War of the Worlds (2005) DD mix is off?

[mpompey]

Has anybody compared the Dolby Digital mix with the DTS mix on the new War of the Worlds DVD? I'm hearing all this talk about how its supposed to be the new reference DVD, and how the LFE is earth shaking on this movie.

However, when I play the Dolby Digital sound mix, I have to turn my receiver close to reference (75 dB in my theatre) to get any appreciable response out of the movie. At the same time, I can play the Dolby Digital version of Batman Begins at the same volume level and my house is being rocked.

I have the two disc Collector's Edition of War of the Worlds. Is it the Dolby Digital soundmix, or my DVD that is defective? I checked all my calibration settings for a second time last night, and everything is where it is supposed to be.

Is anyone else seeing this?

MP

[BJP]

Hi mpompey, welcome to the forum!

I have the regular WOTW disc with DD and DTS. DTS is the winner. I haven't watched the whole movie yet, I've been watching/listening to all the good parts. I find that DTS is warmer, deeper and cleaner than DD on this disc.

I compared two different scenes. The heat ray and the dialog scene where Ray and that nut are talking. I first listened to it in DD and then DTS.

I must say that is sounds louder at the same volume in DTS than DD. That electronic "snap" of the heat ray is amazing in DTS.

I like my movies to have clear and intelligible dialog. I was concerned that the Ray/nut talking scene would be too quiet. It was bad in DD, but easy to understand in DTS.

I am rarely impressed with dialog/sound effects in movies, but WOTW in DTS is fabulous.

It is not a problem with the disc, it is the soundmix.

Does the Collector's Edition have DTS or just DD?

[Rik]

BJP did you have any trouble with your 3805 playing this movie? I had mine go into protect mode on a couple of the more intense scenes. I backed the volume down from -5 to -10 and it played though without anymore trouble, but this is the first movie I have had this problem with. The 3805 is driving a set of Axiom 60Ti's, a 150 center and a pair of QS8's. 60's are set to large, everything else is small. The LFE had the house really rocking, was the movie just asking too much of the 3805's on board amp? Anybody that can shed some light on this will have my gratitude. I was using the DTS track.

[rollinrocker]

Rick, just make your 3805 has room to breathe.

[Bryce_H]

We just watched the WOTW DTS tonight with my 3805 and had no problems. Sound was GREAT. I am running a set of Def Techs with the volume at -13.5 and it was loud. The Def Techs are very efficient (91 or 92).

[Rik]

Rick, just make your 3805 has room to breathe.


no back on cabinet, 5 inches to either side and 10 on top.

[Rik]

We just watched the WOTW DTS tonight with my 3805 and had no problems. Sound was GREAT. I am running a set of Def Techs with the volume at -13.5 and it was loud. The Def Techs are very efficient (91 or 92).

Def Techs have self powered sub woofers don't they?

[brian32672]

We just watched the WOTW DTS tonight with my 3805 and had no problems. Sound was GREAT. I am running a set of Def Techs with the volume at -13.5 and it was loud. The Def Techs are very efficient (91 or 92).
Hmm, what does that -13.5:confused: relate to????

You should know each receiver and where a person calibrates is different.
So your -13.5:confused: Might actually be -25 for me or -2 for someone else.
Basically at what db level are you talking about, that would be much clearer to others.
I listen to my receiver at normal listening at -28 (which is 78db with 84db peaks)
At -15 is astronomical (at about 88db with 94db peaks)
The most I have gone is -3 (which relates to about 99db with 106db peaks)
Granted anything higher is ridiculous (actually those levels (-3) are insane)
I am very certain I could easily hit 118db (but why would I????)

Anyhow, I was just curious.......
Trim #'s are actually better associated with terms of room response....
At which I use these as a basis
-2.0 L
-2.0 R
-2.0 to +2.0 C
+2.0 SL
+2.0 SR
+1.5 SBL
+1.5 SBR
-10 to -8 S

Clearly by those numbers I like a lot of surround sound, or I am sitting to close to the front mains.

[Rik]

if we both have 3805's and both have speakers with similiar ohm ratings should we not them be putting similiar strains on our receivers if we both have the volume set to the same level?

[brian32672]

if we both have 3805's and both have speakers with similiar ohm ratings should we not them be putting similiar strains on our receivers if we both have the volume set to the smae level?
Good question. Do you both have them calibrated the same??
If not we could be talking about a world of difference...............

However ohm ratings are not in play here (effiency would be)
Mine are 96db effiecent.

[Rik]

all I did was the automated setup for speaker distance. I did no manuel tweaks at all. would that give us a base line to compare "apples to apples".

[brian32672]

all I did was the automated setup for speaker distance. I did no manuel tweaks at all. would that give us a base line to compare "apples to apples".
Sorry to say, no it would not. Do you know what your speaker effiency is?
Do you know how far his mic was set at for auto calibration?
Do you know his room response?
Are you both using the same settings (speaker size, distance, level, etc?)
Manual tweaks would help to get a more flat response. (is needed, which is 100% the case)
Has he done tweaks?
Have you checked with a meter?
Ohms means nothing (relatively speaking in this case)
What size drivers?
What type of tweeters?
How many subs?
What size room (dimensions)?
About 30 other questions???

No apples to apples means nothing in this case. I am not trying to be a hard butt.
But I was just curious to what levels does he listen to.
Sorry for stepping on any toes.....

[Rik]

Brian, no need to apologize, my toes are step proof.:) I'm just trying to determine if my receiver is broken of if WOTW is just too much for any 3805 to handle with out the help of a sub at the levels I listen at. I'm gathering from your comments that the situation is a lot more complicated than what I thought. It's still under warranty, I guess I'll give Denon a call Monday.

[brian32672]

Sending a PM now......
Sorry, I did not know you were asking about problems.
I was really trying just to get an idea what the other poster's listening levels are.
Anyhow, I should be able to help. Just check your PM's....

[mfabien]

BJP did you have any trouble with your 3805 playing this movie? I had mine go into protect mode on a couple of the more intense scenes. I backed the volume down from -5 to -10 and it played though without anymore trouble, but this is the first movie I have had this problem with. The 3805 is driving a set of Axiom 60Ti's, a 150 center and a pair of QS8's. 60's are set to large, everything else is small. The LFE had the house really rocking, was the movie just asking too much of the 3805's on board amp? Anybody that can shed some light on this will have my gratitude. I was using the DTS track.

Rented that movie and it does have heavy LFE (I selected DTS). The fact that you have your Front speakers to LARGE may have caused the trouble with your amp. Don't know what sub you have but I would try setting all your speakers to SMALL and adjust the receiver's crossover to 80 or 90 Hz then playback the movie again.

[BJP]

BJP did you have any trouble with your 3805 playing this movie? I had mine go into protect mode on a couple of the more intense scenes. I backed the volume down from -5 to -10 and it played though without anymore trouble, but this is the first movie I have had this problem with. The 3805 is driving a set of Axiom 60Ti's, a 150 center and a pair of QS8's. 60's are set to large, everything else is small. The LFE had the house really rocking, was the movie just asking too much of the 3805's on board amp? Anybody that can shed some light on this will have my gratitude. I was using the DTS track.

Hi Rik, I had no problems with my receiver. All my speakers are set to small.
FL +0.0
FR +1.0
C +2.0
SL +4.0
SR +5.5
Sub -2.5

I had my volume set to -20 and it was quite loud. It got up to 95dB during the bridge scene. Your speakers are more efficient than mine with 3 of them being 6 ohm(not a biggie). Try setting your 60's to small and set the volume to -5 and see what happens:eek: .

This is such a well made soundtrack. It is the best in my collection.

[Rik]

Rented that movie and it does have heavy LFE (I selected DTS). The fact that you have your Front speakers to LARGE may have caused the trouble with your amp. Don't know what sub you have but I would try setting all your speakers to SMALL and adjust the receiver's crossover to 80 or 90 Hz then playback the movie again.


I don't have a sub yet.:( I am going to try setting the 60's to small and watch the movie again.

[brian32672]

I don't have a sub yet.:( I am going to try setting the 60's to small and watch the movie again.
Even without a sub.
That 3805 should not go into protect mode if your max listening is around 95db Peaks (which is loud).
Someone to ask about this may be Buckeyefan. He has the 3805 (granted he has a sub, I'm sure he has tried without a sub & possibly tried to get the 3805 to clip)

[Rob Babcock]

I've only tried the DTS track. The sound was pretty good. I'll likely never compare the DD to the DTS- I frankly don't think I could bear to ever sit thru that film again.

[Buckeyefan 1]

Even without a sub.
That 3805 should not go into protect mode if your max listening is around 95db Peaks (which is loud).
Someone to ask about this may be Buckeyefan. He has the 3805 (granted he has a sub, I'm sure he has tried without a sub & possibly tried to get the 3805 to clip)

I played the DTS track this morning with my RTi10' set to small, the LFE by itself (not LFE+Main), and crossed over at 80Hz. I could not turn it up past -20 on my unit. DTS is just too dynamic - didn't want to fry my speakers.

That's what you call a "hot" recorded movie. My sub was going into convulsions - so much so I recorded it on avi if anyone cares to see it. PM me with an email address. It's pretty funny. You'll need high speed internet, as it's a pretty large file.

I've never put my receiver into protect mode, but I've got it tweaked almost perfectly. WOTW is the type of flick that you need to turn up the volume for 80% of the movie, then hope you don't fry your tweeters when the dynamic scenes come forward.

[nova]

Are you guys serious???:) My 3805 had no problems with WOTW, not impressed with the soundtrack. Watched Polar Express and WOTW back to back, seems to me PE was more dynamic and had a lot more LFE than WOTW.

[Rik]

Set all speakers to small and made it though the problem scenes with no difficulty. I guess I have a good excuse to get a sub now.

[MACCA350]

Thought I'd chime in. I watched WOTW last weekend. Is sounded pretty good, had some great LFE usage going below 20Hz as the trucks drive past in the opening sequence where you first see Tom Cruise. As tripods first emerge from underground had great subsonics, and some of the distant gunfire later in the movie sounded cool.

I normally have my 3805 set at -7 for all movies
Speaker are LCR 8ohm Surrounds 6ohm, efficiency is 90db all round, levels are:
C 0.0
L -1.0
R -0.5
Sub 0.0,
Surrounds hover around -2.5

This setup gives, at the listening position, around 115db peaks. On the weekends I bump the sub up a couple of notches which gives me 120db-122db peaks(which was measured with the sub at 20% volume) I haven't measured with the volumes higher than that, but I watched Jurassic Park superbit version with the sub at 30% volume and the servo turned down to give it more leash and it must have been pushing over 125db at my seat:eek: That was loud, it had the whole house and a few of the neighbors houses shaking:D

I found the mastering of WOTW about right, now 'Underworld' was a hot mastered track, you turn the compression up on that one and even the dialog gets lowered.

cheers:)

[xboxweasel]

I too listened to the DTS soundtrack. I was bloody awsome. I have not enjoyed a movie soundtrack this much in a while. I always wondered about comparing DTS to DD. I know a lot of people prefer DTS. Me too. It has to be better since only a select few movies are released with that format. DTS also have a much higher, hence it takes up almost twice as much room on a DVD than DD.

I will have to test those scene that BJP was mentioning.

Eh brian32672, what are you using to come up with your dB readings? Are you using dedicated amplifiers at all? Can you tell me what it means when an amplifier has a "x"dB voltage gain? There are actually a lot more specs that I don't know the meaning off.

Aren't theaters set to around -85dB?

[jmgillespie]

I didn't care much for the sound I thought the bass didn't quite sound right but that was movie problem not a dvd.

[Methost]

I saw it and LOVED it. I had to listen on my crappy HTIB DD system, and it kicked my subs *** ... but I LOVED it! I can't wait to get my new system set up and watch this again. The fog-horn sounding tri-pods were just freaking me out. If my wife doesnt get this for me for christmas (dont know how she could have missed the hints) then Ill be buying it myself on the 26th.

[mfabien]

I didn't care much for the sound I thought the bass didn't quite sound right but that was movie problem not a dvd.

Not knowing the different component of your sound system, it is difficult to assess your opinion as expressed.

Member Rik, who had a problem with this movie, eventually told us that his front speakers were set to LARGE and, as a result, the power of the movie's LFE simply overwhelmed the speakers. He also said he didn't have a subwoofer. Is your case could be similar?