver has a problem with handshake to the TV, OR it isn't handshaking properly to the devices in question since sometimes it displays the Marantz logo. That disconnect/reconnect seems to fix it suggests handshake problem though.

 

[nm2285]

I have tried both. Doesn't seem to make a difference. If it is a handshake problem, is there a good solution?

 

[Stanton]

I would say it sounds like a bad HDMI port, but it's happening on all ports. I'm pretty sure that AVR doesn't have HDMI 2.X ports, and the older HDMI chips don't seem to hold up.

 

[TLS Guy]

This is a difficult problem. There is clearly an HDMI board going bad, the problem is which one, the AVR or the TV board.

Statistically it is much more likely to be the AVR. The reason being is that the AVR is an HDMI receiving and transmitting device, and therefore has to make continuous repeater handshakes. The TV on the other hand is an end device, and only required to make an initial handshake.

If you connect your peripherals to the TV and bypass the receiver, and the devices work fine, that would be strong, but not absolute evidence that the TV is OK.

Substituting another receiver would really nail it down.

The other option, and not easy to find a place to do it, is to bench test the receiver.

I have long thought that we passed the point where it was totally unreasonable to put all that much facility and a vast number of power amps in one case.

I'm betting on a very short life cycle for receivers like yours. My money is on the fact that it is receiver repair or replacement time.

Quite honestly if you want or need that type of functionality, stepping up to a pre/pre and external amps, seems a much better engineering choice.

I'll admit I have long been against the concept of receivers and never have and never will own one, unless I had need for a very simple device.

With a receiver like yours I would personally expect trouble and I would bet it would find me fast.

 

[nm2285]

Over the past week I have switched to the monitor 2 output on the receiver. No change. Just this morning I changed to a totally different cable brand (last time I changed HDMI cables, it was same brand, same quality). It's a long run (25') so I was hoping that will make a difference.

Consensus seems to be that the issue is in the receiver. If the cable change doesn't do anything, I'll likely bring a different TV down and use it for a day or two to see if the problems continue.

This is a difficult problem. There is clearly an HDMI board going bad, the problem is which one, the AVR or the TV board.

Statistically it is much more likely to be the AVR. The reason being is that the AVR is an HDMI receiving and transmitting device, and therefore has to make continuous repeater handshakes. The TV on the other hand is an end device, and only required to make an initial handshake.

If you connect your peripherals to the TV and bypass the receiver, and the devices work fine, that would be strong, but not absolute evidence that the TV is OK.

Substituting another receiver would really nail it down.

The other option, and not easy to find a place to do it, is to bench test the receiver.

I have long thought that we passed the point where it was totally unreasonable to put all that much facility and a vast number of power amps in one case.

I'm betting on a very short life cycle for receivers like yours. My money is on the fact that it is receiver repair or replacement time.

Quite honestly if you want or need that type of functionality, stepping up to a pre/pre and external amps, seems a much better engineering choice.

I'll admit I have long been against the concept of receivers and never have and never will own one, unless I had need for a very simple device.

With a receiver like yours I would personally expect trouble and I would bet it would find me fast.

I totally understand your concerns - it's like having an old TV/VCR combo. Something was bound to break and make both unusable. The problem is, I wanted a system with 3 zones, 2 independent HDMI, Sub EQ HT for dual sub calibration, and a relatively easy user interface. That's nearly (if not totally) impossible to find in pre/pros especially for anywhere near the same value.

 

[TLS Guy]

Over the past week I have switched to the monitor 2 output on the receiver. No change. Just this morning I changed to a totally different cable brand (last time I changed HDMI cables, it was same brand, same quality). It's a long run (25') so I was hoping that will make a difference.

Consensus seems to be that the issue is in the receiver. If the cable change doesn't do anything, I'll likely bring a different TV down and use it for a day or two to see if the problems continue.



I totally understand your concerns - it's like having an old TV/VCR combo. Something was bound to break and make both unusable. The problem is, I wanted a system with 3 zones, 2 independent HDMI, Sub EQ HT for dual sub calibration, and a relatively easy user interface. That's nearly (if not totally) impossible to find in pre/pros especially for anywhere near the same value.

Well, let us know what happens. A new brand of cable might help, at 25' you are right at the limit of a non active cable, so in your case quality will make a difference. For you a higher quality cable than average is an essential. You might be lucky here. There are quite a few cables that have trouble at 25'.

I think some of us are not too impressed with bells and whistles. We find the best bang for the buck is basic engineering. I do not use any Audyssey EQ at all. Don't have any need for it. Any attempts to use it are a significant downgrade. I don't need a bunch of apps in my pre/pre either.

I also have no need of miserable Linux boxes either like ROKU. If you have a decent HTPC loaded with Windows 10, you can grab anything you want from anywhere, quickly and easily.

I much prefer having units dedicated to a specific task for maximum performance and keep it in one place. The only control I use on my TV is the on/off button. I just use volume, input selection and sound mode controls on the pre/pro. I did use it for distance and channel level. I don't use anything else. The only other control is the switch I have to go from pre/pro bass management to mine. That is so I can properly play SACDs and BDs that do not have an LFE channel. That is all I need on the basic guts of the system, everything else I need is in the peripheral units. I honestly think that makes for the easiest and most robust engineering solution.

 

[BoredSysAdmin]

Just this morning I changed to a totally different cable brand (last time I changed HDMI cables, it was same brand, same quality). It's a long run (25') so I was hoping that will make a difference.

Just to be clear on one thing - did you tried to eliminate the long hdmi cable for much shorter one (6' for example( - just for a test?
If this fixes things up - you might need to purchase better quality active hdmi cable

 

[nm2285]

This is what I just tried. http://www.monoprice.com/product?c_id=102&cp_id=10255&cs_id=1025506&p_id=12735&seq=1&format=2
No luck Seems like it should have done the trick. I was questionning whether or not it would make a difference since the 1st cable did work for about a year before all these issues. Time to try a TV swap...

 

[nm2285]

Well the substitute TV was in place for 2 days and didn't have any of the issues...not good news for my beloved plasma. Found a "service reset" on the TV and cleared everything last night. Hopefully that will have some effect.

 

[TLS Guy]

Well the substitute TV was in place for 2 days and didn't have any of the issues...not good news for my beloved plasma. Found a "service reset" on the TV and cleared everything last night. Hopefully that will have some effect.

Well that nails it down. Hopefully the reset will do the trick. However now we know where the problem is I find this is a known and prevalent problem with that TV.

The HDMI circuit is part of the main AV processing board.

The cost is $73.60.

Unfortunately as so often happens when there is a prevalent problem parts run out. If you like the TV you might want to do a more exhaustive search and see if you can locate a board.

Be warned however, that chip sets and boards are usually only made once. In cases of prevalent problems like this, parts run out quickly and the units are done.

If you research you will find numerous reports of just what you describe with this TV.

 

[Don G.]

I had exactly the same problem with my Samsung Plasma (same model even) and my DirecTV. I called DirecTV and had them come to my house and check everything. First thing the guys says, never run a DirecTV signal through an AV receiver. He ran directly from the DirecTV box to my TV and left everything else running through the receiver. Fixed the problem and it never came back.

I was amazed. It worked fine for 4 months after installation and I never changed a component. It just started having problems. Most likely it was related to a software or firmware update from DirecTV, but since his solution worked and is only a minor inconvenience, I just left it the way he did it.

 

[TLS Guy]

I had exactly the same problem with my Samsung Plasma (same model even) and my DirecTV. I called DirecTV and had them come to my house and check everything. First thing the guys says, never run a DirecTV signal through an AV receiver. He ran directly from the DirecTV box to my TV and left everything else running through the receiver. Fixed the problem and it never came back.

I was amazed. It worked fine for 4 months after installation and I never changed a component. It just started having problems. Most likely it was related to a software or firmware update from DirecTV, but since his solution worked and is only a minor inconvenience, I just left it the way he did it.

I have had Direct TV for years and it works fine to the Marantz pre/pro. May be that have the odd tuner not HDCP compliant. A device has to HDMI repeater compliant to run through a receiver, but only end compliant to run to a TV. The former is much more complex.

I only want one cable going to my TVs.

 

[Don G.]

I have had Direct TV for years and it works fine to the Marantz pre/pro. May be that have the odd tuner not HDCP compliant. A device has to HDMI repeater compliant to run through a receiver, but only end compliant to run to a TV. The former is much more complex.

I only want one cable going to my TVs.

Agree, best to only have one. But it absolutely would not work through my Denon receiver. I now have a near top of Onkyo's line A/V Preamp and it works fine through that. I was just sharing what my experience was and how it was fixed.