Microsoft Xbox 360 Details & Specs [Archive] - Audioholics Home Theater Forums

Clint DeBoer

05-13-2005, 01:15 AM

<A href="http://www.audioholics.com/news/pressreleases/Xbox360specspics.php"><IMG style="WIDTH: 56px; HEIGHT: 100px" alt=[Xbox360console21] hspace=10 src="http://www.audioholics.com/news/thumbs/Xbox360console21_th.jpg" align=left border=0></A>Wednesday, May 12, 2005 marked the day the <A href="http://www.audioholics.com/news/pressreleases/Xbox360specspics.php">Xbox 360 details & specs</A> were announced in a carefully promoted MTV 1/2 hour special hosted by Elijah Wood - possibly the world's most popular hobbit-gamer. While the 2005 release date for the Xbox 360 is set for around Christmas, everyone can whe their lips and gaze upon the specifications for the new game console. 
Aside from the next generation HD-enabled game console, Microsoft is positioning the Xbox 360 to be a progressive scan DVD player, FM/Internet radio, HTPC with music/DVR/photo support, videoconference/chat system, and file sharing tool. This appears to be everything that Microsoft has been shooting for in terms of getting the PC into the living room.[<A href="http://www.audioholics.com/news/pressreleases/Xbox360specspics.php">Check Out the Details</A>]

howie85

05-13-2005, 03:48 AM

4 Sale, one x-box slightly used...need to make room for my new one :D

Rob Babcock

05-13-2005, 06:02 AM

The MTV show was the biggest peice of fluff crap I've ever wasted my time on. No wonder I haven't tuned to that crappy network in over a decade. :mad:

Rob Babcock

05-13-2005, 06:15 AM

I hate to see it launch without a built in hard drive, although is the "flash drive" holds enough it may not be an issue. I'm not crazy about the idea of wireless controllers, either. Batteries could get expensive, and I'm dubious about the 40 hour rating they supposedly have. Hopefully interferance with other RFsignals won't be a problem...

Looks-wise, I don't care much for the industrial design. Of course, my ideal form would be a 17" wide component that you could rack up with all your other audio & HT gear.

At any rate, it's what's under the hood that counts, and it looks like the "360" will be an excellent machine. Although I suspect the P3 may crush it...Time will tell! :D

Tsunamii

05-13-2005, 09:14 AM

Finnaly it will also have a power button on the remote. No more going to the AV rack to turn it on :) Now lets see what Sony does. I have no problems with two systems :D

MBauer

05-13-2005, 10:39 AM

to my equipment rack. If it does all that it will take the place of several components I have been wanting to get and it plays games too (in HD no less)

jeffsg4mac

05-13-2005, 11:01 AM

Huh, it's a supped up Mac. Isn't that curious coming from Microshaft? I wonder If I can install OS 10.4 on it :) ?

nick_danger

05-13-2005, 11:16 AM

Here's a breakdown:

Xbox360
Full HDTV support, every game WILL support 720p/1080i widescreen as a minimum requirement (but it will still be compatible with standard TVs)

Full Dolby Digital support with increased surround sound abilities

Can read all disc formats: MP3 CDs, CDs, DVDs, CD-Rs, everything without buying anything extra to play them

Built-in media extender: it will stream MP3s, videos, and picture slideshows from your PC

MP3-player support: it has a couple USB ports on it which will allow you to transfer music to and from your Xbox to your MP3 player. You can also use your custom playlists on your MP3 player as custom soundtracks in games

Digital camera support: you can transfer pictures to and from your Xbox to do anything from watch slideshows to customize your Live homepage. Microsoft will also release an "eye-toy" camera that will allow you to put yourself in the game. Perfect Dark Zero will let you take a full body shot and use that as a skin in online multiplayer

Built-in 20GB removable/upgradable hard drive

Interchangeable front faceplate (kinda lame, but better than nothing, at least I can change it to black from the stock "iPod white")

Fully wireless controllers and wireless Xbox Live headsets. USB 2.0 ports on the front and back allow for wired controllers to be used also.

Optional remote to integrate further with Windows Media Center Edition (with remote power shutdown) Shutdown and media controls are also accessible with the controller

"Always Connected" Live interface. Every Xbox comes with Xbox Live Silver installed. It will give you access to everything Live users have except online play. Xbox Live as we know it will be expanded with deeper customization features and stat tracking in the Xbox Live Gold plan. The Xbox Live screen can be accessed at ANY time and it drops down and covers half the screen, even while playing a game, so you don't have to exit out to download content or talk to Friends.

As far as graphical abilities go, it is THE most advanced piece of gaming hardware on the block. I know specifics might not mean much to you, so take my word for it: the power and technology in the Xbox360 is beyond anything available now or even in the next year. Supposedly, Microsoft is planning on selling it for under $300, so it will either be $250 or $300, which is amazing.

Games shown on the MTV event last night:
Perfect Dark Zero looked awesome with the wide variety of weapons, 50+ online players, completely custom multiplayer characters, online co-op, online counter-op, and some stealth moves. After seeing what I saw, I'm even more convinced that it will rule.

Kameo: Rare's bastard love-child which almost made it to Xbox before being delayed for Xbox360. There was a scene of the hero charging through a field of hundreds of enemies on the back of this badass-looking unicorn. It should be a great fantasy-action game.

NBA 2K6: dude... the absolutely most insanely PERFECT human animation and photo-realistic graphics. It was unreal.

Gears of War: speaking of Unreal, this game uses the latest Unreal engine and it has the most detailed and freaky looking beasts and environments I've ever seen.

Project Gotham Racing 3: Destroys the line between realistic-looking and reality

The Darkness: creepy looking game with "sweet" written all over it

Ghost Recon 3: the most realistic-looking military shooter I've ever seen. It was a full-scale urban battle with more detail than you'd think is possible

Call of Duty 2: as real as Ghost Recon, but WWII setting.

Saint's Row: it was just a clip of a mean-looking dude crashing his car through a police baracade, I'm guessing it's a GTA knockoff. It kind of had its own look though...

EA (yawn) showed some video clips of Madden, Tiger Woods, and Need for Speed and they seemed kinda lame. Lame might not be the right word, but they were obviously rendered video rather than actual game footage.

E3 starts next week, so most likely all the remaining details will come together and a LOT more games will be shown. All I know at this point is that everything is turning out BETTER than expected.

Here's a great summation article from Tom's Hardware:
http://www.tomshardware.com/game/200505121/index.html

TeamXbox.com (http://www.teamxbox.com) has much deeper information.

Clint DeBoer

05-13-2005, 11:59 AM

bknauss

05-13-2005, 12:05 PM

The MTV show was the biggest peice of fluff crap I've ever wasted my time on. No wonder I haven't tuned to that crappy network in over a decade. :mad:

I agree whole heartedly... but I was glad to see the extremely brief shots of some of the games (especially Ghost Recon 3).

As for it looking exactly like a Mac, I will agree. And I would have no problem having a Mac... if they would have some software run on it!! Still looking for an electrical sim package that could rival even Pspice. As of a couple years ago, there was nothing. Maybe someday Mac will realize not everyone is a digital artist or musician and they will cater to a larger crowd.

nick_danger

05-13-2005, 12:18 PM

Huh, it's a supped up Mac. Isn't that curious coming from Microshaft? I wonder If I can install OS 10.4 on it :) ?
Haha, the difference being that it's more powerful than a Mac and actually has software for it! :cool:

Tsunamii

05-13-2005, 02:21 PM

I know this is OT but I couldn’t resist.

Jeffsg4mac… I love your quote…One of my favorites “The nine most terrifying words in the English language are, 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.” And “Communism works only in heaven where they don’t need it, and in hell where they already have it.”

Clint if Bill gates has anything to say about it Ipod won’t last, lol…

http://www.ipodlounge.com/index.php/news/comments/4259/

SilverMK3

05-13-2005, 02:33 PM

Apparently some people think Apple owns IBM... :) It's built on PowerPC architecture - built by IBM - not Apple. Steve Jobs is only given credit for putting the pieces together and making a nice OS - he doesn't build processors. But, hey, I understand the need to plug Apple here when they don't really have a gaming platform.

At least they seem to be holding steady in the portable MP3 market!

Isn't it funny how much Apple hated IBM in the early days, equating "Big Blue" with "Big Brother" and spending millions of dollars on marketing campains to smear IBM's name, but when Motorolla dumped Apple who'd they crawl to for their new CPUs? lol.

I wish they hadn't gone with the white color scheme, it won't match anything in my AV rack. Oh well. I guess paint will by my first mod! :p

Tsunamii

05-13-2005, 02:36 PM

"I wish they hadn't gone with the white color scheme, it won't match anything in my AV rack. Oh well. I guess paint will by my first mod!"

The face plates is detachable. There are tons of options for colors... here is a good video on it...

http://msxb.wmod.llnwd.net/a274/o2/ourcolony/TheColony_v1_750k.wmv

Clint DeBoer

05-13-2005, 04:08 PM

I.

Want.

One.

jeffsg4mac

05-13-2005, 04:59 PM

but when Motorolla dumped Apple who'd they crawl to for their new CPUs? lol.

Motorolla did not dump Apple, Motorolla is now Freescale and is still being used by Apple for G4 chips. Motorolla could not keep with Intel and AMD and IBM could. It was as simple as that. Apple has been with IBM since the PowerPC and they bought chips from both. There was no crawling back because they never left. If your going to spout anti-Apple venom, then get your facts straight first. :p

As far as software is concerned, there are some 500 titles available on apples site alone, not including freeware and shareware. There are thousands of software titles available for OS X. I don't know about any of you, but I only use about a dozen or so programs. There is always going to be some special piece of software that is only available for one platform or another that is just the nature of the industry. To say there is no software for macs is just plain ignorance of the facts.

Clint DeBoer

05-13-2005, 05:36 PM

Let's talk about the Xbox 360 now, please...

SilverMK3

05-13-2005, 06:17 PM

Heh. Sorry. You're right. The thread is titled XBOX 360 after all ;)

Anyway. I wonder if the media extender aspect of it will require you to have a Windows Media Center Edition PC, or if there will be some "server" software you can use on any Windows PC to host your video files. I've got several hundred GBs of video files that I'd love to be able to stream to my living room.

jeffsg4mac

05-13-2005, 07:49 PM

hmmm, oh yeah, Xbox. Is that what this thread was about :D It's just that incorrect mac facts always get my dander up for some reason, Kind of like Gene and cable vendors I guess. I would like to see some games in HD though, that might be very cool.

Clint DeBoer

05-13-2005, 08:13 PM

ALL games on the 360 are HD and it will be cool to see how it works as a media server. So far I am totally impressed with the video I've seen...

nick_danger

05-13-2005, 09:59 PM

Anyway. I wonder if the media extender aspect of it will require you to have a Windows Media Center Edition PC, or if there will be some "server" software you can use on any Windows PC to host your video files. I've got several hundred GBs of video files that I'd love to be able to stream to my living room.
I believe that Microsoft said "any PC", but I'm assuming they mean "any XP PC". Originally, extenders were only for MCE, like you said, but this sounds like it will stream pics/vids/mp3s from any source ranging from your iPod to a media server. Microsoft is really stressing media integration, and they have to beat out Sony in this generation, so forcing MCE would not be an ideal setup. I'm going to be an optimist and say that more than likely it will interface with media files from any location.

For me, I've already got my HTPC in the living room, so the features of Xbox360 may be lost on me, but with the wireless capabilities and the FACT that there will be an Xbox360 on every TV in the house (I share a house with a few other gamers) there will be no shortage of media streaming here.

And let's just say that MCE is required, the software is only $120 and just as easy to setup as any other version of Windows.

nick_danger

05-13-2005, 10:14 PM

I'd like to speculate on the HD playback and possibility of DVD-upscaling. There's no doubt that this console has an over-abundance of juice, so I wonder if ATI or Microsoft will include some method of DVD upconversion to HD. It only makes sense that they would, I just hope they arrive at a custom setup rather than going with the ATI DVD software (PowerDVD). They could effectively use some shaders within the hardware to add some excellent enhancement to our low-res DVDs...

Also, I'm excited to learn if the console will have HDMI or not. I'm assuming there will be a one-size-fits-all port in the rear that will allow for a wide variety of interconnects. I'm sure we'll see at LEAST DVI.

Oh yeah, I wanted to share this with you guys as well:

OK, Samsung and Microsoft have a deal going on for their in-store gaming kiosks, but there were rumors long ago that Xbox360 would truly be wireless in every sense of the word aside from the powercord. Now Microsoft worked out a custom connection with RCA televisions called V-Port (just a single-cable component video cable) for the first generation of Xbox. I'm willing to bet good money that we'll see Samsung HDTVs with a wireless connection ability for Xbox360 somewhere down the line. We've all been (at least I have) reading about the up-and-coming wireless standards and the fun toys utilizing the current 802.11a/b/g standards, so I'll just say now that a truly wireless Xbox360 may very well be a reality.

HookedOnSound

05-14-2005, 08:26 AM

Huh, it's a supped up Mac. Isn't that curious coming from Microshaft? I wonder If I can install OS 10.4 on it :) ?

If you are referring to the use of the IBM proc, although Macs use IBM procs it's not a Mac.

What's worth mentioning is that IBM chip is basically 3 processors in one, plus it's RISC based technology which is perfectly suitable for video gaming. 1 Teraflop! we're talking supercomputer horsepower!

It looks ugly though, but the fact that HD is supported should definitely shake up the gaming industry into new territory.

I personally favor Sony PS systems but, man oh man, sony has some serious competition.

I can't wait for an XBOX 360 Halo version game! :D :) :D

I switched from Nintendo to PC gaming many years ago but this would definitely lure me back in... :D

Does anybody know what the retail price shoud be?

Cygnus

05-14-2005, 01:07 PM

Does anyone know:
a) When it will be released?
b) How much it will cost?

Looks nice :) That'll be another addition to my audio/video setup when that's done!

jeffsg4mac

05-14-2005, 01:30 PM

If you are referring to the use of the IBM proc, although Macs use IBM procs it's not a Mac.

You all take things way too seriously. Did everyone miss the smiley face in my first post? I know it's NOT A MAC, DUH!!! :rolleyes:

HookedOnSound

05-14-2005, 02:28 PM

You all take things way too seriously. Did everyone miss the smiley face in my first post? I know it's NOT A MAC, DUH!!! :rolleyes:

LoL, of course it's not a MAC, it has more than ONE button! :D :)

jeffsg4mac

05-14-2005, 09:46 PM

LoL, of course it's not a MAC, it has more than ONE button! :D :)

That's funny you say that; you know what the first thing Mac users like me do when they buy a new mac? They trash that F!@%ING one button mouse and get a 4 button one. Expose and Dashboard are useless without one. Every windows user I demo Expose and Dashboard to drool and they all say how do I get my computer to do that. Of course I say easy, you replace it with a mac and OS X, except for the mouse of course :) :) :D Keep that, it's the only good part of a PC. :D

Clint DeBoer

05-14-2005, 11:10 PM

Mac is the greatest computer platform in the world. Steve Jobs is awesome. Macs kill PCs. PCs suck.

(Shhhh! - It's the only way to make a Mac person go away... can we please talk about the Xbox now - or do I have to start deleting off-topic posts?) Hint: Do not respond to this post if it's not about the Xbox.

jeffsg4mac

05-15-2005, 08:57 AM

Seriously though, it looks like a nice game machine and all but do any of you really think Sony is going to sit still on this. They are going to counter with a better machine. They may have already, I don't know I don't keep up on games and game machines. Anyone have info on Sony's next machine and how it compares to Xbox2? I am sure Sony does not want to loose their position in the gaming industry. My boys have a PS2 and we have an Xbox in the house. I never have time for either one to be honest.

p.s., for the record I hate Steve Jobs, and PC's don't suck, just most of the operating systems that run on them :p

Tsunamii

05-15-2005, 09:43 AM

Does anyone know:
a) When it will be released?
b) How much it will cost?

Looks nice :) That'll be another addition to my audio/video setup when that's done!
From what ive been told Xbox360 will for released for Thanksgiving. There will be two versions one with no HardDrive and not backwards compatable 200-300 range. The other with a HD and backwards comptable 300-400 range.

HookedOnSound

05-15-2005, 11:19 AM

Dumb question here, the specs say "Multi-channel surround sound output", so that means 5.1 right? So you can plug in a digital coax/optical cable into your receiver?

Rob Babcock

05-15-2005, 04:17 PM

I dunno what all the hype concerning MC sound is about. Every game I've ever seen for the original Xbox had DD MC sound, so what's the big deal? I'm more interested in the price, release date, and whether it will play my original 'Box games.

I love the Xbox, but I think the P3 will stomp the new 360 from a technical standpoint. As good as the 360 will be, if the new Cell processor can meet 1/2 of it's hype it's gonna be staggering. I'm honestly more excited for the Playstation 3 than the 360.

And for the record, "XBox 360" is a retarded name. ;)

HookedOnSound

05-15-2005, 09:38 PM

I posted earlier about Multi-channel support but I should have also asked how good does it sound?

I play occasionnaly with PC games and PS2 through 2 channel but I have never tried MC? any impressions?

Thanks,

Rob Babcock

05-16-2005, 01:58 AM

The sound is fantastic! I really draws you into the game- the sense of immersion is awesome, especially if you game on a 100" screen! :D It's very cool to be blasting away at The Covenant with Master Chief and hear them circling around behind you!

nick_danger

05-16-2005, 06:36 AM

From what ive been told Xbox360 will for released for Thanksgiving. There will be two versions one with no HardDrive and not backwards compatable 200-300 range. The other with a HD and backwards comptable 300-400 range.
No, that is incorrect... well, at least partially. The price has not yet been disclosed, but "sources" within Microsoft say they won't deviate from the "magic" $300 MSRP. I'll buy it even if it's more, but the target range is between $250 and $300. The release date will be this fall, most likely in time for the Thanksgiving weekend sales.

There will NOT be two versions as previously speculated, there is only one version and it will come with a 20GB removeable/upgradeable hard drive. Backward compatibility has been officially confirmed via Bill Gates in an interview with Time Magazine (Xbox360 is the cover story) where he stated that Halo 2 would be playable with HD upgrades and that Halo 3 would launch next spring to counter the release hype of Playstation 3.

About the seemingly redundant emphasis on the surround sound, apparently there is upgraded audio components in Xbox360 that make, in the words of several developers, "a startling difference". Being extremely pleased with the current Xbox's DD capabilities, I have to say that I'm intrigued. I think it has to do with the fact that Xbox360 support more effects/sources per channel than Xbox.

I used to think Xbox360 was a retarded name as well, but it has really grown on me and its allusion to a "revolution" is fitting. I kinda wish they went with its codename "Xenon", but 360 beats "NeXtbox", IMO.

Rob Babcock

05-16-2005, 07:03 AM

Thank the Gods it didn't end up "NeXtBox" or "Xbox Next"! :eek: Although, I'd be hard pressed to come up with a more tired, overworked clique than the "revolution" as applied to technology.

It would be cool if they upgraded the surround sound. As far as countering the PS3 "hype," good luck. With Bungee's track record, they'll be lucky to be ready in time to counter the PlayStation 4 hype. ;)

slmcdonald7

05-16-2005, 10:35 AM

As far as countering the PS3 "hype," good luck. With Bungee's track record, they'll be lucky to be ready in time to counter the PlayStation 4 hype. ;)

That may be true, but I have been reading about a Halo 3 release date coinciding with the PS3 release date for a while now . . .

Of course, a Halo 3 launch title with the Xbox 360 would be the coolest, ever . . .

I wasn't that much of a gamer before Halo 2 / Xbox Live stepped in and commandeered 90 of my hours per week (just kidding, slightly). If Microsoft continues to play up the on-line component of its games (and the PS3 doesn't reciprocate), the 360 could be the next big gaming system (and force me to withdraw from school). :D

Rob Babcock

05-16-2005, 04:23 PM

I suspect that all platforms will rely heavily on net connectivity, whether MS, Nintendo or Sony. I have next to no use for online gaming, myself. I virtually never use Xbox Live for any purpose other than downloads. But I can see the appeal, I guess.

nick_danger

05-17-2005, 08:44 AM

Although who knows if anything will ever take advantage of it, the possibilities are interesting. The below article certainly paints a less optimistic view of Xbox360 as competition, but keep in mind the reviewer did not see last night's Xbox360 E3 press show (which was AMAZING!). The PS3 certainly looks great on paper!

http://www.anandtech.com/printarticle.aspx?i=2417

nick_danger

05-17-2005, 08:51 AM

Regarding the surround sound, I watched the live streaming press conference last night and found out what the big deal was about 360's new multi-channel offerings. The console will support a "minimum" of 5.1. So perhaps we'll see real-time DTS, DTS-ES, DD-EX in addition to standard DD if a developer wishes to utilize it.

I just have to say to Microsoft: bravo! Click the link and watch last night's conference. I'll tell ya, they speak like they've found the Holy Grail, but I'm a believer at this point. Backwards compatibility is confirmed now, by the way, although the use of the term "best-selling" Xbox games is somewhat elusive... either intentionally or unintentionally. Not all PS1 games worked with PS2, so they might just be covering bases.

Also, the interface and compatibility with other devices is just AWESOME! Watch the whole thing if you can because there are a number of really great demos of games and features. Microsoft certainly has no problem proving how they rule the software world.

http://metahost.savvislive.com/microsoft/20050516/e3_press_20050516_300.asx

Rob Babcock

05-17-2005, 03:59 PM

Which PS1 games wouldn't work in your P2? Out of over 100 I've tried, every one worked.

Mega2000

05-17-2005, 04:37 PM

http://metahost.savvislive.com/microsoft/20050516/e3_press_20050516_300.asx

is there a download of this because the stream sucks *** and is all choppy and unwatchable

nick_danger

05-17-2005, 05:06 PM

Which PS1 games wouldn't work in your P2? Out of over 100 I've tried, every one worked.
No, I never had a problem, but there were some obscure titles that didn't work with some early BIOSes of the PS2 - at least that's what I had read.

Mega2000, that stream is as good as it gets at this point. Even the low-res stream was ****e last night with the hordes of people trying to watch it. I'm sure we won't see anything better until after E3 - unless you pay to join Gamespot Complete or some other premium E3 coverage site. I had heard that Gamespot was covering the entire show in high-def, but I lack both the will and desire to look it up myself.

Clint DeBoer

05-18-2005, 12:25 PM

<A href="http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/buyingguides/Playstation3vsXbox360.php"><IMG style="WIDTH: 90px; HEIGHT: 100px" alt=[playstation3front1] hspace=10 src="http://www.audioholics.com/news/thumbs/playstation3front1_th.jpg" align=left border=0></A>As this was the week for major gaming platform announcements at E3, including both the <A href="http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/buyingguides/Playstation3vsXbox360.php">Xbox 360 and Sony's new Playstation 3</A>, we decided to give a quick run-down of the differences and similarities between the two platforms based on the information that is now wildly circulating around the Internet. This could be considered the <A href="http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/buyingguides/Playstation3vsXbox360.php">Playstation 3 vs. Xbox 360 comparison</A> for all who are looking to make a purchase this coming year. For raw processing power, the specs seem to favor the Playstation 3 - but Microsoft's first to market approach and push for a central media center solution will be interesting to watch as consumers decide which direction to take in 2006. One thing is for sure, the face of gaming has taken yet another quantum leap and has been forever changed.[<A href="http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/buyingguides/Playstation3vsXbox360.php">Compare the Xbox 360 vs. the Playstation 3</A>]

Rock&Roll Ninja

05-18-2005, 01:43 PM

And so far neither one has announced a game I want to play, let alone pay for. :rolleyes:

HookedOnSound

05-18-2005, 02:34 PM

I am simply amazed at the technology.

But like R&R Ninja stated, there is probably only a handful of games that interest me.

I have relatives that have PS and PS2 units so if I am going to buy a console, I am leaning towards PS3 since I will probably be able to get my Brother and my Mother-in-Law (yes, that is what I said) to come over with their legacy games @ family dinners, etc.

Clint DeBoer

05-18-2005, 02:55 PM

Unreal3, Halo3, Final Fantasy XII... they all looked super awesome in the demos.

ArxFatalis

05-18-2005, 03:27 PM

Hmm... It seems like yesterday when microsoft announced their xbox and sony announced their playstation 2 . Let´s see if this time SONY delivers ,because their so called "emotion engine" back in 2000 was supposed to give life like graphics and make the SEGA dreamcast look like crap. Fast forward 5 years and we see that ps2 was nothing but hype backed up by an excellent marketing team and inflated overrated numbers...

I´ve been playing consoles since the colecovision and technology has reached a point in which raw power is not that important anymore. There won´t be significant differences between xbox 360 and ps3 ( both have similar specs) Game developers have to concentrate on new ways of playing games .... It´s not about better graphics but on delivering new "gaming experiences". Let´s see if NINTENDO with their new revolution console delivers and for the first time in years we start to play games in a different way. :)

gene

05-18-2005, 03:32 PM

And so far neither one has announced a game I want to play, let alone pay for

Agreed. Until I can get a really cool space combat Sim (preferably a Star Trek one) or a slick multi player hand to hand combat game, I will stick to Pac Man :)

Oh yea, hockey and boxing are cool too...

SilverMK3

05-18-2005, 04:19 PM

The part that I find the most interesting, from a technology-enthusiast's point of view, is the fact that all of these new consoles have embraced the multi-core CPU idea. In order for an application (game) to take advantage of those multiple cores, it has to be programmed in such a way that every task is divided into "threads" that execute simultaneously and in parallel. Its a completely different way of designing software and it hasn't really been used in game programming at all.

In the PC world, for example, the only multithreaded apps are databases, graphics, and video software; games have almost exclusively been designed to work with only one CPU.

AMD, for example, has planned their CPU roadmap behind the following Idea:
- Athlon FX: extremely high clock speed "gamer" cpu
- Athlon X2: dual-core medium clock speed "workstation" cpu
- Athlon 64: medium to high clock speed "consumer" cpu
- Sempron: low clock speed "budget" cpu

Obviously they didn't consider that all of the console games are going to be multicored/multithreaded, possibly revolutionizing game design across all platforms... Its going to be an exciting time in the gaming world for the next few years. A complete paradigm shift! I can't wait :D

Clint DeBoer

05-18-2005, 05:48 PM

Oh yea, hockey and boxing are cool too...You should check out the boxing demo shown in the Sony Playstation3 E3 Press conference. Insane physics.

slmcdonald7

05-18-2005, 07:50 PM

I have next to no use for online gaming, myself. I virtually never use Xbox Live for any purpose other than downloads. But I can see the appeal, I guess.

You should really try Halo 2 on-line. It absolutely changed the way I think about video games. I have no doubt that the next big thing in console video gaming will be internet connectivity. For that reason alone, I will probably pick up an Xbox 360 rather than a PS3, unless the PS3 will support similar on-line gaming features.

As this was the week for major gaming platform announcements at E3, including both the Xbox 360 and Sony's new Playstation 3, we decided to give a quick run-down of the differences and similarities between the two platforms based on the information that is now wildly circulating around the Internet. This could be considered the Playstation 3 vs. Xbox 360 comparison for all who are looking to make a purchase this coming year. For raw processing power, the specs seem to favor the Playstation 3 - but Microsoft's first to market approach and push for a central media center solution will be interesting to watch as consumers decide which direction to take in 2006. One thing is for sure, the face of gaming has taken yet another quantum leap and has been forever changed.

[Compare the Xbox 360 vs. the Playstation 3]

Kudos to Audioholics for putting together such a helpful guide. Nice work guys!

nick_danger

05-19-2005, 11:18 AM

Interview with Xbox360 VP Todd Holmdahl, Hardware:

http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1558,1817031,00.asp

Confirms the following:
Pregressive-scan DVD playback, but no upconversion. Lame.
NO 1080p support. Lame.
NO DVI or HDMI. WAY Lame.
Wi-Fi is not included, but will be supported from day one. Read: "wifi adapter sold seperately" 802.11a, b, g... Kinda lame...
Much quieter than Xbox1. Sweet
All footage so far is from Alpha kits, which are operating at 30-40% of 360's final power. Way sweet!

I just have to stop now and reiterate my complete and UTTER disappointment in Microsoft for not supplying DVI or HDMI output on this device. Component video doesnt' "suck", per se, but it lacks the crispness and rock-steady refresh abilities of DVI. I'm disillusioned because Microsoft says this is the "HD era", but they are only complying with the most basic of connections and not supporting 1080p is such a lame move. I take back what I said regarding 360 games looking better in the long run, PS3 will probably evenutually beat out 360 in appearence. They have an advantage by just supporting HDMI connectors! A multi-platform 720p game will probably wind up having better contrast, color, and crispness JUST because of that. Nice move MS...

It should be noted that there's still a good 6 months before 360 hits shelves, so many thing can and probably will change, but I hope Microsoft gets on the ball with DVI or HDMI. If you expect to have a console that lasts 5+ years, you HAVE to offer future-proof technology.

Also, it turns out that the majority of the "demos" unveiled in the PS3 camp were pre-rendered FMV sequences not done on PS3 hardware, so the chances of PS3 games looking like what we've seen thus far will be remote - at least for some time.

Rob Babcock

05-20-2005, 01:50 AM

The new PS3 has not only HDMI outputs, but will drive two monitors with a full 1080P output! :eek: As I suspected, it's confirmed that the PS3 will play the 10,000 PSX & PS2 games. It's also twice as powerful (2 teraflops vs the 1 TF of the Box2), and supports 7 wireless controllers simultaneously. It looks like in pure horsepower, the new Box will get a mudhole stomped in its arse ( 3 x 3.2 gig procs in the 'box vs 7 x 3.2 procs combined in the Cell), but I'm sure it won't matter- both will look great.

It's also confirmed now that both the PS3 and the Nintendo Revolution will be potent internet portals, too. I normally don't have much respect for Nintendo, but in a move that verges on brilliant, their new machine will be a "virtual console" that will allow you to play thousands of old classic SNES, N64 and even NES games! Hopefully Shingen the Ruler! :D Plus, it's going to be backwards compatible with the GameCube. That oughta inspire sales somewhat. Processor-wise, it's a joke compared to the Sony & MS models, but it should suffice for the soft-core gamers that buy Nintendo games.

nick_danger

05-20-2005, 03:25 PM

I don't really feel like getting into an overly deep technical discussion, but the PS3 numbers are highly over-inflated. The 360 has three 3.2GHz PPE cores. The PS3 has one 3.2GHz PPE core with seven SPEs (and one redundant SPE). The 2 TFLOPS number for the PS3 is a misnomer as well as it assumes only single-precision calculations, which are often error prone. When it comes to the application of the Cell within the bounds of producing game graphics, A.I, audio, physics, etc, the Cell and GPU must produce double-precision calculations which results in a 10:1 hit in performance. So the realistic output of the PS3 is reduced significantly.

The 2 TFLOPS number is actually two-fold: 1.8 TFLOPS for the nVidia GPU and .2 TFLOPS for the Cell. But that claimed 256 GFLOPS bandwidth within the Cell is realistically only 25 GFLOPS in application. You'll notice that the actual DP performance of the Cell matches nearly perfectly with the memory bandwidth of the console: ~25GB/sec. Coincidence? I think not. This is why Sony is renound for inflating their numbers.

The only company worse than Sony for inflating numbers is nVidia, so they make a good pairing. When it comes down to the actual graphic system, Xbox360 has the upper hand. The nVidia chip is a rather conventional design for a console, much like what they supplied for Xbox1, but of course NOTHING like Xbox1. It's much more powerful. The GPU in both consoles tap out at around 25-30GB/sec in bandwidth, but the ATI chip has direct access to whatever amount of the 512MB of system memory the CPU isn't using while the nVidia chip is restricted to 256MB. Both use GDDR3 at 700MHz so the ATI GPU has more headroom - not that it will necessarily need it.

The secret to what I believe will be why the 360 will look better than the PS3 in most, if not all games, is the embedded 10MB EDRAM tied directly to the GPU core. It provides the console with the ability to do 4X anti-aliasing on multisampled pixels at a rate of 256GB/sec with ZERO performance hit on the CPU or the rest of the GPU. These added effects and enhancements really take a toll on performance, so to get them "for free" makes a huge difference in application. This means that the console is free to expend all the power that would normally be used to give the game visual polish on other things like A.I, sound, physics, you name it.

As for actual graphic output, the result remain to be seen. Support for dual 1080p displays does not mean it will ever actually be utilized. Considering the majority of content shown at the PS3 press conference was not actual gameplay footage, but CGI, I'm certainly hesitant to buy into any of PS3s hype. Even if the final products show PS3 with a marginal hardware advantage, it will be very hard to beat 360's friendly user interface, online capabilities, and Microsoft's industry-leading developer support.

no man

05-20-2005, 04:27 PM

alright...i'm no fan of any particular consle, but currently i find the xbox 360 more attractive than the others. Firstly, Nintendo's new thing is off my list because they totaly blew the gamecube out of proportion, and sucked me into a trap. Play Station3 well.. i'm not sure because the points listed before really deflate it. The main reason i want the new x-box is because...hopefully there will be another Halo game :D. Also because i can trust the the online will be worthwhile unlike Nintendo's Gamecube, which i mistakenly bought. :mad: I suppose its more of a trust thing. Microsofts been really obsessed with the Xbox and have been realesing less computer games, and more xbox game...if this trend continues...i want to be prepared...also because my computer (compared to my friends costom made computer) is a total piece of crap and consle game are more fun because they dont lag as much (unless maybe you're playing online). In my opinion, ps3 will be kill and its grave shal be danced upon..and its overinflated numbers and the xbox360 will prevail.

(xbox360 will be able to support 720p and 1080i resolution in 16:9 or normal...i dont know what you've heard..but go check the site out..its under the paragraph titled "games" and its also found in the table-High-Definition Game Support section
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/xbox360/factsheet.htm )

no man

05-20-2005, 04:30 PM

:confused: Can anyone help me find the price and release date for the xbox360 (canada)??? :confused:

nick_danger

05-20-2005, 05:30 PM

:confused: Can anyone help me find the price and release date for the xbox360 (canada)??? :confused:
A couple things:

Xbox360 supports 720p and 1080i, but it doesn't support 1080p like the PS3 does. On top of that, PS3 supports DUAL 1080p output. That's certainly a "wow factor" selling point, even though I don't have two 1080p displays side-by-side.

Xbox360 pricing and official release date is still unknown. The underground is claiming that they are sticking to the standard $300 pricepoint to maximize sales. Microsoft is going for an unprecidented worlwide release, so Japan, North America (that includes Canada, just in case you didn't learn that in Canada-school ;) ), and Europe will get them all within the same time-frame: November.

no man

05-20-2005, 07:05 PM

whats the difference between 1080i and 1080p? and i have no use for two screens, i have 2 standard tvs and if i get it, it will use one of them. I know/knew about the planned worldwide release, but all i knew was in the fall/winter sometime. Thanks for the info.

no man

05-20-2005, 07:10 PM

Just out of curiosity..(this is open to anyone)..which consle would you get and why (keep it breif please)?

Mega2000

05-20-2005, 08:37 PM

i would get the xbox 360 for 2 reasons...

1. i have an xbox now and if it is backwards compatible i won't have to keep my old xbox
2. there is a power button on the controller so my lazy a$$ doesn't have to get up to turn it off.

speaking of xbox 360, they have one of those "free xbox 360" sites
http://www.Free360XBOX.com (http://www.Free360XBOX.com/?r=18445027)

no man

05-20-2005, 10:57 PM

i'd too go for xbox 360 as i've said before because i find it the best among the three

no man

05-21-2005, 01:16 AM

whats the difference between 1080i and 1080p?!

Rob Babcock

05-21-2005, 01:43 AM

"i" is interlaced and "p" means progressive.

At any rate, I do think the P3 will likely sport graphics significantly superior to the 360, but time will tell. Naturally not everyone will have a rig that can do justice to it, including the twin monitors, but that opens the doors to some amazing possibilities. I too don't want to get into a long technical detail, but deeper investigation does show the superiority of the new Sony machine. Even so, both will be fantastic. To be honest, if graphics never got much better than the current 'Box it wouldn't bother me.

WmAx

05-21-2005, 12:53 PM

It's also twice as powerful (2 teraflops vs the 1 TF of the Box2), and supports 7 wireless controllers simultaneously. It looks like in pure horsepower, the new Box will get a mudhole stomped in its arse ( 3 x 3.2 gig procs in the 'box vs 7 x 3.2 procs combined in the Cell), but I'm sure it won't matter- both will look great.

Caution: I know little about this subject -- my response is an attempt to socialize. :)

1. The topology used by Sony in their game console computers such as PS2 and the upcoming PS3 is so different as to be very difficult to compare with any basic specifications from other topologies. At this time, probably only Sony and some game developers know how potentially powerful the PS3 system really is, but they will never tell. Regardless of how potentially powerful it may be, refer to (2).

2. If Sony's PS2 is an example, then Sony will produce a processor which it will not matter how much potential power it will have, because the programming will be radically different/complicated compared to others that most companies will only half-*** the game graphics and physics. Looking at PS2 games, only a handful(usually by SquareSoft - and even them on a few games) achieved really nice looking graphics on the PS2. On the flipside, it seemed rather easy for companies to get nice looking graphics on the Xbox.

-Chris

no man

05-21-2005, 01:29 PM

Now I dont know all that much about playstation, but for the p3 will it have live chat, i mean during games but no to the people you are playing with...say you have a friend in a different game that you want to talk to. I'm pretty sure that you can do that on xbox (and xbox360-probably) but i've got a gamecube so...i wouldnt know. Theres a really small chance that id get the revolution unless nintendo sticks an ethernet port on it and releases fully online games for it (like counterstrike :D ) and if its got a headset and stuff like xbox...then ill consider it. Probably the main influence might (might) be my friends...because...whats online play if you dont have anyone to play with (that you know i mean). The main thing that discourages me from all of them is that what if there is a glitch in the first couple months and they re-release it...will they recall all their units or am i going to have to fork over another 300 for another one (didnt xbox have this problem when it game out?? they tended to crash alot?? and ps2 re-release another one-not the skinny new one that you have to constantly unplug because they took that damn cooler out-one with a better graphic card or something...it had some wierd yellow sticker?) the gamecube didnt have these problem..and thats why i got it, but...its a long wait...i think the real battle between these systems will be around the october/november period.

Zer0beaT

05-22-2005, 11:07 PM

I'm already sold on the 360.

I think it looks awesome and I love the controller and all the new features they've thought up. Just about everything they've come up with is to benefit the overall gaming experience. They've also seemed to round out their future game library alot more this time with more RPG's and fighting games, add to that Halo, Forza (awesome btw!), Fable, Perfect Dark Zero, Gears of War, Project Gotham Racing etc. etc. etc.

There's also this little game called Elder Scrolls 4 Oblivion coming out on Xbox 360, which I must own and play way too much of. Elder Scrolls 3 Morrowind is my favorite game of all time so....Xbox 360 here I come! :D

The PS3 is impressive on paper, but all these computer hardware tech sites seem to be actually giving the edge in power to the 360 now, though I don't understand the tech-spec side of things, I put alot more trust in unbiased hardware tech sites than Sony execs and PR. The PS3 controller is not something that looks comfortable to play either, and that's a major turnoff for a console. I don't understand why it doesn't have triggers and the skewed analog sticks like the Xbox controllers, which is absolutley perfect especially for FPS and racing games. But oh well.

Some things I hope for the 360 to improve before it launches though is a dedicated optical audio output port on the back, and support for DVI and HDMI output (though I assumed you would be able to buy a "A/V pack" type thing that would have DVI or HDMI output, purchased seperately?) If it's that the 360 can't support DVI/HDMI output through its proprietary plug then that's lame.

The Revolution is intersting, though little is known, but damn I want one just to play Gamecube games that I've missed out on, and more importantly the entire Nintendo backlog of NES, SNES, and N64 titles! I'll definately be picking up a Revolution if the price is right.

Zer0beaT

05-22-2005, 11:16 PM

How many people own not one (there's few enough of these), but two HDTV's capable of 1080p? That's all I'm wondering.

And yeah, it's going to require that developers actually program their games for 1080p, which I don't see happening very often considering game development costs are already going to be going up alot.

But it is a cool feature, and I would love to have the financial ability to take advatage of that :)

Sony is really throwing alot of expensive technology into the PS3 that the vast majority of people won't even be able to use. I'm just wondering how they're going to keep the cost down?

BMXTRIX

05-23-2005, 01:11 AM

Better yet - How many TVs not only display 1080p but ACCEPT 1080p on the input?

Knowing that the Sharp does not - and there are only a few projectors I know of that do.

Maybe some of the 23" 1920x1200 PC monitors?

Gotta say though, for head-to-head competition, the idea of a single box running really high resolution to two monitors in a room sounds really cool. No more split screen and getting confused. Just your own dedicated screen and your opponents own dedicated screen.

Catdaddy

05-23-2005, 03:04 AM

By this time next year, there should be more 1080p sets.

Id bet there already is a DLP chip that does 1080p but until recently why would Texas Instruments have wanted to push them out. More people to buy 720p systems now who will buy 1080p systems too, sooner or later.

Ive had my Sharp XV-Z12000 for only 1.5 years now, but id be tempted to get a 1080p DLP projector if Sharp came out with one.

no man

05-23-2005, 04:11 PM

I personally feel that sony's waisting their money on the dual 1080p output...not many people have TWO of em...the majority of people who own a tv that can support it only have one. and as said before the PS3's controlls are alll skrewed up...they look like a gayass boomarang...now im not all that into tv (which is proven by the fact that ive only got two standard tvs-20" and a 28"-they 28" gets the xbox (of cource..)) but once i get my box that'll probably change. Although there may be a growing popularity for 1080p i think it will be more emphisized for the xbox 3 or whatever (the next next generation of gaming consoles) by then i think 1080p will be more popular and there may be somwthing better (2160p possibly???time will tell...) i think that microsoft should make the box support 1080p but...then again i wont care...actually i think its good the way it is...so what if PS3 has dual output...i doubt people will drag both their 1080p tv's in the same room just to play sum game...ps is more for sport games as ive noticed...more e-t ratings....anyway i think its awsome that the xbox will be able to hook up with your computer...ill be looking forward to that....ill need a long cable tho...two rooms down to it...hmm ill just drill a hole thu the wall so its all good

no man

05-23-2005, 04:13 PM

my polls show:
Xbox360: 8
PS3: 2
Revolution: 1

no man

05-24-2005, 07:29 PM

Xbox360: 15
PS3: 11
Rev.: 2

nick_danger

05-26-2005, 09:32 AM

I'm for sure getting an Xbox360, but only because I'm so sold on the current 'box. While I absolutely despise Halo 2 for crippling the gameplay mechanics of the first Halo, the Halo franchise along with Microsoft's ownership of Rare is all I need to stay loyal. Knowing that Ninja Gaiden 2 is 360 bound along with other Team Ninja games is a wonderful bonus.

With Xbox, there were only a handful of titles worth getting that were exclusive to other consoles. All multiplatform titles looked and sounded better on Xbox as well. The few games that I wanted to play from other systems I didn't have time to play, so buying those consoles was out of the question. I've really become a one-console man. I used to do the whole A/V switchbox thing with five different consoles, but I'm all about reducing clutter... and the 360 aims to please.

The new GUI looks amazing and there's just no way around it, Live is the greatest online attraction since eBay (and audioholics.com </brownnose>). Combined with all its multimedia potential, it is THE toy to get this Christmas.

no man: Xbox360 supports in-game and out of game video and voice chat along with text messaging. Camera sold seperately.

no man

05-26-2005, 06:26 PM

I've just got one more question (new ones will probably arise later..) that being will xbox live be used for the xbox 360 or will it be seperate because some of my friends (who own xbox and xbox live) won't be getting xbox 360 immediately...so what i'm saying is...will i be able to chat with them or no?

nick_danger

05-27-2005, 09:22 AM

Xbox Live is sort of independent of whether you're on Xbox or Xbox360. Obviously videochat will only be for Xbox360 along with the more advanced features like "gamercard" "achievements" and such. If you are playing an online game (either an Xbox game or 360 game) you can send invites to your friends along with text or voice messages and vice versa. So let's say I don't have an Xbox360 and I'm playing Crimson Skies on my Xbox. You could be playing Perfect Dark Zero and send me an invite with the voice message of "Hey Nick, you suck because you don't have a 360! Neener, neener, neener!" You could also put in Crimson Skies into you Xbox360 and we could play and chat together, no prob.

So basically, Live doesn't change. My current Live account will work whether I'm using my Xbox or Xbox360.

It's important to note that every Xbox360 comes with Xbox Live built in. The ONLY thing you need to be a subscriber for is actual online play. Every other feature of Live is available to you out of the box... assuming you have broadband... or if you have dial-up and are clever.