Nieghbor complains about base

[Vancouver]

Hey Guys,
I have a B&W ASW-500 subwoofer. Unfortunately because I will in a loft my one nieghbor always comlains that he hears it. I never have the base turned up very much, but was wondering if there is any thing I can do to play it at as reasonable level, but not have it effect my nieghbor so much.

[Rip Van Woofer]

Shoot the neighbor! :D

No easy or cheap solution, alas. Low bass travels thru walls, ceilings and floors easily unless they are fairly massive. Unless you can add another layer of drywall to your listening room walls and ceiling which adds mass (the main way to soundproof) I don't know what to suggest.

If the sub is on the floor and the neigbor lives below you, isolating the sub from the floor might help if the cabinet is physically coupling with the floor and rattling his ceiling. So would another layer of subflooring which, again, would add mass.

[RLA]

Actually there is a simple solution You can Augment the Subwoofer with a couple of LFE Butt Kickers mounted in your chair this will allow you to turn the Subs LFE down and still maintain some sense of LFE without driving your neighbors crazy I use this solution in Apartments and condos and most people are very satisfied with the result
Cheers
Ray

[RLA]

Feel free to e-mail me for more details
Ray

[Vancouver]

Hey Ray...thanks for the suggestion and it sounds very interesting. I only have a couple questions about it.

What is LFE butt kicker?

What do you plug them into?

Does the Subwoof no longer output the LFE that the butt kicker picks up?

How much are they?



I dont want ot bug you with email, but this suggestion is very interesting.

[RLA]

Hi
here is the link to the site you would use a "Y" splitter at the receivers LFE output one half to the subwoofer that is turned down and one half to the butt kicker amp that would be turned up
http://www.thebuttkicker.com/





(high resolution)

The ButtKicker® LFE (previously named "ButtKicker 2")

The only tactile transducer designed specifically to take advantage of the .1 and LFE channels, the ButtKicker® LFE features extended low frequency response for powerful bass response and special effects.

The ButtKicker LFE (low frequency effects) utilizes a patented magnetic suspension which is different from any other speaker or shaker and can be used couches, theater seating, platforms, and any type of structure. The ButtKicker accurately reproduce the "feeling" range of many natural and man-made sounds, such as earthquakes, thunderstorms, rocket launches, waves, explosions, tornadoes, volcanoes, dinosaurs, sound effects and all styles of music.

Different from other shakers or tactile transducers that use voice coil technology, the ButtKicker is much more powerful, more musical (linear) and offer true infrasonic or low frequency response with their resonant frequency of 9 Hz and range of 5 - 200 Hz.

One ButtKicker LFE will easily replace 2 - 4 or more of the other types of shakers previously available, and perhaps more importantly; it is virtually indestructible and maintenance free. The ButtKicker is used in: Theme park attractions; Specialty theaters; Simulators; Virtual reality machines; Arcade and amusement rides/games; and Custom Home theaters.

If you are looking to delight and electrify yourself and others with an affordable and easy to use solution, now is the time to incorporate the ButtKicker into your design.

We invite you to "Feel what you've been missing!"

What's the Difference Between the ButtKicker LFE and the New ButtKicker Concert?

What's Different from the Original BK1?

ButtKicker 2 Wins CES Innovations Award

Marketing Brochure
Specifications


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ButtKicker LFE Specifications
Dimensions: 5.375" high x 5.5" wide, oval
Frequency Response: 5 - 200 Hz
Weight: 11 lbs., 5 kg.
Nominal Impedance: 4 ohms
Power Handling: 400 watts min. / 1500 watts max.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


An Overview of the ButtKicker

The ButtKicker is a small, linear motor, which reacts to an audio signal sent by an amplifier. It is similar to a loudspeaker, but instead of moving a cone, and transferring sound waves through the air, it attaches to seats and floors, and sends low frequency sound directly into the listener's body. The effect is amazing.

It takes two senses to perceive full range sound. We hear sound, but we also feel sound, especially low frequency. Traditionally, it takes big speakers, moving tremendous amounts of air, to feel the low frequency of sound. People like loud concerts because they want to feel the sound pressure in their bodies.

The ButtKicker reproduces the feeling range of audio in a more direct way than through air. The perception is actually better and sound pressure disappears. When using headphones, for example, with a ButtKicker, the listener perceives powerful, musically accurate, concert-level audio, but no one else hears anything. The sound is completely isolated to the listener.

This becomes very interesting for music monitoring and recording studios. We have several dozen of the top touring bands this summer using ButtKickers for stage monitoring. The ButtKicker gives them complete control over their mix and sound level, without sacrificing any quality. Most musicians tell us immediately that they hear better and play better with the ButtKicker.

In a recording studio, the ButtKicker allows for low volume, incredible isolation.. and, because the ButtKicker was designed to be musically accurate, to fractions of frequencies, studio engineers are finding that their mixes are coming out tighter, cleaner and better balanced.

For example: I am a music writer/producer and studio musician. I do soundtrack work for various commercial companies and stage show producers, in my own little home studio, using computer with Cubase, Sonar, etc. I always use the ButtKicker to check my mixes.

[Vancouver]

well the product does sound amazing and I am going to look into it. Why wouldnt every one with a serious home theater get one of these? Seems like a relativley cheap upgrade.

[markw]

1500 watts max? Hoo boy. That's for each unit, right? So, three units would require three separate amplifiers?

[Vancouver]

would be interesting to know the cost, but it looks like they make their own amps.

http://www.thebuttkicker.com/buttkicker%20amplifier_home.html

[mtrycrafts]

Hey Guys,
I have a B&W ASW-500 subwoofer. Unfortunately because I will in a loft my one nieghbor always comlains that he hears it. I never have the base turned up very much, but was wondering if there is any thing I can do to play it at as reasonable level, but not have it effect my nieghbor so much.


You need to move if you want the sub.
I doubt that shaker will be inaudible as it will carry throught the floor framing. Extra layer of drywall will not help either as you still have the wood frame behind it, the floor and ceiling.

[Stupid]

If you can control the Hz's just turn the Hz's up high. The higher the Hz's the less the bass will travel. Also the higher the Hz's, the less volume you will need for the woofer.

[RLA]

Hi
you can run 2 Butt-Kickers off of one AMP or if you have an old receiver laying around that has a decent amp section you can use that
The Butt-Kickers are not audible if mounted to the chair frame they transmit there energy through the chair and very little of it reaches the contact points of the floor even if you are on tile floor you can use rubber isolation
cups sold at Home Depot t place under the legs of the chair or sofa
Istallation is pretty straight forward I have some mounted in my recliner
and you can do it your self if you are handy
feel free to contact me for more info

[mledwards]

The ButtKicker LFE looks to be an expensive proposition, and the original problem -- isolating LF from the neighbor -- won't be corrected (?) The B-LFE still is generating (according to your post 5-200hz) which will cruize from the furniture into the floor and down to the neighbor. Perhaps you can put the furniture on carpet and rubber feet, but wouldn't it be a lot cheaper to like stick the subwoofer on a pile of pillows (isolate the sub from the floor) and see if it corrects the problem. Then from there, perhaps some Buttkicker Kinetic Rubber isolators on the sub. Also, I woudl recommend moving the sub away from the wall to see if that helps.

[JohnA]

there is also the Aura Bass Shakers

found here:

http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/pshowdetl.cfm?&DID=7&Partnumber=299-027

[Francious70]

I remember seeing those things previewed on The Screen Saves, if anyone else watches that show.

Paul

[Vancouver]

I cut two squash balls in half and put each half under a foot of my sub. Moving it away from the wall is not an option unfortunately. Right now its against a brick wall...is that better or worse the puting by drywall....the only person who complains to me is the guy who lives above.

[RLA]

The ButtKicker LFE looks to be an expensive proposition, and the original problem -- isolating LF from the neighbor -- won't be corrected (?) The B-LFE still is generating (according to your post 5-200hz) which will cruize from the furniture

You know your right thats why they havent worked in the 20-25 installs I have done in Condo's,Apartments and Townhouses better off defeating the subwoofer and running the speakers at 125Hz I find putting the subwoofers on Big piles of sleeping bags work better than pillows :rolleyes:
but heck what do I know :p

[goodman]

Right now, there is a car outside my office window with the bass thumping away, so I can feel your neighbor's pain. Shut the sub off when the neighbor is home and turn it back on when he's not there.

[Mr.T]

Or, give your neighbor a nice Christmas present "ear muffs" for indoor and outdoor use.

[Redbone]

Hey you have a right to live in your place and enjoy music as well. I was like you when I first moved in, kept everything super quite. Then I realized my divorced neighbor would let his 11 and 14 year old kids run around his house like wild indians knocking things over, yelling, screaming well into the night. It was obvious to me that he did not care about me so why should I return the favor.

You should be able to play your stereo comfortably between the hours of 9am to 10pm. On the weekends anything should go- your neighbor needs to learn that he does not live in a single family home and comprimise is what is needed.

[Vancouver]

Redbone....You make very strong points and I share them.

[mfabien]

RLA,

My Yamaha RX-V540 directs LFE to my front Towers because I elected not to have a sub (compromise with my wife). Should I get a ButtKicher2, I assume it, or the special amplifier that should go with it, would use the receiver's subwoofer output. That being the case, I assume I would lose audible LFE from the Towers...and that would be hardly acceptable.

[RLA]

Hi Mfabien
Your Yamaha Receiver has the ability to select Large Front mains and
direct LFE to "BOTH" this is in the set up menu of the receiver
you would then use the subwoofer pre-out to a Butt Kicker AMP
that can drive 2 Butt Kicker LFE's
You can get the whole Kit that includes (1) Butt Kicker LFE (1) 2100 watt amp wiring and mounting kit for $529

Ray

[Redbone]

I share your pain vancouver as I was very weary of getting a sub as I live in a duplex. Then I thought to myself, I have a right to enjoy myself and live my life to. I have a nice Hsu STF2 that can really pound, although I usually keep it at nice audible levels 85dB or so to be courteous. If I wanted to get silly though I am sure I could hit 105dB without equipment problems and I guess that would be being a ****.

If you keep it civil he cannot complain and if he does about that screw him for being unreasonable. As was stated earlier in this post, a member heard a car outside his window that vibrated his desk and chair and their is nothing we can do about that. Your neighbor has to accept the fact that he lives next to an audioholic.

[Beegowl]

Well, guys, I'm no Miss Manners, but I'm going to throw in my two cents worth as a dedicated audiophile and owner of a system that can definitely shake the neighbor's walls. Apartment living does require some compromises, but as one who has experienced both sides of the issue, I have to come down on the side of those whose rights we encroach upon with audio systems that intrude into their right to enjoy the silence and peace of their own little haven. Just put yourself into the shoes of someone who is deep into a meditative trance (or reading, or napping, or...) when it is broken by an inconsiderate audiophile listening to L. L. Cool J at foundation shaking bass levels. Or watching the battle scenes from Master and Commander. It's just not fair to others. When I lived in an apartment I just did not turn the volume up on my system. I bought a pair of good headphones and used them, and went to someone else's place to share a movie if I really wanted to turn it up. Or made sure my neighbors were away for the weekend. I found a house to rent and moved out so I could enjoy my system as loud as I wanted to enjoy it. If apartment living is your only option, then an audio system that brings the cops to your front door for disturbing the peace just doesn't make sense.

I love music and I like to listen to it loud, but I don't have the right to disturb my neighbor, just as he doesn't have the right to disturb me.

[JoeE SP9]

I live in a Phila. row home so I am well aware of the problems loud music can cause with neighbors. I try to be considerate. I don't play music loudly before 9AM or after 10PM except om weekends when 11PM or midnight is the limit. Of course, when I have a party I may go longer than that but then I invite my neighbors. :cool:

[Redbone]

I agree with you gentlemen, there is a limit and we all know that limit, shaking the walls with bass is beyond that limit and we know this. I used to live next door to a bunch of college kids and every night at 11pm sharp the surround sound system went on. It was no doubt one of those crappy panasonice all in one systems so it didn't really shake the walls, but they had no consideration for me or my girlfriend and her 9 year old child.

I know what it is like to be on both sides and the bottom line for me is that your neighbors shouldn't prevent you from listening to music at a nice respectable (75dB- 85) level, in those situations everybody has to learn to live with everybody. I keep a sound meter handy and if my neighbor wants to complain I can always say my system was 75-80dB well within the rights of the law.

[Vancouver]

Well I am under the impression that if you don't want to hear your niegbors then buy a house and dont share a wall with them. Since I chose to live in the city and share walls with people I accept their noise and they must respect mine. I disagree that I shouldnt play my music in case my neigbor is reading or napping....in that case they are infringing on my little hevan which includes music. I think the only reasonable comprimise is to not play music past 10 pm.

My nieghbor is 70 plus years old and I am 26...it may be time for him to buy a house or go into an old age home. I am not being unreasonable with my music he just comlains any time he can hear me.

Think about this analogy....what if I was in a band and made my living that way. Would that mean I can not practice my instrument at my home?

[Punkuk]

There is another way to go check these guys out.
http://www.clarksynthesis.com/home-products.php
I got two and they rocked
I blew one after about a year sent it back and no problems they replaced it.

You can drive them off of your front outputs if your amp can handle the low Impedance that way you will get the full spectrum of sound.
The only problem I found going this route was because they are not as fast as my fronts I got voices in my arse.
I then used a second LFE output from a DTR 9.1 to an Adcom 555 (Plenty of oomph)

I don’t think 1500 watts is necessary unless you have them mounted under a custom riser 150 watts is plenty if you mount them to a sofa or chair.

Remember they are there to enhance your listening experience and not be the center of it.

[johnu]

Well I am under the impression that if you don't want to hear your niegbors then buy a house and dont share a wall with them. Since I chose to live in the city and share walls with people I accept their noise and they must respect mine. I disagree that I shouldnt play my music in case my neigbor is reading or napping....in that case they are infringing on my little hevan which includes music. I think the only reasonable comprimise is to not play music past 10 pm.

What an anarchist point of view :-( If you are disturbing neighbors with your music, how are they possibly infringing on your rights?

My nieghbor is 70 plus years old and I am 26...it may be time for him to buy a house or go into an old age home. I am not being unreasonable with my music he just comlains any time he can hear me.

Maybe it is time for you to go buy a house.

Think about this analogy....what if I was in a band and made my living that way. Would that mean I can not practice my instrument at my home?

Well, finally you get it. If you are making a living in a band, you should rent a studio where you can play as loud as you want.

[johnu]

On the weekends anything should go- your neighbor needs to learn that he does not live in a single family home and comprimise is what is needed.

I couldn't disagree more. You are the one who needs to learn that you are not living in a single family home. Having been on the other side of the situation, an *ssh*l* neighbor blasting on their stereo or letting their dogs bark all the time can make your apartment a living hell. I would be constantly complaining to the landlord and the police if "anything should go". It doesn't make any difference if it is the weekend or daytime hours, although in most apartments, the higher background noise during daytime hours lets you make a little more noise.

I own my own house now so I don't have to deal with *ssh*l* neighbors.

[Vancouver]

I couldn't disagree more. You are the one who needs to learn that you are not living in a single family home. Having been on the other side of the situation, an *ssh*l* neighbor blasting on their stereo or letting their dogs bark all the time can make your apartment a living hell. I would be constantly complaining to the landlord and the police if "anything should go". It doesn't make any difference if it is the weekend or daytime hours, although in most apartments, the higher background noise during daytime hours lets you make a little more noise.

I own my own house now so I don't have to deal with *ssh*l* neighbors.

Thats right...you own your own home now so you don't have to deal with it. Bu when you share walls you should expect to hear your nieghbors. If I want to play the piano or even drums in my own house then I should be able to.

I used to be a landlord for a buildering with 30 appartments and when ever someone complained about a noisy heighbor I told them that if the noise isnt before 9am or after 11 pm then there is nothing I can say. I also suggested they do what you did...buy a house with no walls shared by nieghbors. If they can't afford a house...well life is tough..work harder.

[Yamaman]

Unfortunately, everyone's threshold is different; sound level can be fairly subjective. Consequently, you may very well be accommodating your neighbor and doing your best to be sensitive to him, but he may be totally unaware.

Not an easy situation. At least if you can let him know that you have been comprimising as much as you can, then what else can you really do? If it prevents him from sleeping at night- say he goes to bed earlier than 10:00, then maybe you can turn it down at that time- unless he goes to bed ridiculously early.

:confused: -Yama

[Tom Andry]

Unfortunately, everyone's threshold is different; sound level can be fairly subjective.

Not an easy situation. At least if you can let him know that you have been comprimising as much as you can, then what else can you really do? If it prevents him from sleeping at night- say he goes to bed earlier than 10:00, then maybe you can turn it down at that time- unless he goes to bed

I have to agree. I have lived next to neighbors who were extremely critical of every sound I made and others that wouldn't call the police if there was a shooting in my apartment. I think that you need to talk with your neighbor and discuss the noise problem, let them know that you are interested in working out a compromise, but also be prepared by knowing your rights (laws, apartment rules, etc.) if you neighbor is not willing to work with you. That way, when the police show up you can say, "Hey, look, this is the law, these are the complex rules, I've tried to meet them half way but they won't budge." Believe me, the cops will side with you, they sided with me!

[Redbone]

right oh, why try to accomadate a neighbor that is an a-hole and will not meet you half way. I know far to many people in this world mostly older folks who will not compromise no matter what the offerings. Therefore we must go on with our lives. I believe the law states that over 90dB is disturbing the peace and music cannot be played loudly before 8am or after 10pm in my area at least.

Live your life as you see fit, 'Cause others rarely give a damn about you.

[johnu]

right oh, why try to accomadate a neighbor that is an a-hole and will not meet you half way. I know far to many people in this world mostly older folks who will not compromise no matter what the offerings.

You are disturbing them, they aren't disturbing you. Why should they compromise? Maybe it is you who should move.

I believe the law states that over 90dB is disturbing the peace and music cannot be played loudly before 8am or after 10pm in my area at least.

Just for drill, I checked the Seattle noise ordinance. In a residential area, it looks like the limit is 55 decibels during the day, reducing to 45 for evening, early morning hours. This is measured at the destination location.

If you live in a cheaply built building with walls thinner than a Motel 6 towel, you aren't going to be able play much louder than 60 or 70 decibels and still be legal. If you live in a well insulated building with great soundproofing, you may be able to play at 90 DB and not have a problem.

[johnu]

Believe me, the cops will side with you, they sided with me!

Only if you are on the right side of the law.

[johnu]

Bu when you share walls you should expect to hear your nieghbors. If I want to play the piano or even drums in my own house then I should be able to.

Occasionally, you should expect to hear your neighbors. Hours on end at levels you can't ignore is not acceptable. As for playing the piano or drums, remember, you aren't in your own house, you are in an apartment or condo.


I used to be a landlord for a buildering with 30 appartments and when ever someone complained about a noisy heighbor I told them that if the noise isnt before 9am or after 11 pm then there is nothing I can say.

Most upscale apartment complexes will side with the quiet tenants if it is at all close for economic reasons. Loud tenants can cause any number of other tenants, who will have no problem finding another place, to leave as soon as they can, which costs the owners money.

[Az B]

Live your life as you see fit, 'Cause others rarely give a damn about you.

There's some irony in your post, but I just can't put my finger on it...

Oh yeah, do unto others...

I may be one of those "older" people you don't think much of, but I can attest to the fact that if you treat everyone like crap you will get treated like crap. I lived that way for many years and that philosophy simply doesn't stand up.

[Redbone]

Try living in the Boston area Az then give my your take on that one. Be polite in an upscale Boston suberb and they will run you over, people are like that in this highly aggressive area. ME FIRST.

Noise Ordinance? I dont know what they do in seattle but in MA I hear 100dB stereo systems in cars that shake the walls and no one does anything. Also those super loud chopper bikes way over 95dB and nothing gets done about that either. We suffer from hearing those obnouxiously loud things but have to live with it.

I say live your life with respect for your neighbor i.e don't put your stereo at reference levels when they are home, but still live your life, watch your movies and music at a decent audible level. My point is everybody has the right to live. This thread is begining to bore me.