Help requested - Differences between Panasonic plasmas?

[Adam]

Hello all,

If this is somewhere else on here, you have my apologies - I didn't find it.

I was pretty set on getting a Samsung LCD, but a lot of the talk here has brought me back around to my thoughts from last year of getting a Panasonic plasma. Thing is, I'm having trouble figuring out the differences between their product lines. I found some info last night that let me quantify the difference in number of colors on some sets, but I would like the thoughts of the informed here on the following sets (with current prices from Onecall.com):

TH-50PZ80U: $1284
TH-50PZ85U: $1599
TH-50PZ800U: $2000
TH-50PZ850U: $2330

I would be using this as my TV for over-the-air broadcast and DVD (likely Blu-ray in the future), as well as using it as a computer monitor on occasion. I would be hooking up the computer using HDMI, so I don't think that I need a dedicated PC input (which are VGA, I think).

Any thoughts/opinions/info on the differences would be most appreciated. There's a large difference in price, and I'll spend the cash if the features are worth it to me, but I just can't figure out what features are different.

Thanks!

Adam

[Adam]

O bandphan, bandphan, Wherefore Art Thou bandphan? :)

[jostenmeat]

Someone a few months ago said this:

"800U--with THX mode

850U--No THX mode but with Digital Cinema Color, Studio Ref Mode and Pro Setting plus the VieraCast."

I'll get back to you soon with anything else I find.

[jostenmeat]

More reading for you. In this thread, there are more links attached. 800u vs 850u
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1084125

More of the same
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1069253

This thread is definitely longer than the others. 80u bs 85u.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1012366&highlight=80u+85u

[Adam]

Thanks! I'll give those a read. I certainly appreciate it.

[jostenmeat]

You're welcome.

Sometimes, even the helper needs help. ;)

[Adam]

The temptation is strong today. Assuming that the Best Buy at the new shopping center down the street is open, I might just stop by today. We'll see.

The 80U at $1300 seems like the best deal to me. I figure that it saves me $1000 compared to the bleeding-edge model...money that I could spend in two or three years on a newer and better TV if I feel the need to upgrade. I'm curious if anyone disagrees with that thinking? I know that ultimately it comes down to what features and price work best for me, but I don't want to miss something obvious that I'm going to regret later. This is my first TV purchase in over 14 years.

Thanks again!

[jostenmeat]

14 years is a long time. Take your time, friend.

If you are indeed getting Bluray soon, and your other source is OTA-HD, you are basically using the two best sources available, AFAIK.

How many ft away do you sit, and how much more money are the larger sizes?

If you are considering $1284-$2330, yet can be happy with the 80 series, I wonder what 58", or even larger, would run.

Bigger is better, especially with Bluray. What's your display right now? You gotta remember that most movies come in wider aspect ratio's. And that 50" @ 16:9 just ain't nearly as large as 50" @ 3:4.

[EJ1]

Funny you mention the 80U. I was eyeing that particular display at Best Buy the other day, comparing it to the Samsung LN52A650. It's hard to beat the $1280 price tag of the Panasonic.

[Adam]

I've been contemplating a new TV for years. Said a different way...YEARS. :)

My current TV is a 27" CRT. Behold it's glory in the picture below. I watch shows in widescreen on that bad boy, so I'm thinking that a 50" set should be sufficient. I might even go with a 46" set, depending on the width and how it fits in with my other stuff (read, "doesn't hit my Ultra").

Honestly, I still really like the picture of my TV. However, I am getting new carpet very soon, will almost surely get a new TV stand at that time, and it just seems like a good time to upgrade...while my financial sphincter is still open from buying the flooring.

I sit between 10' and 12' away, depending on if I'm on the couch or sitting on the floor in front of the couch (eating).

http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa27/acwood_2007/System_after.jpg

[EJ1]

It's pretty bad (and awesome) when your subwoofer is twice the size of your display, haha. :p

[Adam]

It's pretty bad (and awesome) when your subwoofer is twice the size of your display, haha. :p

:D I got the same response when I first posted that picture last year when I got the Ultra. Makes me think that I need a bigger TV. ;)

[EJ1]

:D I got the same response when I first posted that picture last year when I got the Ultra. Makes me think that I need a bigger TV. ;)
...and then a bigger subwoofer. Vicious cycle. I think if you are 10' away, you need at least a 50", especially if you want to notice a difference in 1080p vs 720p (subjective). As far as A/V furniture, I love BDI and Salamander, but they can be pricey.

[Adam]

The 1080p is mostly for when I use it as computer monitor, to be honest.

Salamander makes some great stuff, but like you said, they can be pricey. I haven't been able to decide on what type of style I want - wood with doors, metal with a more open look, and so on.

My parents are coming around Christmas. My mom could help me out with furniture, but I want to have stuff for when they arrive. They've been here a few times with my ratty carpet and tile, so I definitely want new flooring (and, consequently, new paint...gotta paint before the new floor is in) when they arrive. A new, big TV would be a great thing, too.

[jostenmeat]

Adam, when was the last time you ever saw anyone regret going too big? I might've seen it happen once ever, not too sure.

I sit a few ft farther away than you do at 15ft, and my screen is larger than 75 square ft. And I probably experimented with viewing angle as much as anyone here. I've had a 10 yr Pana employee and a 10yr film director who just got inducted to the Director's Guild a few months ago, come over on multiple occassions. Greatest pic they've ever seen.

With FULL-SCREEN 16:9, some numbers at the closer distance of 10ft. (At 12 ft, you can be assured the numbers will significantly larger):

Your viewing angle = 20.6 degrees.

Using a 50" display:
To acheive THX recommendation (middle of theater), you need to scoot up to 5.6 ft.

To acheive SMPTE maximum recommended distance, you need to scoot up to 6.8 ft.

To acheive THX recommended maximum distance, you need to be at 7.9 ft.


Rather than 50" display, with set distance of 10ft (not 12!):
To acheive the minimum SMPTE screen size, you need a 73.8" display.

To acheive THX recommended screen size, you need a 89" display.

To acheive the same viewing angle that I have, but at 12 ft, you need a 106" display.


The above is with FULL-SCREEN 16:9. Not to mention 1.85:1, 2.35:1, 2.40:1, etc.

I'm NOT saying that my preferences are the law, but am feeding you info to make sure its been considered. Food for thought.

Then that cool graph tRiXtA made, with 20/20 vision, you will not be able to detect the benefit of 1080p vs 720p, even at 10 ft, let alone 12ft.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v471/tha_trixta/resolution2.png

[Alex2507]

Hey Adam,

I have a 50PZ77U from about 6 months ago and just had my sister buy a 50PZ85U. Her's was $1499 from Newegg shipped. Two of the things that bring the price down in that model is lack of a fancy shmancy set of speakers and the lack of computer connectivity I believe. I'm almost positive that you've done this but just in case, you can go to Panasonic's site and use the compare feature.

http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/vModelList?storeId=15001&catalogId=13401&catGroupId=75003&langId=-1&surfCategory=null&cacheProgram=11002&cachePartner=7000000000000005702&isSeo=true&orderBy=msrpalternate

Edit: Get at least the 50". Please trust me and especially my monkey on this.

[Adam]

Thanks for the info!

Adam, when was the last time you ever saw anyone regret going too big?

I can't tell you how difficult it was not to slap down some self-deprecating humor right here. :)

I hear you on the screen sizes, and I appreciate all the info. I typically watch broadcast TV, with some movies thrown in. I just think those screen sizes would be too much for me. Two years ago I visited my brother and watched his 37" widescreen from about 10' or 12' away, and I thought it was HUGE. So, I think that 50" is plenty for me. The 27" doesn't seem too small to me, but I figure that I'll enjoy something a little larger when it's time to watch a movie.

[Adam]

I'm almost positive that you've done this but just in case, you can go to Panasonic's site and use the compare feature.

http://www2.panasonic.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/vModelList?storeId=15001&catalogId=13401&catGroupId=75003&langId=-1&surfCategory=null&cacheProgram=11002&cachePartner=7000000000000005702&isSeo=true&orderBy=msrpalternate

Thanks, Alex. I did go there last night. I could see the different number of colors between the sets, as well as some different "features" being listed. I was wondering if people had already looked into these (and seen these, maybe even sold these) and knew what difference those "features" made. The links that jostenmeat provided for the AVS thread helped answer some of those questions.

[jostenmeat]

You're very welcome, of course. It must said that nothing trumps personal preference, even if I do think not being able to enjoy 1080p, at all, is a bit of a shame.

I also admit that by not going with a huge display, you save yourself from serious dog issues. :eek: :p

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/uBuJIPMvXcQ&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/uBuJIPMvXcQ&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

[Adam]

Hee, hee! Excellent video. I like how the player's name was "Johnson." :D

[Alex2507]

You already mentioned bandphan as a source for info on the Pannys. Another is annunaki. He is definately worth PM'ing. bandphan will be around after last call. :D

[wyllisx1]

Man based on these measurments 5.6' for 50" seems really close. Almost like you might actually feel the heat from the display. Or too me like sitting in the second row at the theater.

I was thinking of jumping on the plasma bandwagon on BF with the Panny 50" 720p. Some new distance measurments are in order. Based on the chart I may be able to sit at my percieved & hopefuly correct distance of 10'. If I'm any further back than that I'm out of my price range (small as it is now).

Of course there's always DLP but then I just don't have wall space for anything bigger really.

[jostenmeat]

Or too me like sitting in the second row at the theater.


Why do noobies keep saying this? :confused::confused::confused::confused:

THX recommendations are for the center of the theater.

If I had 50", at my present angle, I'd be closer than 5 ft. BTW, I've recently been entertaining a film director of 10 years, just inducted into the Director's Guild of America, and he tells me its the most beautiful pic he's ever seen.

FWIW, maybe the most prolific reviewer of BD titles at AVS forums sits at 6ft away from a 60" Kuro...

...A lot of videophiles use a certain rule of thumb of 1 ft viewing distance for every 10" of display.

Those with anamorphic setups are often using a 1:1 viewing distance:screen width ratio. That's over 50 degrees.

You should check out some dedicated home theaters, and you will see very quickly. Obviously, you haven't yet.

[bandphan]

O bandphan, bandphan, Wherefore Art Thou bandphan? :)
On this damm barstool
:D. Looks like you have some info now. Ill check in in the am when im off the harp.

[bandphan]

The temptation is strong today. Assuming that the Best Buy at the new shopping center down the street is open, I might just stop by today. We'll see.

The 80U at $1300 seems like the best deal to me. I figure that it saves me $1000 compared to the bleeding-edge model...money that I could spend in two or three years on a newer and better TV if I feel the need to upgrade. I'm curious if anyone disagrees with that thinking? I know that ultimately it comes down to what features and price work best for me, but I don't want to miss something obvious that I'm going to regret later. This is my first TV purchase in over 14 years.

Thanks again!

The 85u has the vga input for you computer display, however if you have hdmi out on your computer it might not matter( ive seen handshake issues with some video cards). The 85 also gives you more aspect control( that doesnt mean much to me, as I watch all programs as native). 24p playback on all sets (except 850 and new Q series) has been average (not many displays pass with flying colors). If the budget is there the 85 has a slight edge to the 80, moving all the way up to the 850 gives imo the most control over video adjustments, however the extra cost vs pq is hard to justify(also the audio system is upgraded, but id never use it) Motion resolution is excellent on all sets. Jostenmeats seating charts are dead on, im 6.5' from my 50, as is the bigger is better:) Going from crt to plasma, you will not miss a beat which is more than i can say for most all lcd displays. One last note the 850 is the only display the make that has a serial(rs232) interface for intergration, which shouldnt matter to most. Im shaking off the HARP and the last two washington apples, ill try to find some of test specs for ya:)

scott

[Adam]

Thanks, Scott! I appreciate the info and opinions.

I just measured, and I'm 9.5' away from my screen when I'm sitting on the floor in front of my couch. I need to add one or two feet for the plasma, because it will be closer to the wall (and thus further away from me).

I was at my friends' house last night, and they have a (I think) 36" widescreen Panasonic CRT. Thing looked pretty big to me when I was over 10' away. Granted, I'll get used to the size once I have it. I'll check out the sets at Best Buy and see what I think.

Thanks again to everyone.

[bandphan]

How far are you from the Showcase stores? You might get a heck of a deal on the liquidation:D

[adk highlander]

Hey Adam. Glad you are going to make the leap! I'm not here to offer any real help (you have bandphan for that;)) but you have my full support to spend you cash.:D

[Adam]

How far are you from the Showcase stores? You might get a heck of a deal on the liquidation:D

I've never heard of them, so I'm guessing that I'm at least three blocks away.

[bandphan]

I've never heard of them, so I'm guessing that I'm at least three blocks away.

They were part of soundadvice fl, and got aquired by tweeter during the merger...so the should still be liquidating.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=opera&rls=en&hs=kN6&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=showcase+home+theater+az&fb=1&sa=X&oi=local_group&resnum=4&ct=image

[Adam]

They were part of soundadvice fl, and got aquired by tweeter during the merger...so the should still be liquidating.

http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&client=opera&rls=en&hs=kN6&um=1&ie=UTF-8&q=showcase+home+theater+az&fb=1&sa=X&oi=local_group&resnum=4&ct=image

Ahhh, thanks. I live in Tucson, about 160 miles from Phoenix. So, I think that I'll stick with the Best Buy that's about two miles away, and the internet which is at my fingertips. :)

[wyllisx1]

Why do noobies keep saying this? :confused::confused::confused::confused:

THX recommendations are for the center of the theater.

If I had 50", at my present angle, I'd be closer than 5 ft. BTW, I've recently been entertaining a film director of 10 years, just inducted into the Director's Guild of America, and he tells me its the most beautiful pic he's ever seen.

FWIW, maybe the most prolific reviewer of BD titles at AVS forums sits at 6ft away from a 60" Kuro...

...A lot of videophiles use a certain rule of thumb of 1 ft viewing distance for every 10" of display.

Those with anamorphic setups are often using a 1:1 viewing distance:screen width ratio. That's over 50 degrees.

You should check out some dedicated home theaters, and you will see very quickly. Obviously, you haven't yet.


You're right I haven't checked any out. I have spent all my time working on the sound. Now that I have the way I want it I was going to venture into the video side. I wouldn't in any way consider myself a videophile. I'm just dipping my feet into the water.

But thanks for pointing out my ignorance.

[bandphan]

BUMP for new display pics:eek:

[Adam]

BUMP for new display pics:eek:

Hee, hee. I didn't actually make it to Best Buy yesterday. I will, just haven't yet.

My electronic purchases are on a geological timeframe. Very slow progress followed by short periods of enormous change.

[Mort Corey]

If you are near a Costco, it's worth a look. Prices should be comparable (or less) plus their return policy is much better. IIRC, Costco will also double the manufacturers warranty (to two years on the Panny).

We went from a 27" tube to a 42" PDP about five years ago and the difference was huge.....for a little while.....the display shrunk after about six months. I would have purchased a 50" unit but the cost was a little steep(er) at that time. I purchased a five year extended warranty (seemed like a good idea at that time and turned out it was) that expires in two weeks....I'm waiting for the smoke to pour out in three......then it's the 50" model and I can be amazed all over again:)

Mort

[Adam]

Well, I made it to Best Buy today. As soon as I walked through the double doors of the newly opened store down the street, I was immediately reminded of why I don't go there: the mind-numbingly boring store atmosphere and the not-quite-educated employees. Oh, well, enough of that. I got a chance to see some flat panel TVs in person. They had the 50" Panasonic 80U and 85U models on display, as well as some Samsung LCDs that I was thinking about.

Here's the thing - the Panasonics had a pretty crappy picture, IMO. Both of them, hooked up to different video feeds (one was a Blu-ray disc of Top Gun) had a lot of digital artifacts. Well, that's what I'd call it. Blockiness, pixelation. The Samsungs seemed better to me. It certainly has me rethinking my desire to switch back from LCD to plasma.

On a related note, the road ways through the shopping center that got put in down the street (a huge strip mall that really detracts from the surrounding landscape) are really poorly laid out. Made me even more upset that it got put in. Yeah, I'm bitter. Makes me feel like Tom and Dina. :)

[jostenmeat]

If one is ever checking out LCD's, I would make absolutely sure if frame interpolation is being used. Then I would read up on it. Some people love it. Some people hate it. Everyone agrees 120hz is a good thing, but the same can't be said for interpolation. People have even seen 3 footballs in the air. So if the video is slow, it'll look smooth, if the video is too fast, VP might not keep up.

My friend was raving about his parent's new LCD tv. He said he couldn't believe that the animators for Meet The Robinsons would mess the kid's shoe up when he was running. He truly believed that they "must've thought that they didn't need to care, because they underestimated the quality of today's displays". I then proceeded to educate him on frame interpolation. Backlight scanning also reduces the "scan-and-hold" blur inherent to LCD's, but this I know nothing about.

Every LCD company has their own name for interpolation. I don't know what Samsung's version is called.

I don't mind judder at 24p. If that's what the source gives me, that's what I'll take I suppose. (even if doubled to 1080/48, then displayed at 96hz in my PJ).