Audiophile Forum

[miklorsmith]

I think we should have a section which is friendly to, and directed at audiophiles who are trying tweaks, equipment combinations, power conditioning, etc.

This section should be devoted to positive sharing of experience and exclusive of people demanding proof by DBT. This could even be a disclaimer at the beginning: "no tests were performed and Audioholics is not responsible for any outlandish/untested/untrue claims represented here."

The staff should even chime in where necessary when doubters throw in their "Tested?" criticisms which are rampant everywhere else here. Nobody tests audible properties adequately and if they are the basis for discussion, the threads will be pretty quiet.

Hey, everywhere else the same unrequitted demands are the rule of the day, even though the answer is invariably "no testing done". There should be just one safe place to have discussions within the non-testing crowd.

We could even call it "Subjectivists Unite!"

[Resident Loser]

...there already is such a place...it's called Audio Asylum...and to a lesser degree(nowadays) Audio Review...I hope the AH folks aren't upset at the mention of the "competition"...

Why over at AA some folks seem to think they can hear the difference of the color of wire sheathing...that's pretty tweaky IMO...

Over at AR there is a separate holding pen for the more "objective" of participants...and the moderators constantly "chime-in" and move or delete posts that don't provide a warm and cushy atmosphere for the "tweakier" folks...although things may be getting a trifle "looser" in that regard...

jimHJJ(...just an observation...)

[Francious70]

Here at Audioholics the motto is "Pursuing the TRUTH in audio and video." and "Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff, ensuring that marketing slogans aren't the only guidelines for your home theater choices."

Paul

Edited for my atrocious spelling.

[miklorsmith]

I see. Right on.

You should probably try to spell your motto correctly.

Never mind, I'm leaving you.

Cya.

[goodman]

Never mind, I'm leaving you. Cya.

I hope you will reconsider, because you are obviously a thoughtful and intelligent person who makes interesting contributions. Also, I think you and your "tweak" concept are a good fit under "Philosophers and Wisemen".

[keitfoster]

Hello,

Please tell me if can which studio monitors are better

BEHRINGER truth B2031

or

ALESIS M1 active MK2

Thanks!!!!

[mulester7]

Hello,

Please tell me if can which studio monitors are better

BEHRINGER truth B2031

or

ALESIS M1 active MK2

Thanks!!!!

.....Keitfoster, welcome to Audioholics....you would probably get an answer more quickly to your question-of-comparison, by placing it on the "LOUDSPEAKERS AND SUBWOOFERS" forum as a "new" thread......

[Tom Andry]

I'm not sure what shocks me most:

1) miklorsmith leaving us...again :rolleyes: (dude, you knew what the responses would be before you posted, don't get all huffy)
2) mulester7 with a coherent post :confused:

oh, it's got to be

3) mulester7 helping someone else be understood.

My whole world is crumbling around me. :D

Oh, yeah, so I contribute, never heard either speaker so I have to suggest mine. :p

[miklorsmith]

I'm not leaving again. I've spent my one dramatic exit already. These flailing gestures are effective and dramatic only if the prima donna doesn't come back under the cover of darkness. Was he ever gone? Maybe a figment.

People who repeatedly and dramatically storm out of rooms are generally ignored. I resemble that remark! See? Tree falling in the forest.

This is a resuscitation of the first and only stormy huff. Don't worry, I'm keeping my eye on you. And, Mulester, excellent advice. And, I agree with both of you, mrnomas is a funny cat.

[mulester7]

I'm not leaving again. I've spent my one dramatic exit already. These flailing gestures are effective and dramatic only if the prima donna doesn't come back under the cover of darkness. Was he ever gone? Maybe a figment.

People who repeatedly and dramatically storm out of rooms are generally ignored. I resemble that remark! See? Tree falling in the forest.

This is a resuscitation of the first and only stormy huff. Don't worry, I'm keeping my eye on you. And, Mulester, excellent advice. And, I agree with both of you, mrnomas is a funny cat.

.....you're a mighty good man, MiklorSmith, and among friends.....

[Clint DeBoer]

There should be just one safe place to have discussions within the non-testing crowd.

We could even call it "Subjectivists Unite!"We're not opposed to it, though I generally create new forums out of need, rather than out of desire. One problem is that you simply cannot keep people out who would turn every thread into a big "Nyah, prove it!" statement.

[Rob Babcock]

The idea is not without merit, but there are already myriad other websites and forums dedicated to the flakier side of audio. I'm with Clint on this one- I don't really see the need. An individual thread posted occasionally will suffice.

Besides, you can always just tell Chris and Mtrycrafts to shut up! :p

[miklorsmith]

I actually disagree with myself here. It wasn't a great idea. People seeking that advice and information gather elsewhere. I posit "Subjectivists Unite" would be a cold and dusty place.

And yes, there are some pretty flaky watering holes. I've sampled that brew too. The surprising thing isn't the taste, but how much there is.

Somewhere between Einstein and Warhol. . .

[KMoses]

I like reading reviews and comparing stat's on various equipment....Looking for some old JBL speakers and have some equipment i need to get rid of.

[Clint DeBoer]

That's cool. I like to make completely off-topic posts in really old threads.

[Seth=L]

That's cool. I like to make completely off-topic posts in really old threads.
I didn't even realize I was reading an old thread until the last post. And just as well I passed KMoses' post without reading it and read yours, then read his, then I LOL'd.:D

[Adam]

I didn't even realize I was reading an old thread until the last post.

I was about halfway through myself before I realized! I thought, "Wow, Mulester is posting again? Cool." Then I saw one of the dates.

[tinidus]

Hello Gentlemen,
I am a novice. Sorry I do not know how to navigate. I have an idea and need help with it. Could you who appear to be top dogs help me with it. I will try to learn how to post a thread or line about it later when I learn.
The question is this, I got my hands on for now one Electro Voice 30w. Just the huge speaker itself. I will need to build a cab for it. This speaker is huge. Do any of you have any experience with the EV 30w or could you point me in a direction for great ideas. I have thought about mounting it on my garage door and using the whole world as a speaker box since it is so big. Just kidding.
Thanks

[Matt34]

This thread.....bringing the obscure and the funny since 2005.:D

[Seth=L]

It always comes back. The topic is just so enticing.:D

[Adam]

This thread.....bringing the obscure and the funny since 2005.:D

It always comes back. The topic is just so enticing.:D

Indeed! I look forward to the next newbie post on here in the fall of 2009. Although, the rate of off-topic newbie posts is accelerating. Perhaps it'll be spring of 2009...

[Seth=L]

Indeed! I look forward to the next newbie post on here in the fall of 2009. Although, the rate of off-topic newbie posts is accelerating. Perhaps it'll be spring of 2009...
It's only a matter of time before Mike_C sees this thread and closes it down to take all the fun away from the thread.:D

[majorloser]

It's only a matter of time before Mike_C sees this thread and closes it down to take all the fun away from the thread.:D

Not to worry. I'll re-open it. :)

[Adam]

Not to worry. I'll re-open it. :)

"With great power there must also come--great responsibility."

The Spider-Mod credo. :)

[mike c]

what? me, close a fun thread? :)

my main function is spam cleaning, so i wouldn't touch a thread where other mods have already started to have fun :)

[Rickster71]

Indeed! I look forward to the next newbie post on here in the fall of 2009. Although, the rate of off-topic newbie posts is accelerating. Perhaps it'll be spring of 2009...

It may be sooner than you think.

I hope you guys can help.
I have this really weird rash....

[TLS Guy]

I think we should have a section which is friendly to, and directed at audiophiles who are trying tweaks, equipment combinations, power conditioning, etc.

This section should be devoted to positive sharing of experience and exclusive of people demanding proof by DBT. This could even be a disclaimer at the beginning: "no tests were performed and Audioholics is not responsible for any outlandish/untested/untrue claims represented here."

The staff should even chime in where necessary when doubters throw in their "Tested?" criticisms which are rampant everywhere else here. Nobody tests audible properties adequately and if they are the basis for discussion, the threads will be pretty quiet.

Hey, everywhere else the same unrequitted demands are the rule of the day, even though the answer is invariably "no testing done". There should be just one safe place to have discussions within the non-testing crowd.

We could even call it "Subjectivists Unite!"

Subjectivists are actually a menace, and like Margaret Thatcher said of the left, "they need to be swatted regularly."

They create endless distractions, and divert funds and attention away from achieving real progress. So consider yourself swatted!

[MinusTheBear]

So consider yourself swatted!

Last post by miklorsmith 04-05-2006.

[Adam]

Last post by miklorsmith 04-05-2006.

True, but last activity was less than a month ago.

[Joe Schmoe]

There could be subsections to discuss the audible benefits of elevating cables on blocks, taping little bags of pebbles to the terminals, and biwiring.:)

[jamie2112]

There could be subsections to discuss the audible benefits of elevating cables on blocks, taping little bags of pebbles to the terminals, and biwiring.:)

You could just call it "When Audiophiles FAIL"....get your speaker cables off the floor don't you know they sound WAAAYYY better if they are elevated ......:eek:

[yettitheman]

You could just call it "When Audiophiles FAIL"....get your speaker cables off the floor don't you know they sound WAAAYYY better if they are elevated ......:eek:

Mine are elevated 12 inches above the atmosphere of space so that the wires wrapped in ERS papAr will last, and that the RF and EMI that is caused by radio waves is null because the wires run perpendicular to the ground straight from the sky.... beat that can of tuna for most obsessive audiophile. :p :D

[mike c]

Mine are elevated 12 inches above the atmosphere of space so that the wires wrapped in ERS papAr will last, and that the RF and EMI that is caused by radio waves is null because the wires run perpendicular to the ground straight from the sky.... beat that can of tuna for most obsessive audiophile. :p :D

what do you do about the cosmic rays, gamma rays, and what not?

[sparky77]

I'm not too worried, my house is wrapped in lead film and attached to 6 12ft ground rods.

[itschris]

My cables are 18 inches thick and have a box on one end that directs the signal through the inner most 4 inches leaving a total of 12 surrounding inches for protection against all you mention.





... really... I have no idea what the f this thread is about so I thought I'd add my own stupid comment.

[MinusTheBear]

I only listen to my system during sunset. It just sounds better.

[Seth=L]

I was going to get some black onyx pyramids to place on top of my speakers to give it a darker multidimensional sound.:)

[jamie2112]

I'm not too worried, my house is wrapped in lead film and attached to 6 12ft ground rods.

That is REALLY freaky MINE TOO.........:D

[krabapple]

It always comes back. The topic is just so enticing.:D

The question to me is, if Audioholics is "Pursuing the TRUTH in audio and video." and advertising itself as a place "Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff, ensuring that marketing slogans aren't the only guidelines for your home theater choices", why are its subjective tests 'sighted' (i.e., not rigorous)?

Anyway, what I meant to say is, my cat's breath smells like cat food.

[Adam]

Anyway, what I meant to say is, my cat's breath smells like cat food.

Not sure if that had any actual meaning, but the sentence sure made me laugh! Thanks for that.

[krabapple]

Not sure if that had any actual meaning, but the sentence sure made me laugh! Thanks for that.


I got it from this guy:

http://animatedtv.about.com/library/graphics/ralphnose.jpg

[mike c]

The question to me is, if Audioholics is "Pursuing the TRUTH in audio and video." and advertising itself as a place "Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff, ensuring that marketing slogans aren't the only guidelines for your home theater choices", why are its subjective tests 'sighted' (i.e., not rigorous)?

Anyway, what I meant to say is, my cat's breath smells like cat food.

sighted and rigorous sure doesn't seem like they're related to each other.
(please correct me with dictionary definitions if i am wrong)

there are quite a number of objective tests done on the reviewed products and the subjective tests are exactly that - subjective.

[wingz]

I agree! That would be very helpful for me. Thanks.

[krabapple]

sighted and rigorous sure doesn't seem like they're related to each other.
(please correct me with dictionary definitions if i am wrong)


They're not. That was my point. A sighted 'review' of how a unit SOUNDs is not rigorous. The claim is ""Where audio and video equipment undergoes rigorous objective and subjective tests by our staff" -- if Audioholics means "rigorous objective test, and not-rigorous subjective tests" then perhaps that's how it should read.


there are quite a number of objective tests done on the reviewed products and the subjective tests are exactly that - subjective.

And my point again is, you're taking the science halfway. Sighted subjective 'tests' have deep inherent problems, so why rely on them at all? It's possible to make even subjective reports of SOUND quality more rigorous by making them less prone to influence from non-sound factors.

Subjectivity comes into review of SOUND in two ways
1) subjective impression that unit/treatment A sound different from B
2) subjective impression that unit/treatement A sounds BETTER (or worse) than B

Logically, if (1) ends up having no objective support -- from measurements, or from a BLIND listening comparison -- then (2) is unlikely to have any either.

So one way to 'pursue the truth' more diligently, whenever A is being compared to B, is to do it blind.

When there IS a real difference in sound, blinding is also called for to circumvent the natural inclination to rate 'sound' based at least partly on 'non sound' factors, like price, appearance, brand reputation, etc.

[krustyx]

great idea