List of 7.1 Analog-out BD Players?

[Erin Hardison]

Is there a list, or could we quickly throw one together with help of forum members, of analog out BD players? The reason I ask is because one of the preamps I'm looking at getting doesn't do HD decoding. I've found a few of players that fit this, but just looking for some others that maybe I'm not aware of. Black Friday is coming up soon. :)

[PENG]

Not all of them can output HD codecs via the analog outs. I believe the Sony BDPS550, Panasonic DMPBD55 are among the few that can do it.

[jostenmeat]

PENG is correct. I'll put up a list that isn't quite 100.000000% complete (no 35/55), but is good enough for all intents and purposes.

Firstly, I simply recommend Panasonic BD-55 for anything less than $1,000.

I am always confused, not just here, but at other forums as well, why people even bother to choose other players! :confused: (outside of the PS3 of course). JMO! I'm in it for the performance.

http://wabqxq.bay.livefilestore.com/y1pgPNWMHfw3MXZo1gg9QzS9mVHgLdJMDo9FdwzyEwRjXgvEYJ oQx5_g_0lg_fnRbYzd78Bn-JgBUk/bdchart.png

DD "legacy", DTS "legacy", and LPCM are not included in the chart since player support is mandatory for all BD players.

Special Cases:
(F) Player requires a firmware update to enable this codec.
(L) Player outputs LFE channel -5db lower than normal when outputting PCM over HDMI (see owner's threads)
(LF) Player had "LFE bug" as (L) above. Issue was resolved with firmware update.
(U) Player can be upgraded to BD2.0 (exact method is unclear).
(H) Codec decoding is limited to HDMI only. For analog output DD or DTS is used instead.
(2) Codec decoding is limited to 2 channels (stereo) only.
(*) Output is limited to 48KHz/24bit due to hardware limitation.





From the AVS sticky
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=980672

Bonus thread for those who give a crap
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=996843

[Erin Hardison]

AWESOME! Thank you for that chart.

Yes, actually the panny is the one I'm looking at the hardest. Especially since you can get it for about $330 now. I'm hoping to pick up a good BD player on Black Friday, and instead of buying something 'to get me by' until I finish my HT room (next May/June) I figure I'd go ahead and get a nice player now. The panny seems to be a very good choice for money and the long term. If it goes to $250 on BF, I'm all on it. :)

[zumbo]

-
Fantastic list. Thanks.;)
Yamaha missing.
List doesn't mention available x-over for analog outs for each unit.
List doesn't mention dB adjustments for analog outs for each unit.
x-over and dB adjustments are a must if one plans to use the analog outs.
My Marantz BD8002 has both, and I employ them.
I still consider the analog outs pointless, and am looking to upgrade my receiver/pre-pro.

[croseiv]

Man do I detect a hint of anti- Sonyism here or what?:rolleyes: The 550 is also a good choice.:)

[jostenmeat]

Man do I detect a hint of anti- Sonyism here or what?:rolleyes: The 550 is also a good choice.:)

Not at all. I like Sony as a brand just fine.

But the Panasonic is simply better. PQ wise, or in audio flexibility. Have you read thru the Six Player Shootout I've linked here before.

Even the older, superceded Panny was better. In fact, it was the sole player to pass all HQV tests.

edit: the only ways I can see getting the Sony is in itschris' type of case.

Save $50. Looks prettier.

Otherwise, the Panny is the better player. Period.

[croseiv]

f Have you read thru the Six Player Shootout I've linked here before.

.

THe 550 was not tested.

[jostenmeat]

THe 550 was not tested.

But its absolutely identical in video. I've stated that multiple times myself, just at AH alone . . .

[jostenmeat]

Fantastic list. Thanks.;)
Yamaha missing.
List doesn't mention available x-over for analog outs for each unit.
List doesn't mention dB adjustments for analog outs for each unit.
x-over and dB adjustments are a must if one plans to use the analog outs. My Marantz BD8002 has both, and I still consider the analog outs pointless, and I employ them.

Interesting. I have to admit, I don't care so much about these things since I fell to the HDMI camp.

However, I don't know if you frequent AVS boards, but if you do, maybe try PMing the OP(s) for encouragment. For instance, you can describe your own player to them for starters...

it would help others I'm sure.

[croseiv]

I've stated that multiple times myself,


I don't doubt that at all....:o

[zumbo]

Interesting. I have to admit, I don't care so much about these things since I fell to the HDMI camp.

However, I don't know if you frequent AVS boards, but if you do, maybe try PMing the OP(s) for encouragment. For instance, you can describe your own player to them for starters...

it would help others I'm sure.

Not a member over there. Not being snotty, but my time is limited. For instance, I have to be at work in 3 hours and 45 minutes. Yet, I am still online. You can link my post if you like.

[croseiv]

About the tests; the question I have is whether or not the average viewer would even be able to detect the differences between the players tested (PQ wise)? I will say that I have been quite impressed with the PQ of the BDP-S550, not to mention the SQ (although the x over is an unknown). For me the analog outs are only an option until I get a better receiver next year some time.

[Erin Hardison]

Well, here’s a stupid one…

In my situation, I’m only going 5.1. At least for a while until I can upgrade to 7.1. It would definitely save me a bit of money doing this, if I go with separate pre/pro & amp. So, the silly question here is, if you only go 5.1, is there any issues? I would imagine you simply are not feeding signal to the rear surrounds. Correct?

[zumbo]

Well, here’s a stupid one…

In my situation, I’m only going 5.1. At least for a while until I can upgrade to 7.1. It would definitely save me a bit of money doing this, if I go with separate pre/pro & amp. So, the silly question here is, if you only go 5.1, is there any issues? I would imagine you simply are not feeding signal to the rear surrounds. Correct?

Correct. My Marantz player had a set-up option for 5.1/7.1 config. I am running 5.1 as well. But remember, on most receivers/pre-pros, m/c inputs bypass the receivers x-over(bass management), and any other auto set-up/calibration features.

For me, the downgraded DD/DTS digital coax connection works best. The sound is not as clean, but my receiver processes the audio, and sends-out the correct bass managed/calibrated audio.

[zumbo]

There are so many threads about this, I just wanted to be clear.

1) I use the m/c 5.1/7.1 inputs because I don't have HDMI on my receiver/pre-pro.

2) I prefer the digital coax connection because the m/c inputs bypass all of my settings in my receiver.

3) Another option would be HDMI receiver/pre-pro that doesn't decode the audio. My player can be set to output LPCM via HDMI, while utilizing the players bass management. It looks as though recalibration is in order for this application. I have no idea how this would compare.

4) It's just so much easier to buy a receiver/pre-pro that handles everything.

[billy p]

Hum.. trying to understand this analog fiasco, even with my new Panny(DB55 when it arrives) is there not going to be any benefit to SQ using the m/c with my 3805? I have never used the analog m/c on this receiver because I never had the need to before and will be using a 5.1 set up, so would there be any benefit with my new Panny via analog. Or am I better off getting the Panny DB35 and using its digital outs because the bass mgm is such a pain to deal with m/c? :confused:

Thanks:)

[zumbo]

Hum.. trying to understand this analog fiasco, even with my new Panny(DB55 when it arrives) is there not going to be any benefit to SQ using the m/c with my 3805? I have never used the analog m/c on this receiver because I never had the need to before and will be using a 5.1 set up, so would there be any benefit with my new Panny via analog. Or am I better off getting the Panny DB35 and using its digital outs because the bass mgm is such a pain to deal with m/c? :confused:

Thanks:)

The benefit is you will be getting the new formats.

The pain is, m/c inputs bypass everything. It basically gives the player of your choice a volume knob. The b/m and calibration is in the hands of the player. Your receiver will be nothing but a volume controller with speakers connected to it.

It's up to you on your purchase.

[zumbo]

I have not researched it, but you would want to be certain the 35 will core stream DD/DTS in place of the new audio via digital-out. It may not do this.:confused:

My Marantz BD8002 does, and that's all I have to go on.

[Erin Hardison]

after reading your posts, Zumbo, you've pretty much pushed me to look at pre/pros that can do the decoding themselves. The only one I was looking at that couldn't was a Mcintosh, and the more I look at it, the less I want to go that route. I think I may look at either going with an AIO receiver, or using a pre/pro with decoding and a separate amp.

[jostenmeat]

after reading your posts, Zumbo, you've pretty much pushed me to look at pre/pros that can do the decoding themselves. The only one I was looking at that couldn't was a Mcintosh, and the more I look at it, the less I want to go that route. I think I may look at either going with an AIO receiver, or using a pre/pro with decoding and a separate amp.

IMO, a more immediate and profound impact that can be had with an inexpensive receiver acting as pre is room correction in the time domain.

Something I doubt Mac would have, no matter the cost. Of course I don't know any better. Please feel free to surprise me.

And by going with the cheaper BDP that doesn't have m-ch outs, means that you can basically think of the pre/pro cost as being maybe $100 less.

[zumbo]

I have studied current receivers and pre-pros, and once I climb the ladder to features needed, I have just about as many BS features I don't need.

BR is all new to me, but I have decided on the new Rotel pre-pro.

Key features for me include:
None of the networking/computer, blue-tooth,i-pod,XM,Sirius BS that I just don't need.

Separate x-over settings for all speakers.

Separate x-over setting for sub.

All the latest and greatest audio/video processing and DAC's.

Price is comparable to current receivers/pre-pros with my specific needs.

http://www.rotel.com/NA/Products/ProductDetails.htm?Id=474&Tab=1&Pic=1

[Erin Hardison]

I have studied current receivers and pre-pros, and once I climb the ladder to features needed, I have just about as many BS features I don't need.

BR is all new to me, but I have decided on the new Rotel pre-pro.

Key features for me include:
None of the networking/computer, blue-tooth,i-pod,XM,Sirius BS that I just don't need.

Separate x-over settings for all speakers.

Separate x-over setting for sub.

All the latest and greatest audio/video processing and DAC's.

Price is comparable to current receivers/pre-pros with my specific needs.

http://www.rotel.com/NA/Products/ProductDetails.htm?Id=474&Tab=1&Pic=1

i'm in the same boat. I could care less for ipod, networking, etc. I just want excellent EQ (auto, or manual, but would prefer both), and the video processing.

Separately adjustable x-overs is a very big plus.
Thanks for the link.

Any others that fit this bill, that you've looked into? I'm really looking for simplicity, but also some good A/V options.

[zumbo]

i'm in the same boat. I could care less for ipod, networking, etc. I just want excellent EQ (auto, or manual, but would prefer both), and the video processing.

Separately adjustable x-overs is a very big plus.
Thanks for the link.

Any others that fit this bill, that you've looked into? I'm really looking for simplicity, but also some good A/V options.

I like the Marantz 8002 receiver. But, I have an external amp already. For just a little more, I can have the Rotel pre-pro. The Marantz does have Audyssey, and the Rotel doesn't.

The Marantz 8002 receiver doesn't up-convert to 1080p. This is another feature I don't need. It's all about what you need.
http://us.marantz.com/Products/2204.asp

There is also the Marantz 8003 pre-amp. It's more than the Rotel, and I don't need the extra features.
http://us.marantz.com/Products/2317.asp

Marantz 5002 receiver accepts LPCM via HDMI, and could save me big bucks. But, I don't know.
http://www.6ave.com/shop/product.aspx?sku=MARSR5002

[Nomo]

I missed this thread but this chart is, to me, pretty telling, although a bit over simplified, maybe.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/compare.php

[zumbo]

I missed this thread but this chart is, to me, pretty telling, although a bit over simplified, maybe.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/compare.php

What I am trying to do, is find the best way to get the most out of my Marantz BD8002 for the least amount of money.

It seems that others are trying to get the most out of decoding players as well.

What is the point of having these decoding players if there is no benefit?

I have already concluded that the 5.1/7.1 analog connection is a bunch of BS. For me, that is an undisputed fact.

[jostenmeat]

A couple of little things I read. I'll just jot such things down here when I see them. Kinda like a post-pad. :p

Pioneer players have been reported by at least one person to have a very high universal xover point, with no settings for delay, and has "edginess" to 24p as a result of Pio tweaking.

Panny BD-55 cannot output 480i over HDMI. An issue if you want to play DVDs and use outboard video processing.

^Just things I read, and for you guys to confirm. I don't care myself about things, as with analog outs, because I don't watch DVD anyways, and I prefer less VP for now (outside of the desire to correct color). :cool: :)

[bandphan]

IMO, a more immediate and profound impact that can be had with an inexpensive receiver acting as pre is room correction in the time domain.

Something I doubt Mac would have, no matter the cost.

This is very true, and we should start to see some affordable correction gear come to market within a couple of years. Even using some of the pro units seems to be an inexpensive solution to bass managment.

[jostenmeat]

This is very true, and we should start to see some affordable correction gear come to market within a couple of years.

bandphan, how do you know of this? As in stand-alones?

I was recently and briefly researching how to implement Audyssey into my 2-channel. It appears for now that getting an affordable HT receiver acting as pre/pro, to feed my Cambridge integrated (or to be replaced by 2-ch amp) was the only WTG. The alternative, for me, seemed to be the very expensive SEQ, which is too much money, and perhaps overkill for one L.P. in a compromised living room.

Thanks though, you've given me hope. :)

[bandphan]

bandphan, how do you know of this? As in stand-alones?


Thanks though, you've given me hope. :)

Stand alones:) I mentioned the audesessy unit back in another thread and cost was the prohibiting factor, since then at least 1 major player in the subwoofer market (although they do have some pretty high end speakers also) has a proto floating around with real time correction(and processing/dsp). The unit we heard was for an active 5.2 setup, and while lacking finality it showed promise as a complete solution with a target msrp around 1k.. hopefully with 2years, so dont tighten the wallet yet:D

[billy p]

I now understand the lack of control you have via analog is considered less than favorable in recent posts:(. But I finally watched my first BR movie on my s550 and I was very impressed, even the SD upconversion was better than I had hoped(having owned the oppo dv971) I'd call it comparable. However the PQ and SQ of I, Robot in DTS HDMA was un-freaking-believable:eek::D. Although I'm not sure how you can improve on the SQ of a lossless format even via analog, I felt the setting in the player when tweeking things where in vain IMO. Heh.. I now see why having a HDMI receiver has its benefits and may have moved up on my priority list;). LOL:)

[croseiv]

I now understand the lack of control you have via analog is considered less than favorable in recent posts:(. But I finally watched my first BR movie on my s550 and I was very impressed, even the SD upconversion was better than I had hoped(having owned the oppo dv971) I'd call it comparable. However the PQ and SQ of I, Robot in DTS HDMA was un-freaking-believable:eek::D. Although I'm not sure how you can improve on the SQ of a lossless format even via analog, I felt the setting in the player when tweeking things where in vain IMO. Heh.. I now see why having a HDMI receiver has its benefits and may have moved up on my priority list;). LOL:)


I agree with you. The analog out scenario is only to hold me over until I can get a HD receiver sometime next year. The S550 is a good player. Kung Fu Panda sounded fantastic (BD-True HD). Your observations about PQ and SD up conversion confirm mine.

[Alex2507]

I went grocery shopping again. :) I read an article in Sound&Vision about this player and looked it up.
It's a lot less than the $699 listed in post #2 or #3.

http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-DMP-BD55K-1080p-Blu-Ray-Player/dp/B001GAOYCI/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1226761767&sr=8-2

[billy p]

I went grocery shopping again. :) I read an article in Sound&Vision about this player and looked it up.
It's a lot less than the $699 listed in post #2 or #3.

http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-DMP-BD55K-1080p-Blu-Ray-Player/dp/B001GAOYCI/ref=pd_bbs_sr_2?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1226761767&sr=8-2

I''m picking up my Panny(ordered it before I bought the Sony) BD55 today. FWIW after installing my s550 I can't see how the 55 would better it. I'll hook it up today and decide which one to return but for the record the Sony cost 30.00 dollars less and the $30.00 isn't burning a hole in my pocket;):).
Regards, Bill:)

[allargon]

I''m picking up my Panny(ordered it before I bought the Sony) BD55 today. FWIW after installing my s550 I can't see how the 55 would better it. I'll hook it up today and decide which one to return but for the record the Sony cost 30.00 dollars less and the $30.00 isn't burning a hole in my pocket;):).
Regards, Bill:)

I don't know about the 550, but I know the 350 has a disturbingly bad omission where it won't recode DD+ and DolbyTrueHD to legacy DD or DTS over spdif for people with legacy receivers.

[croseiv]

I''m picking up my Panny(ordered it before I bought the Sony) BD55 today. FWIW after installing my s550 I can't see how the 55 would better it. I'll hook it up today and decide which one to return but for the record the Sony cost 30.00 dollars less and the $30.00 isn't burning a hole in my pocket;):).
Regards, Bill:)

Have you had a chance to try out the Panny?

[EddieG]

My Marantz BD8002 has both,

Just curious...what can the Marantz do that a player (like the bd55) can't do for so much less $$?

[allargon]

Just curious...what can the Marantz do that a player (like the bd55) can't do for so much less $$?

Besides weighing more to imply better build quality and saying Marantz ('ooooooh') rather than Panasonic ;), it has a Realta processor for better SD DVD upscaling (and possibly better Blu playback as well). It's DAC's may be better, too, for people that want to use the analog audio outputs.

[zumbo]

Just switched from a Yamaha RX-V1400 to a Z7.

There was a huge difference in the audio quality when switching from m/c input(5.1 analog) to digital coax on the 1400.(Marantz BR player source)

There is no audible difference when switching from m/c input(5.1 analog) to HDMI on the Z7. (Marantz BR player source)

I would say that when utilizing a BR players 5.1/7.1 analog outputs, the audio quality solely depends on the player.

I can't say the Marantz is better than the Panny, but I can say it's DAC's are better than the 1400's, and it's audio quality is more inline with my new Z7.

[Thunder18]

I don't know about the 550, but I know the 350 has a disturbingly bad omission where it won't recode DD+ and DolbyTrueHD to legacy DD or DTS over spdif for people with legacy receivers.

That killed the 550 for me and is the reason I ended up replacing my Panny BD10 with the BD55. Having to go into the menu everytime you watch an SD dvd and set it to ouput legacy dolby digital/dts over spdif rather than the analog multi-channels outputs was ridiculous. The Panasonics allow you to send legacy DD/DTS bitstream/PCM via spdif while sending out lossless codes via analog multi-channel at the same time. I can confirm it by merely switching between multi-channel analog and digital inputs and immediately getting a DD/DTS message on my receiver. My old Panny did this and I couldn't go back. Too much of an inconvenience. Oh, and the Sony's won't frame by frame advance from a paused stated. Not a big deal, but some seem to be very up in arms about it.

[zumbo]

Having to go into the menu everytime you watch an SD dvd and set it to ouput legacy dolby digital/dts over spdif rather than the analog multi-channels outputs was ridiculous.

What is your experience comparing the audible differences between each input, using the same dvd?

Toggling.

[billy p]

What is your experience comparing the audible differences between each input, using the same dvd?

Toggling.

1.Just used Shrek the third in SD and here are my thoughts.

I set the audio digital output on the panny to PCM. Using the m/c analog via ext in on my receiver and digital in fibre optic the analog in m/c was much more clearer, detailed and overall the sound was much more crisp IMO.
However, in bitstream the sound was less audible but if you listen closely it would appeared the digital was slightly better, but you must remember there is a pause switching back & forth!

2.Now using the BR disc the Golden Compass here is what I noticed.

There is huge difference in analog pcm over digital. The analog sounds amazing. Although in bitstream again the difference was not as much, but the DTS surround appeared again on my receiver and that was nice to see again.:cool:

I would really love to hear HD audio or lossless formats via HDMI but for now I'll just live with the analog m/c via the panny because the sound is still better than what my Denon's DAC's do in digital and thats JMO.:)

[zumbo]

Can you try a concert dvd? That's what I use.

[billy p]

Can you try a concert dvd? That's what I use.

Don't laugh, but the only one I have is Pink Floyd's Pluse and I'll give it a go later!:)